A Kinetic Energy Idea

[Thunderdog]

Quote from nitro:

...The point is that people reason by analogy from exact sciences to the less exact sciences. You can object that human behavior is not a science at all, but I argue that a mass of humans acting as agents on a large scale behave very much like a physical system - an emergent one. Not exactly, but trading is horseshoes and hand grenades on a first approximation...

Okay, I suppose we can find some common ground here, since you are at least assuming a meaningful fudge factor when transferring concepts from the physical sciences to the social sciences.

In trading, I think we all try to play up the strengths that we have to our advantage. And so, I'll leave you guys to it since it makes little sense for a non-scientist like me to try and play your game. Perhaps the most important thing I learned in business school was to break a problem down into its simplest components. And so, that is how I approach market action. To each his own, eh?

 

[MAESTRO]

Quote from alex.samant:

how weird, needing an indicator and all this science for something that the eye can see pretty clear and the brain can interpret almost without flaw.... hm.. makes you wonder.

It's not the point. Why do you need a speedometer in your car if you can see the speed of your car with your naked eye? Well, there is a compelling reason for that: - it allows you to keep your eyes on the road instead trying to count how many electrical polls you passed in a minute of time. That is why you have a cockpit on the plane, helicopter, boat etc. It summarizes the info for you in a concise, easy to process by your cortex format. I could explain more, but I think you got the picture. But, thank you for your participating; I enjoy all sorts of opinions.

 

[MAESTRO]

Quote from Thunderdog:

Okay, I suppose we can find some common ground here, since you are at least assuming a meaningful fudge factor when transferring concepts from the physical sciences to the social sciences.

In trading, I think we all try to play up the strengths that we have to our advantage. And so, I'll leave you guys to it since it makes little sense for a non-scientist like me to try and play your game. Perhaps the most important thing I learned in business school was to break a problem down into its simplest components. And so, that is how I approach market action. To each his own, eh?

Scientists by them selves would never come up with anything practical unless they collaborate with Practitioners and listen to their opinions. When I was in the Air Force I was involved for many years in the cockpit design for all sorts of vehicles including orbit stations. The lesson I learned was: "Listen to the pilots!" Sometimes they are not able to formulate their feelings but they are the ones who fly the plane! As a mathematical psychologist I enjoy people and respect their thoughts. Every person is the endless universe; you just need to know how to explore it!

 

[alex.samant]

MAESTRO,

When driving a car you don't keep your eyes on the speedometer... It's pretty dangerous. You need to pay attention to other things...

 

[MAESTRO]

Quote from alex.samant:

MAESTRO,

When driving a car you don't keep your eyes on the speedometer... It's pretty dangerous. You need to pay attention to other things...

So, the next time a policeman stops you for speeding you say to him "When driving a car you don't keep your eyes on the speedometer... It's pretty dangerous. You need to pay attention to other things..." see what he says to it.

 

[alex.samant]

ok, i won't argue anymore, but you should try driving and looking at the speedometer all the time, see where it gets you. I hope you see the trees, people, other cars, etc

my own personal opinion is that indicators are developed by people out of fear or prejudice, and that keeps them from interpreting price action on their own.... it's like you feel you are not prepared to give a decent opinion on supply and demand and feel that a mathematical formula will do better than you.

Considering that trading is mass psychology and price action is the trail it leaves behind, it's pretty weird to treat it like an isolated natural phenomenon.

 

[MAESTRO]

Quote from alex.samant:

ok, i won't argue anymore, but you should try driving and looking at the speedometer all the time, see where it gets you. I hope you see the trees, people, other cars, etc

my own personal opinion is that indicators are developed by people out of fear or prejudice, and that keeps them from interpreting price action on their own.... it's like you feel you are not prepared to give a decent opinion on supply and demand and feel that a mathematical formula will do better than you.

Considering that trading is mass psychology and price action is the trail it leaves behind, it's pretty weird to treat it like an isolated natural phenomenon.

No, please, I want you to argue. It's healthy for everybody! The truth is born in disputes! (I forgot who said it, somebody famous). But to continue our discussion I would like to ask you a question: - Do you use charts in your trading? If yes then would you agree that a chart it self is a form of an indicator?

 

[alex.samant]

i use charts and i don't think a chart is an indicator (and i wouldn't want to go into semantics).

a chart with only price shows the history of price over a period of time. that's it.

it's the most basic level of visualizing where price action was right up to the present moment.

an indicator (or study), as accepted by the trading community is the interpretation of price action using a certain formula. it's a "translation" of price action.

the main idea here is that YOU DON'T NEED A TRANSLATION.

YOU NEED TO SPEAK THE LANGUAGE OF PRICE ACTION.

just as true as in all languages.

 

[MAESTRO]

Quote from alex.samant:

i use charts and i don't think a chart is an indicator (and i wouldn't want to go into semantics).

a chart with only price shows the history of price over a period of time. that's it.

it's the most basic level of visualizing where price action was right up to the present moment.

an indicator (or study), as accepted by the trading community is the interpretation of price action using a certain formula. it's a "translation" of price action.

the main idea here is that YOU DON'T NEED A TRANSLATION.

YOU NEED TO SPEAK THE LANGUAGE OF PRICE ACTION.


just as true as in all languages.

Ok, why don't you then read the tape? It also has a visualization of the price vs. time. One could argue that the tape is "the most basic level of visualizing where price action was right up to the present moment". But yet you prefer chart! Have you asked your self why? May be it because it uses a better format of representing the same data that allows you to process it better, faster and put less strain on your cortex? Also, there are hundreds of the chart's varieties and time frames that they use. So, therefore there is no difference between a moving average on your chart and the chart it self. Don't you agree?

 

[alex.samant]

a chart and the tape are pretty much the same thing because both things output PRICE as a value.

any other study outputs an INTEGER/BOOLEAN OP/etc. which is not price....

think about it...