YOUR Religion

[JohnnyK]

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

No, I’m just pointing out that the traditional Christian viewpoint is that man, prior to his rebirth and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, is literally blinded to reaching God. In other words, man wasn’t “innocent” as a child or teen and then took a "journey to the Dark Side” – he/she was born that way. I thought that was the journey you were referring to, but maybe that's not even what you were talking about?

I have a new and improved outlook now.

Well, for one I don't view earthly birth as the beginning of our individuality. That's not new. But that we were born innocent in the image of god some eons ago, that is newer. It is this birth that has been scarred by a judgement about who we are. Having the freedom to view ourselves as less than what we were, many of us chose an unreality. Since God is reality, and we no longer lived in reality, we separate from reality in various ways, embellishing stories and fictional identities that take us further and further away.

Although it's never possible to be separated from God and reality, the effects of going so long and so far away began to take a toll on our biology and an ability to freely choose to return to innocence. One of our brothers, one who had never separated from reality and God, came to help out. His mission was, for the first time in his life, experience separation. By equating separation with an act of love, instead of an act of judgment, he changed the mechanics of the situation and opened a new era.

To be born again, is to see our original birth in the proper perspective, without all the trauma, drama and judgments about our lesser status. Since that was the cause of our predicament, that is the way back.

The fact that most of structured christianity still wishes to view itself as on the Dark Side, is preventing a rebirth. Words like "filthy rags", "all unrighteous" and "sinners tending to evil" are popular viewpoints bandied about. These are actually antiproductive and a legacy of the original sin of self-recriminating judgments.

Who we are is LOVE. Love is WHO we ARE, totally pure and innocent. Until we can see that, we can't see the "kingdom of god", so to speak. Less than that, we can't see reality.

The way back has been made easier by our brother who came to help. He continues to make it easier and easier in various ways. Along the way, we will find that love is the only thing that is real, the only thing that matters, that God is love, and we too ARE LOVE.

Love is immortal.

JohnnyK

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from vhehn:



We can pit priest from various religions and sects agianst one another and see who can get the holy barbaque going. For balance we can have a control pit set up with no prayer but by using science and purely naturalistic methods(ie matches and lighter fluid) and see who wins. If God could do it once there is no reason he can't do it again.

Why insist on unnecessary killing? Here’s an easier way: just form a prayer group at a charismatic evangelical church and pray for people. If God is real, and your life isn’t too distracted or sinful of course, then you’ll see miracles.

This is exactly what we’re doing at our church, btw, and we’ve already seen a few things that have been genuinely miraculous. The group is growing more and more powerful and hopefully in time I believe that the supernatural will grow and develop even further.

The other nice thing is that it is a team effort so that one person will hopefully not go off the deep end as the miraculous occurs more and more frequently…

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

Why insist on unnecessary killing? Here’s an easier way: just form a prayer group at a charismatic evangelical church and pray for people. If God is real, and your life isn’t too distracted or sinful of course, then you’ll see miracles.

This is exactly what we’re doing at our church, btw, and we’ve already seen a few things that have been genuinely miraculous. The group is growing more and more powerful and hopefully in time I believe that the supernatural will grow and develop even further.

The other nice thing is that it is a team effort so that one person will hopefully not go off the deep end as the miraculous occurs more and more frequently…

"one person will hopefully not go off the deep end" might be too late. i will bite. what miracles can you document. why is it that all miracles happen outside camera range?

 

[jzlucas]

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

Why insist on unnecessary killing? Here’s an easier way: just form a prayer group at a charismatic evangelical church and pray for people. If God is real, and your life isn’t too distracted or sinful of course, then you’ll see miracles.

This is exactly what we’re doing at our church, btw, and we’ve already seen a few things that have been genuinely miraculous. The group is growing more and more powerful and hopefully in time I believe that the supernatural will grow and develop even further.

The other nice thing is that it is a team effort so that one person will hopefully not go off the deep end as the miraculous occurs more and more frequently…

Being skeptical concerning anything supernatural or miraculous, Im curious as to what exactly you witnessed that was considered a miracle. Thanks. J

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from JohnnyK:

I have a new and improved outlook now.

Well, for one I don't view earthly birth as the beginning of our individuality. That's not new. But that we were born innocent in the image of god some eons ago, that is newer. It is this birth that has been scarred by a judgement about who we are. Having the freedom to view ourselves as less than what we were, many of us chose an unreality. Since God is reality, and we no longer lived in reality, we separate from reality in various ways, embellishing stories and fictional identities that take us further and further away.

Although it's never possible to be separated from God and reality, the effects of going so long and so far away began to take a toll on our biology and an ability to freely choose to return to innocence. One of our brothers, one who had never separated from reality and God, came to help out. His mission was, for the first time in his life, experience separation. By equating separation with an act of love, instead of an act of judgment, he changed the mechanics of the situation and opened a new era.

To be born again, is to see our original birth in the proper perspective, without all the trauma, drama and judgments about our lesser status. Since that was the cause of our predicament, that is the way back.

The fact that most of structured christianity still wishes to view itself as on the Dark Side, is preventing a rebirth. Words like "filthy rags", "all unrighteous" and "sinners tending to evil" are popular viewpoints bandied about. These are actually antiproductive and a legacy of the original sin of self-recriminating judgments.

Who we are is LOVE. Love is WHO we ARE, totally pure and innocent. Until we can see that, we can't see the "kingdom of god", so to speak. Less than that, we can't see reality.

The way back has been made easier by our brother who came to help. He continues to make it easier and easier in various ways. Along the way, we will find that love is the only thing that is real, the only thing that matters, that God is love, and we too ARE LOVE.

Love is immortal.

JohnnyK

Of course, I appreciate any emphasis on love. But I guess I don’t understand what was different from before. To me your beliefs sound very similar to traditional New Age – if you’ll allow me to use that term - teachings about the Higher Self. I guess the only difference is that you are emphasizing love as opposed to, say, more gnostic beliefs?

And, by the way, you do seem to have changed...

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from jzlucas:

Being skeptical concerning anything supernatural or miraculous, Im curious as to what exactly you witnessed that was considered a miracle. Thanks. J

Well, we had one boy who had a severe food allergies to wheat and something else that escapes me. We prayed for him and his parents were shocked: that next week he sat down with a pizza.

Another example, last week I was praying for a very kind older man who had recently lost his wife. I used to work as a relief house parent at a foster care home (for lack of a better term) and the name of that place popped into my head even though I hadn't worked at it in 10+ years and rarely thought of the experience. Anyway, after we prayed for him, he was talking about how he and his wife (who passed away) had had many wonderful years working together because they had founded an orphanage back in the midwest. It could just be a coincidence, but of course I think it's too odd.

Now, guys, I’ll be the first to say that the miraculous has been slow going. I mean it’s not like we’re growing tows or anything.

I, for one, consider myself to be the most spiritually dense person on planet earth. Yet I have had a number of spiritual experiences in spite of it. And that’s why I find it shocking – and I’m not trying to be inflammatory – that there is anyone that is a true atheist.

But, nevertheless, we’ve had some genuine occurrences and I have every confidence that the number will keep growing.

And, by the way, New Age/occult and other religions will have the miraculous occur as well. It’s just not that uncommon…

 

[jzlucas]

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

Well, we had one boy who had a severe food allergies to wheat and something else that escapes me. We prayed for him and his parents were shocked: that next week he sat down with a pizza.

Another example, last week I was praying for a very kind older man who had recently lost his wife. I used to work as a relief house parent at a foster care home (for lack of a better term) and the name of that place popped into my head even though I hadn't worked at it in 10+ years and rarely thought of the experience. Anyway, after we prayed for him, he was talking about how he and his wife (who passed away) had had many wonderful years working together because they had founded an orphanage back in the midwest. It could just be a coincidence, but of course I think it's too odd.

Now, guys, I’ll be the first to say that the miraculous has been slow going. I mean it’s not like we’re growing tows or anything.

I, for one, consider myself to be the most spiritually dense person on planet earth. Yet I have had a number of spiritual experiences in spite of it. And that’s why I find it shocking – and I’m not trying to be inflammatory – that there is anyone that is a true atheist.

But, nevertheless, we’ve had some genuine occurrences and I have every confidence that the number will keep growing.

And, by the way, New Age/occult and other religions will have the miraculous occur as well. It’s just not that uncommon…

Concerning the pizza boy, do you think that its possible it just may be the power of the mind? Kind of like the "Benny Hinn" victims who think they're healed and when they wake up the next day the pain resumes?

 

[JohnnyK]

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:


And, by the way, you do seem to have changed...

I did what I did before LOVE came to town!

Quote from ShoeshineBoy:

Of course, I appreciate any emphasis on love. But I guess I don’t understand what was different from before. To me your beliefs sound very similar to traditional New Age – if you’ll allow me to use that term - teachings about the Higher Self. I guess the only difference is that you are emphasizing love as opposed to, say, more gnostic beliefs?

Yes, my emphasis is on love. I am also emphasizing our true identity as love, from the moment of our original birth into individuality eons ago, to this very moment, now. I emphasize that to the point that any other identity is not relevant unless it is commanded by love. If not, we don't own it.

I would estimate most identities are mental and fictional. These are the concepts that must "die" the proverbial death...this is the only reason for death...a clearing house for useless identities. Hence, if we can manage to kill off the numerous IDs that do not identify us as LOVE, then we can reach the immortality that the Master spoke of.

It may help to understand the power of love. And how love commands the universe, literally.

Love is the basis of miracles because it acts on - commands - the minute 'particles' that make up mass. There is a point, lets call it the zero point, a point of equilibrium, where matter meets spirit, where finite meets infinite, where the devisable meets the indivisible, where limited meets unlimited. That point is ONLY accessible by love. Love then, as the highest intelligence in the universe, is able to rearrange the atomic structures of any organized form of mass. With enough love, you could, literally, move a mountain, walk on water, multiply a fish, multiply bread, calm a storm...and anything else considered a miracle.

In your prayer meetings, consider that numbers of people, who are love, are magnifying the strength of their love by working together to direct love toward a vector of thought. Narrowing that vector to a specific point or quality, you are going to see results. Love commands reality, and reality responds to love. You can see how you, as a group first, and then individually, change conditions, and create with love.

To the extent that love is unlimited in its power, to the extent that you are love, you have unlimited power to make changes. This does require an elevation of opinion about ourselves. Not elevated so much as an awareness of the reality of that identity.

As we are surrounded by forces, structures, opinions and authorities who/that constantly challenge that identity, including ourselves mainly, we are going to lose effectiveness and power to perform miracles. As we gradually regain that awareness, we will increase our power to change earth into heaven, making graveyards obsolete.

So it's more than just an emphasis, it is pivotal...the crux of the matter. It's about our identity, how to regain that ID in the face of so much opposition. That is where some faith could come in handy...faith and consciousness, working together.

You can test my thesis easily. Go tell someone you are love with unlimited power to command the universe and see how much opposition you receive. But if that is reality, the alternative is a relative illusion. Tell someone they are actually love, and see all the resistance you get. Find one person on earth who totally sees themselves as love. You can see how rare this is.

There is resistance partly because minds can't identify with God, who is love, or identify themselves with that love, that perfection, that purity,that innocence, that unity, and certainly not with any of that power. There is also fear of being reabsorbed into anonymity should we return entirely to the love that God is. Not.

Pardon the length of my treatise. Don't mean to be pedantic. Just very excited about this new viewpoint. It is very hopeful and solutions oriented. It makes sense of so much bs we've been dished over the years. I am excited about the prospects this has for humanity at this time. I think we may reach critical mass, and then its all over...back to Eden we go!

JohnnyK

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from jzlucas:

Concerning the pizza boy, do you think that its possible it just may be the power of the mind? Kind of like the "Benny Hinn" victims who think they're healed and when they wake up the next day the pain resumes?

I agree that that happens much more often than we think. Plus, the body can cover a multitude of sins with the right endorphins and neurotransmitters, eh?

That’s actually a very interesting topic in and of itself. You would be surprised, for example, how much psychology controls testosterone output in males: there has been study after study showing the power of the mind over one of our body’s most powerful hormones.

But in this case, they’re actually friends of one of the couples who is on the prayer team and the boy has still been eating wheat like crazy…

 

[ShoeshineBoy]

Quote from JohnnyK:

I did what I did before LOVE came to town!





Yes, my emphasis is on love. I am also emphasizing our true identity as love, from the moment of our original birth into individuality eons ago, to this very moment, now. I emphasize that to the point that any other identity is not relevant unless it is commanded by love. If not, we don't own it.

I would estimate most identities are mental and fictional. These are the concepts that must "die" the proverbial death...this is the only reason for death...a clearing house for useless identities. Hence, if we can manage to kill off the numerous IDs that do not identify us as LOVE, then we can reach the immortality that the Master spoke of.

It may help to understand the power of love. And how love commands the universe, literally.

Love is the basis of miracles because it acts on - commands - the minute 'particles' that make up mass. There is a point, lets call it the zero point, a point of equilibrium, where matter meets spirit, where finite meets infinite, where the devisable meets the indivisible, where limited meets unlimited. That point is ONLY accessible by love. Love then, as the highest intelligence in the universe, is able to rearrange the atomic structures of any organized form of mass. With enough love, you could, literally, move a mountain, walk on water, multiply a fish, multiply bread, calm a storm...and anything else considered a miracle.

In your prayer meetings, consider that numbers of people, who are love, are magnifying the strength of their love by working together to direct love toward a vector of thought. Narrowing that vector to a specific point or quality, you are going to see results. Love commands reality, and reality responds to love. You can see how you, as a group first, and then individually, change conditions, and create with love.

To the extent that love is unlimited in its power, to the extent that you are love, you have unlimited power to make changes. This does require an elevation of opinion about ourselves. Not elevated so much as an awareness of the reality of that identity.

As we are surrounded by forces, structures, opinions and authorities who/that constantly challenge that identity, including ourselves mainly, we are going to lose effectiveness and power to perform miracles. As we gradually regain that awareness, we will increase our power to change earth into heaven, making graveyards obsolete.

So it's more than just an emphasis, it is pivotal...the crux of the matter. It's about our identity, how to regain that ID in the face of so much opposition. That is where some faith could come in handy...faith and consciousness, working together.

You can test my thesis easily. Go tell someone you are love with unlimited power to command the universe and see how much opposition you receive. But if that is reality, the alternative is a relative illusion. Tell someone they are actually love, and see all the resistance you get. Find one person on earth who totally sees themselves as love. You can see how rare this is.

There is resistance partly because minds can't identify with God, who is love, or identify themselves with that love, that perfection, that purity,that innocence, that unity, and certainly not with any of that power. There is also fear of being reabsorbed into anonymity should we return entirely to the love that God is. Not.

Pardon the length of my treatise. Don't mean to be pedantic. Just very excited about this new viewpoint. It is very hopeful and solutions oriented. It makes sense of so much bs we've been dished over the years. I am excited about the prospects this has for humanity at this time. I think we may reach critical mass, and then its all over...back to Eden we go!

JohnnyK

Well, you brought up a lot of complex subjects such as the source of the miraculous. Sounds like you’ve got kind of a midicholorean view of that, eh?

Of course, you can imagine that I don’t see eye-to-eye on a number of things. Out of curiosity, what did you mean “being absorbed into anonymity”? Are you saying you believe in the eastern idea of essentially losing your individuality and melding as one drop into a universal pool?