Zen Fire data feed in fast market

Quote from NinjaTrader_Ray:

For clarification…

- NinjaTrader is a multi-threaded application however NT7 will support multiple-cores
- NinjaTrader DOES NOT process everything in a single thread although it is accurate that all UI components are updated on the application main thread which is a hard requirement that can’t be changed
- The majority of our market data UI’s are not timer driven (which smooth’s out and reduces CPU performance at the expense of purity) but tick driven meaning, each incoming tick will update a UI. The benefit of this is that you will see the market data event as soon as NinjaTrader receives it from the market data provider. The downside is that it costs you more in CPU usage. On a snap shot or throttled at the server data feed, the CPU performance can be seriously lower than on a feed that is unfiltered. The latter will impose higher CPU requirements since there is just more data to process.
- We have made various performance improvements across many areas of NT7 and CPU load is one area that will be positively impacted. Those running unfiltered feeds will benefit the most.
- Yes we are late on NT7 and yes I received some black eyes for it and they have since turned purple. I even hear some people have called me a jerk ;)

For those interested in what we are doing with NT7 you can read more at the link below
http://www.ninjatrader.com/webnew/NT7/NinjaTrader7.html

Ray
More...

Well, I will say this for you - ever since that fiasco in June when you suddenly changed the beta release date on us at the last minute, you guys have been much more proactive about keeping us up to date and informed. So my complaints on that front are more about the past than anything you are presently doing. I do think that you are going to make NT 7 a lot better product than NT 6.5, which is why I am still waiting. It better work properly with Zen-Fire though, or I really will switch.
 
Quote from NinjaTrader_Ray:

For clarification…

- NinjaTrader is a multi-threaded application however NT7 will support multiple-cores
- NinjaTrader DOES NOT process everything in a single thread although it is accurate that all UI components are updated on the application main thread which is a hard requirement that can’t be changed
- The majority of our market data UI’s are not timer driven (which smooth’s out and reduces CPU performance at the expense of purity) but tick driven meaning, each incoming tick will update a UI. The benefit of this is that you will see the market data event as soon as NinjaTrader receives it from the market data provider. The downside is that it costs you more in CPU usage. On a snap shot or throttled at the server data feed, the CPU performance can be seriously lower than on a feed that is unfiltered. The latter will impose higher CPU requirements since there is just more data to process.
- We have made various performance improvements across many areas of NT7 and CPU load is one area that will be positively impacted. Those running unfiltered feeds will benefit the most.
- Yes we are late on NT7 and yes I received some black eyes for it and they have since turned purple. I even hear some people have called me a jerk ;)

For those interested in what we are doing with NT7 you can read more at the link below
http://www.ninjatrader.com/webnew/NT7/NinjaTrader7.html

Ray
More...

Some beginner programmer information as obviously you do not have that yet:

* ANY multi threaded application supports multiple cores. The OS scheduler automatically redistributes the threads over multiple cores. So, if you do not support multiple cores, then - you are not multithreaded. I think I have an idea where your idea you are comes from - the fact athat connectors are calling back into your app with a separate thread. Sadly, as you seem to immediately invoke those callbacks into the one UI thread you have.... that does not exactly make you multi threaded in the real world.

* It is absolutely possible to have MULTIPLE THREADS UPDATE THE UI. Stating that this is a hard requirement that can not be changed is nothing more than an indication of programmer stupidity. While it is correct that MS states (correctly) that any UI component can ONLY be updated from the thread that created it.... NOTHING stops you from creating every window on it's own thread with it's own message pump. THis is well documented (just look it up on google) and would mean that while every window in itself would be single threaded (which is a requirement that can not be changed), you can have every window or group of windows in a separate thread, effectively making the app using all CPU cores on the user interface.

Just to let you know. As an earlier poster said - the fact that you post a 10 to 20 TIMES better performance is an indication of the quality of NT6.5 - as is the fact that your data storage technology was retired for use about 10 years ago.

Me, like so many others, are looking forward to NT7, but seriously, the crap posted (like here) that simply is not true and indicates limited progarmmer knowledge does not make me look forward with a positive attitude ;)
 
Quote from FB123:

Well, I will say this for you - ever since that fiasco in June when you suddenly changed the beta release date on us at the last minute, you guys have been much more proactive about keeping us up to date and informed. So my complaints on that front are more about the past than anything you are presently doing. I do think that you are going to make NT 7 a lot better product than NT 6.5, which is why I am still waiting. It better work properly with Zen-Fire though, or I really will switch.
More...

Just a suggestion, but have you ever considered using it with the TT feed, a high quality feed that is filtered, last time I checked.

I would do the same, but a proprietary indicator I will be using is tuned for NT with Zen.
 
Quote from dandxg:

Just a suggestion, but have you ever considered using it with the TT feed, a high quality feed that is filtered, last time I checked.

I would do the same, but a proprietary indicator I will be using is tuned for NT with Zen.
More...

I've considered a lot of things including switching to a broker with a TT feed, however it's hassle to do that and I don't want to unless I have to. I'll give them a chance to make NT 7 work right with ZF before I make any changes. There are problems with other software programs too, and at least with NT I know where the minefields are and how to make it work OK (for now).
 
well NTZF works for me and considering one of the oldest and most widely used
software author's work - Windows - produced Vista as a bridge between XP Pro
and W7, i don't think it so bad that a major re-design has been postponed in order
to 'get NT7 right'; personally i won't be switching to NT7 until it's been proven to be
stable - bug free, and the same for W7 - how many updates will that require . . .

i also downscaled my internet from highspeed - up to 7.5mbps to lite - 256k max
and don't see any difference in NT's performance except when first loading a chart

i think there's a misplaced unconcious confidence all software works together and
several other brokers and their charting/order entry programs have conflicts with
for example various sw firewalls, browsers and browser versions

whatever shortcomings NT has, the onus remains first with the user to ensure
their computer and what's running on it is 'as new', preferably using a computer
that's dedicated to trading only

for the majority, as many have stated, NT works
 
Quote from Wallace:

well NTZF works for me and considering one of the oldest and most widely used
software author's work - Windows - produced Vista as a bridge between XP Pro
and W7, i don't think it so bad that a major re-design has been postponed in order
to 'get NT7 right'; personally i won't be switching to NT7 until it's been proven to be
stable - bug free, and the same for W7 - how many updates will that require . . .

i also downscaled my internet from highspeed - up to 7.5mbps to lite - 256k max
and don't see any difference in NT's performance except when first loading a chart

i think there's a misplaced unconcious confidence all software works together and
several other brokers and their charting/order entry programs have conflicts with
for example various sw firewalls, browsers and browser versions

whatever shortcomings NT has, the onus remains first with the user to ensure
their computer and what's running on it is 'as new', preferably using a computer
that's dedicated to trading only

for the majority, as many have stated, NT works
More...

That's because the majority aren't scalpers and don't even know that they're experiencing lag. Generally only scalpers try to place a lot of trades during heavy market times, and that's when the problem shows up with ZF and a lot of charts open.

Yeah, it's "good enough" for a lot of people, but that doesn't mean that it works properly. I have tweaked the hell out of my computer and out of NT, wiped out my OS numerous times and re-installed, and I have a very powerful machine - and it still has problems. There are just limitations in the software that I can't get around, which is why NT7 can't come fast enough.
 
NT is fine if you use it within it's limits. Apparently scalpers in fast markets should be using another platform.

However, the list of improvements in 7 look good. I just hope that the charts can be tabbed in containers, with multiple containers for multiple screens. The tabs can have meaningful names, rather than the window name "ES 0909 - 5min (CreationDate)". (Like, what if I have different views of a 5min chart?)

But, even with some annoyances (and let's face it, the answers you get a lot of times from forum mods is, in so many words, "go figure it out for yourself") it IS free.

And while there may be complaints, nobody else has offered up better at that price.
 
FB123,

From personal experience, without some advance knowledge or being in the pit trading the major news is one of the fastest way to loose $ for most.

I trade short term myself, one of my main rules is to be out of the market 5 min before and after news come out.

If you brave enough to trade nfp, bets of luck in such endeavor.

JMHO.

Regards,
redduke
 
FB123, i can understand that NT may not be up-to-speed handling many open
charts etc, however i'm wondering what you're referring to by "experiencing lag"

i don't know but presume that Globex price data is based on pit data, as such
doesn't that mean the first lag is there, next there's the lag when we enter an
order between our B/S click on the NT button and the order verification process
via Rithmic or whoever, then there's the lag of actually being filled and the lag of
the fill being registered with the FCM before the confirmation arrives in NT, the
whole process is not happening instantaneously

i'm not a scalper tho i'm interested in being filled when i see 'that' price on the
chart; i only sim trade at present the 6E but can tell you the eurusd via MT4
will 'tick' more often on occassion than the 6E, and that feed is coming from
Russia

i believe the chart i posted clearly illustrates how the price can jump a significant
number of pips, particularly interesting is the highest volume bar of that series
has one of the smallest spreads, so i'm also wondering if your complaint has
to do with the fills you're getting - or not rather than NT itself
 
Quote from RedDuke:

FB123,

From personal experience, without some advance knowledge or being in the pit trading the major news is one of the fastest way to loose $ for most.

I trade short term myself, one of my main rules is to be out of the market 5 min before and after news come out.

If you brave enough to trade nfp, bets of luck in such endeavor.

JMHO.

Regards,
redduke
More...

I can generally make money during those times, although you really have to be in the right frame of mind - I don't always do it. You have to have hotkeys set up, and basically just read pure price action as it runs to an extreme and then pauses. When it spikes like that and then pauses for a second or two, it's likely to reverse a good number of ticks. If you think about it, all you have to do is enter quickly with a relatively tight stop (on crude oil I use 7-10 ticks)... sure you will get stopped out a few times like that, but when it reverses and runs in your direction it will easily make up for a few losers in a row. You can also enter by trailing a sell-stop up with the market as it's rising, or a buy-stop down with a falling market.... when it violently reverses and spikes back through your stop order you will generally instantly be in a relatively decent profit position as it is likely to keep running through it. You then have to immediately move the stop of your new position to lock in whatever gains you just made (the stop is placed as part of the order using NinjaTrader's ATM strategies feature). The trick is knowing at what distance to place that first entry stop. This works best in a market that is gyrating up and down in a wide range, usually in the first few minutes after the release. Then it usually starts a nice trend you can catch. (It is also critically important to have a time and sales ticker up and running with the chart so you can feel the "speed" of the trades - I couldn't do it nearly as well without that.)

Generally I can get 50/50 odds which makes me net profitable since the winners are a lot bigger than the losers. However, you really have to have no hesitation whatsoever on your entry, and you have to move your stop FAST as the price moves in your direction to lock in your gains (I use the NT chart trader which is one reason why I like it). You also have to be very fast on the keys. No way could you trade during those times with only a mouse. You really can't have any lag in your software either, which is why I have very minimal charts/indicators going on with NT so I don't get significant delays. This type of trading is basically 100% pure "feel" - you are trading off of the pauses in action along with some very short-term S/R more than anything else. It feels almost exactly like a video game (something that I used to be pretty good at, back when I played video games).

One caveat is that it can't be doing one of things where it's literally spiking up and down in a 10-20 tick range at blinding speed... there is no edge whatsoever in that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top