Young guy wanting to start trading

[MKTrader]

You dropped your best mentors...I am not saying that school is for everyone, but in an age that most human are replaced with machines and soon AI, you better think fast if you have enough strengths to make it without formal education.

I'd say a formal education is a largely outdated and outrageously expensive way to learn, outside of a few fields where you can't get around it (medicine, law, architecture, etc.). Want to learn business or marketing? For a few hundred dollars you can try several online businesses, split test ads, find out what people are willing to buy, etc. That's MUCH more valuable than a business degree.

Want to learn literature or the classics? There are tons of free resources, without the outrageous expense (of often agenda) of modern universities. You can even learn a lot of IT and coding on your own or specialized programs outside the 4-year system. Here's just one example of one for business:
https://discoverpraxis.com/

Having said that, OP seems to be looking for some easy route or free lunch. That doesn't exist anywhere, and trading is probably the worst place to look.

 

[ironchef]

I'd say a formal education is a largely outdated and outrageously expensive way to learn, outside of a few fields where you can't get around it (medicine, law, architecture, etc.). Want to learn business or marketing? For a few hundred dollars you can try several online businesses, split test ads, find out what people are willing to buy, etc. That's MUCH more valuable than a business degree.

Want to learn literature or the classics? There are tons of free resources, without the outrageous expense (of often agenda) of modern universities. You can even learn a lot of IT and coding on your own or specialized programs outside the 4-year system. Here's just one example of one for business:
https://discoverpraxis.com/

Having said that, OP seems to be looking for some easy route or free lunch. That doesn't exist anywhere, and trading is probably the worst place to look.

Very true, I am still taking Coursara courses in economics, finance, derivatives, VBA..., and they are free!

 

[MKTrader]

2010 - 2013: First day trade, but quickly changed to swing trade stocks. 2013 - present: options.

We practice living below our means since we started working years ago. Still live a very simple life, not much expenses to speak of comparatively speaking.

No offense intended, but a quick glance at your earliest posts here in 2015 shows you were new to options trading?
https://www.elitetrader.com/et/thre...g-puts-for-premium.291995/page-6#post-4132511

Do you really trade exclusively for a living...as in something like "I have a $400,000 account, make an average annual return of 20% ($80,000), of which I save $30,000 and live on $50,000." (I'm not expecting actual numbers or personal info.) In an example like that, one losing or flat year would throw things off badly.

It's my contention that VERY few retail traders are truly trading for a living. Some quit their jobs, try for a while then fail. Others may trade but are also supported by family wealth, an inheritance, a mostly passive business, running an online trading service that pays the bills, etc.

I like to warn people like OP that this is MUCH harder than most people think and very few rely solely on trading income for the long term. During wild bull rides, some have great short-term success and may quit their jobs for a while (late 90s dot-com stock bubble, crypto boom a couple of years ago, bull markets where people sell options or use leverage to buy dips...this can go on a few years before a 20%+ crash destroys them).

 

[kandlekid]

Yachts? I have two. One I would cheerfully sell for $70k and the other I would give away to the right person. GF has one and it can be had for $5k or so. We would like to get it down to just one, and having none at all would not be so bad.

Now the multi million dollar yachts with full time hired crews, helicopters, swimming pools, and bikini clad boat bunnies, I don't currently have any of those.

Just curious, power or sail? If sail, how are they rigged? Sloop, cutter, ketch, etc?

Me, I want to own, sail and live aboard a ketch. My favorite is the Pearson 424.

 

[GrowleyMonster]

Hers is a Halman 20 sloop. cute, salty little microcruiser. No inboard but we put a dandy outboard bracket on her and stuck a long shaft 6hp Tohatsu on it which is about 3x the power needed for that boat.

My little boat is a 1976 Cal 2-27 originally sloop rigged, now mastless, and the Atomic 4 has been replaced with electric drive system of my own design. My intention was to build a solar canopy over the entire boat for about 2kw of solar and I did not want any shading. That project has been on hold for a couple of years and I don't have time to do the solar. That's the giveaway boat. I lived aboard for 7 years. Sailed her for 4 years until I derigged her for the canopy.

My big boat is a Bruce Roberts Offshore 44 but beamier than the stock plans. Sloop, aft cockpit fiberglass version, built 1979, Westerbeke/Perkins 4-107 diesel, very spacious below. I am in the process of refitting for long range cruising and liveaboard at the dock in case the old lady gives me the boot. Or for our honeymoon getaway if we get married. Needs a lot of work to bring up to my standards. The sloop rig can be a handful with a sail plan this big for singlehanding but it sails like a locomotive. Takes a lot of wind to heel this tank. Very solidly built 14 tonner. Bringing it home from Gulfport in a Norther, it was like sitting in somebody's living room. Best boat purchase I ever made, though I must admit the Cal served me well, too.

Only a few things I don't like about Brute Force, my Bruce Roberts. First the ketch rig is a lot easier for solo sailing and I like the aft cabin of the center cockpit version. This one is the aft cockpit sloop variation. Second there is a big skylight that sits about 2' proud of the deck and I can't see over it from the cockpit so the view ahead is somewhat restricted. And the headroom below is so high that I can't reach the aforementioned skylight to open or close it. The Westerbeast is really hard to get to, in places, because of where it is shoehorned down in the keel. Takes all day to change the starter, for instance. But she is roomy and sails sweet, and looks really salty. If you are shopping for a boat and you run across either the Roberts 44 or one of the bigger Spray models, in fiberglass, get it if you want a bigger boat and the price is not crazy high. Most of the bigger Roberts boats can be had in steel, too, but that makes for a lot more maintenance for IMHO very little advantage. A LOT of these boats have circumnavigated, so many in fact that saying you did it won't impress anyone. Most were powered with the 4-107 marinized by Westerbeke, or the Perkins 4-108. Some of these old boats have been repowered with Kubota diesels marinized by Beta, and they are sweet engines with parts you buy from a tractor dealer without paying the marine premium.

GF lived on the Halman briefly until she bought an old 40' ChrisCraft with a pair of poorly maintained 350 gas engines to live aboard in greater comfort, and she sold it rather than repower when one engine finally called it quits.

So it could be worse... we could have FOUR boats if the ChrisCraft had diesels in good condition instead of gasoline V8s. She had (still has) a house in Slidell but she works at One Shell Square and the commute sucked. She picked up the Halman for a cheap floating condo but it was a little tight for full time liveaboard which is why she bought the CC. Then she bought the house here in Gentilly and we don't have to be boat people anymore. Now our boats are mostly for fun and not for residence.

 

[ironchef]

No offense intended, but a quick glance at your earliest posts here in 2015 shows you were new to options trading?
https://www.elitetrader.com/et/thre...g-puts-for-premium.291995/page-6#post-4132511

Yes, introduced to options by my good friend back in 2013, writing covered calls and cash secured puts.

Do you really trade exclusively for a living...as in something like "I have a $400,000 account, make an average annual return of 20% ($80,000), of which I save $30,000 and live on $50,000." (I'm not expecting actual numbers or personal info.) In an example like that, one losing or flat year would throw things off badly.

By your definition that I don't have a day job, and that the bulk of my yearly income (since 2013) came from my brokerage accounts, yes I am a full time retail.

It's my contention that VERY few retail traders are truly trading for a living. Some quit their jobs, try for a while then fail. Others may trade but are also supported by family wealth, an inheritance, a mostly passive business, running an online trading service that pays the bills, etc.

I like to warn people like OP that this is MUCH harder than most people think and very few rely solely on trading income for the long term. During wild bull rides, some have great short-term success and may quit their jobs for a while (late 90s dot-com stock bubble, crypto boom a couple of years ago, bull markets where people sell options or use leverage to buy dips...this can go on a few years before a 20%+ crash destroys them).

You are absolutely correct. Most retail full time traders failed because they were undercapitalized, couldn't survive a drawdown. Professionals who trade OPM can survive because they collect fees. They trade their own money after they amass a fortune.

Retails need to keep their day job until they can amass a sizable account through compounding their profits, then they can quit their day job.

Best wishes to you, MKT.

 

[ironchef]

remember one thing....do not measure success in terms of dollars....measure it in terms of knowledge.

Without accumulated profits (dollars) to show - "no test scores", how do you know you have the knowledge to trade profitably? In school, if you keep getting zeros in your tests, you likely learned nothing.

and i wanted 100% win rate

it took me 12 years

What took you so long?

 

[ironchef]

I like to warn people like OP that this is MUCH harder than most people think and very few rely solely on trading income for the long term. During wild bull rides, some have great short-term success and may quit their jobs for a while (late 90s dot-com stock bubble, crypto boom a couple of years ago, bull markets where people sell options or use leverage to buy dips...this can go on a few years before a 20%+ crash destroys them).

These statements are so true, it is really really hard to make money trading options. It is more luck than skills and after 6 1/2 years, luck could run out this year if a multi-year bear market hits and I cannot adjust.

Like Buffett said, it is only when the tides go out that you know who is swimming naked. Then, I will know if I am a real trader or just masquerade as one.

 

[Jfranco_2003]

I started to trading with 14 years old, with my mom's account, and I have two years in this world. I just finished the highschool in my country. I still don't won any dollar in trading, rather, I have lost more than $ 2000 since I trade.

I won't tell you that it is an easy business, or that I'm a professional. But this activity is exciting and since I started to read how to trade, and how the markets works, at least, in demo I'm having good returns. I'm practicing the VSA and Wyckoff methods in the CME Group markets, and in few months I will start again with trading in a real account.

The age doesn't matter, and if you have the purpouse to fix all your trading mistakes (Inside your mind and feelings while you trade), as well as find, learn and perfect your trading plan and method, you will, with discipline and practice, be a successfull-consistent trader.

Don't let that the first losses make you leave the trading (If it is that really you like), and each loss is an oportunity to read and learn each time more, how to be a better trader.

 

[padutrader]

In school, if you keep getting zeros in your tests, you likely learned nothing.

some of the most successful people did get zero in tests.....