Zen, Yoga, Meditation and Trading

Quote from trader28:

I prefer the dark arts, there's nothing like a really good blood sacrifice to start the day and get your mind focused on trading
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Chickens? Goats? Maidens? :D
 
Here is a very simple take on meditation.

First of all, sit very quietly; do not force yourself to sit quietly, but sit or lie down quietly without force of any kind. Do you understand? Then watch your thinking. Watch what you are thinking about. You find you are thinking about your shoes, your saris, what you are going to say, the bird outside to which you listen; follow such thoughts and enquire why each thought arises. Do not try to change your thinking. See why certain thoughts arise in your mind so that you begin to understand the meaning of every thought and feeling without any enforcement. And when a thought arises, do not condemn it, do not say it is right, it is wrong, it is good, it is bad. Just watch it, so that you begin to have a perception, a consciousness which is active in seeing every kind of thought, every kind of feeling. You will know every hidden secret thought, every hidden motive, every feeling, without distortion, without saying it is right, wrong, good or bad. When you look, when you go into thought very very deeply, your mind becomes extraordinarily subtle, alive. No part of the mind is asleep. The mind is completely awake.
That is merely the foundation. Then your mind is very quiet. Your whole being becomes very still. Then go through that stillness, deeper, further – that whole process is meditation. Meditation is not to sit in a corner repeating a lot of words; or to think of a picture and go into some wild, ecstatic imaginings.
To understand the whole process of your thinking and feeling is to be free from all thought, to be free from all feeling so that your mind, your whole being becomes very quite. And that is also part of life and with that quietness, you can look at the tree, you can look at people, you can look at the sky and the stars. That is the beauty of life.
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http://www.jkrishnamurti.org/
 
Qu.: "trading (derivatives/fx) is a zero-sum game, so doesn't that mean I won't be creating value to the society?"

Qu.: "Isn't pain being caused to someone, somewhere, by the act of me being a fascilitator in the whole trading process?"

Despite the fact that the counterparty willingly takes on that risk and I am providing liquidity for a market to function properly, nevertheless I am indirectly causing pain to "the other side" for my benefit (when putting on a winning trade) and the laws of karma I feel have some bearing in this matter.

The way I justify trading in a zero sum environment is by thinking that most of the time banks are on the other side of my trades (I trade fx mainly) and I have plans for service type projects in future. This type of "Robin Hood" mentality does not mean that someone is not suffering at my expence when I put on a profitable trade, so the only way around that is to use a particular type of meditational technique whereby I internally repeat a mantra and simultaneously feel that "all is Brahma" when I click the mouse button to put on/take off a position. In effect I am surrendering the fruit of the action to the supreme (even though the profits end up in "my" account), because I am giving away the "karmic ownership" of that action (the trade) and hence not having to undergo the reaction by doing this technique.

Thus, it is no longer my karmic problem and the cash is now "laundered :) " In effect, I protect myself from the karmic implications of cause/effect (causing pain to someone/pain coming back to me in the future) by this technique. I feel that my soul does not want to take on extra karma (by putting on a trade: winning or losing both have karmic implications), hence the need to deflect the karma due from the work that I do back out into the Cosmos.

By doing so it's not in my juristiction anymore. Important point this actually because people don't realise that a major obstacle to making it big is the unit soul protecting itself from taking on more "karmic baggage". Meditation speeds up the process of "burning" the reactions of prior karmic events (just like paying back a "loan" taken in this life or in prior lives), so too, we don't want to load that karmic baggage up anymore. "Moksa" or spiritual enlightenment means just that, lightening up the karmic reaction account to zero (=freedom). No more reactions which cause rebirth in order for those reactions to be undergone = merger back into true state of "pure soul" (bliss).
 
Quote from NZDSPeCIALISt:

Qu.: "trading (derivatives/fx) is a zero-sum game, so doesn't that mean I won't be creating value to the society?"

Qu.: "Isn't pain being caused to someone, somewhere, by the act of me being a fascilitator in the whole trading process?"

Despite the fact that the counterparty willingly takes on that risk and I am providing liquidity for a market to function properly, nevertheless I am indirectly causing pain to "the other side" for my benefit (when putting on a winning trade) and the laws of karma I feel have some bearing in this matter.

The way I justify trading in a zero sum environment is by thinking that most of the time banks are on the other side of my trades (I trade fx mainly) and I have plans for service type projects in future. This type of "Robin Hood" mentality does not mean that someone is not suffering at my expence when I put on a profitable trade - so the only way around that is to use a particular type of meditational technique whereby I internally repeat a mantra and simultaneously feel that "all is Brahma" when I click the mouse button to put on/take off a position. In effect I am I surrendering the fruit of the action to the supreme (even though the profits end up in "my" account) because I am giving away the "ownership" of that action (the trade) and hence not having to undergo the reaction by doing this technique. It is no longer my karmic problem and the cash is now "laundered :) " In effect, I protect myself from the karmic implications of cause/effect (causing pain to someone/pain coming back to me in the future. ) by this technique. I feel that my soul does not want to take on extra Karma (by putting on a trade -winning or losing both have karmic implications), hence the need to deflect the karma due from the work that I do back out into the Cosmos. It's not in my juristiction anymore by doing so. Important point this actually - because people don't realise that a major obstacle to making it big is the unit soul protecting itself from taking on more "Karmic baggage". Meditation speeds up the process of "burning" the seeds of prior karmic events (just like paying back a "loan" taken in this life or in prior lives), so too, we don't want to load that karmic baggage up anymore. "Moksa" - spiritual enlightenment - means just that - lightening up the karmic reaction account to zero (=freedom). No more reactions which cause rebirth in order for those reactions to be undergone = merge back into true state of "pure soul" (bliss).
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it might be a zero-sum game, but I do not feel the need to take on any bad karma because i take a trade that makes money. i am doing the person a favor by helping them get out of a trade. then when you sell you are giving someone else an opportunity to make money.

Forget the bad karma thing, its only bad karma if you are knowingly doing something to hurt someone else. in my trading, I am helping them out. Helping only brings good karma.

Sometimes my slightly negative P&L means I may have helped them out too much!!! LOL.
 
It is true the more or less evolved the soul of a person the more/less these laws operate, no hard and fast rules. It's just what I feel is right for me and it does not necessarily mean it is true for all.

I feel though that although you are doing the other side a favour, you are still nevertheless enmeshing yourself with more karma. (it doesn't matter if handcuffs are made of gold or iron - they are still handcuffs). For example trading is the vehicle for the expression of those negative karmic points. Pain = karma that is bring expressed and pain is the currency of the soul in paying it's 'dues' (just like pleasure is the result of expressing "positive karma" or spending the karmic currency.)

Similarly the pleasure you speak about jaronimo by giving the counterparty a chance to profit = karma again is being created. Good or bad karma, you still have to be reborn to reap the results and the unit soul ultimately wishes most dearly to merge with cosmic soul - hence it is not desirable to have good or bad karma, rather doing but not having the ownership of the repuercussions of the doing.

But if "I" am doing that, if my unit soul is part of that persons "ripening" process instead of the "cosmic soul" (which is invoked by afformentioned process), then I will have to undergo the repercussion of that act regardless. I am in effect creating new karma for myself by "helping out" the other guy express his/her negative/positive karma, delaying the date of the "final destination". By that I mean "nirvana" - the figurative drop of water (unit soul) falling and merging into the ocean of cosmic soul permanently. (as oppossed to a vague temporary union when unit soul has no body to clothe itself in order to express the karma that is holding it back from such a full union)



Quote from jaronimo:

it might be a zero-sum game, but I do not feel the need to take on any bad karma because i take a trade that makes money. i am doing the person a favor by helping them get out of a trade. then when you sell you are giving someone else an opportunity to make money.

Forget the bad karma thing, its only bad karma if you are knowingly doing something to hurt someone else. in my trading, I am helping them out. Helping only brings good karma.

Sometimes my slightly negative P&L means I may have helped them out too much!!! LOL.
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Quote from NZDSPeCIALISt:


This type of "Robin Hood" mentality does not mean that someone is not suffering at my expence when I put on a profitable trade, so the only way around that is to use a particular type of meditational technique whereby I internally repeat a mantra and simultaneously feel that "all is Brahma" when I click the mouse button to put on/take off a position. In effect I am surrendering the fruit of the action to the supreme (even though the profits end up in "my" account), because I am giving away the "karmic ownership" of that action (the trade) and hence not having to undergo the reaction by doing this technique.

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Hi NZDSPeCIALISt,

Thank you for the enlightening posts.

Are there any books/practices you would recommend on this issue, i.e. achieving internal congruency between spirituality and the zero-sum nature of trading?

Or any other books you would recommend?

Thanks,

Norman
 
Books:
http://shop.anandamarga.org/books/hardcopy.html

Practices: Email the said organisation on the webpage above to find out more about the practices.

Quote from intj2001:

Hi NZDSPeCIALISt,

Thank you for the enlightening posts.

Are there any books/practices you would recommend on this issue, i.e. achieving internal congruency between spirituality and the zero-sum nature of trading?

Or any other books you would recommend?

Thanks,

Norman
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