Workhorse for less than $500

Realistic · May 31, 2012

Quote from NetTecture:

> you just want to avoid compact/mini cases which may use non-standard
> motherboards and limited upgrade space for add'l drives

I go the other way. Everything here including some servers is micro atx based - I get 8 discs into a 2x5.25" bay All standard components - heck, my workstation is a MicroAtx board with 16gb RAM and can handle 2 full length high end graphics cards No need to put lots of air in in case you want to expand - and files better go on a SAN somewhere

Agree, good point... I was mainly referring to buying a cheap unit from Dell/Lenovo, I once had a MOBO go out on a small form factor Dell System and only MOBO I could find to fit needed to be ordered through them directly "ouch" and I couldn't add add'l HD's...

Pekelo · May 31, 2012

Since the OP didn't say if there is a special usage (let's say graphics or music), I really don't see the point of going old, instead of getting a low budget new desktop. When you can buy a new one for under $300, why bother with old, unless you like to tinker with it?

But to be helpful, here is a reliability comparison from 2009:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/1874..._most_and_least_reliable_brands.html#desktops

Interestingly, eMachines is in the top in the "Any core component problems" category as better than the rest.

Edit:

As a surprise, it turns out that nowadays desktops are LESS reliable than laptops, so if it is a big issue for you, go laptop:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/211081/2010_reliability_and_service_survey_desktops.html

By the way, Dell for Home got really bad reviews...

easymon1 · May 31, 2012

Quote from NetTecture:

> you just want to avoid compact/mini cases which may use non-standard
> motherboards and limited upgrade space for add'l drives

I go the other way. Everything here including some servers is micro atx based - I get 8 discs into a 2x5.25" bay All standard components - heck, my workstation is a MicroAtx board with 16gb RAM and can handle 2 full length high end graphics cards No need to put lots of air in in case you want to expand - and files better go on a SAN somewhere

Interesting...where could we get specifics on something like that?

NetTecture · Jun 1, 2012

Quote from easymon1:

Interesting...where could we get specifics on something like that?

Sure

What you want to know? As in - this is really very varying. Currently I have a couple of that cases in reserve:

http://www.aerocool.us/pgs/pgs-q/qx2000.htm

It has 2x 5.25" slot.

Get a standard proper power supply - won't adfvice here, just make it a smaller one if you want to use the 5.25" slots. Nothing special, just make sure it is not overlength deep, which is no problem below 1000 watt or so.

Micro ATX boards? Easy to find. My newswest high end cruncher uses this:

http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_2011/Rampage_IV_GENE/

It is freaking expensive but damn good. Got a low height CPU fan, works like a charm. There are plenty of more budget boards around - we talk of standard mATX. Note that THIS board can take a whopping 32gb RAM

SOME boards support ECC RAM, my servers use that based on ASUS / MSI + AMD.

For the more storage oriented servers I have http://www.supermicro.com/products/accessories/mobilerack/CSE-M28E1.cfm - cost (nearly 400 EUR without taxes) but it is a SAS backplane and I plug a higher end RAID into it

Goes NICELY into the 2x5.25" bays, no joke

The mobos on the server have on board graphics so... I use the large PCIe slots for the RAID card.

Nice, quiet.

In 3 months I move to a new location (finally found a decent house), then I put a rack or 2 to the basement and get my SERVERS there from the data center, but as a smaller solution this setup is great. Have 2 machines running now - 2 servers (discs etc.) and 1 cruncher (only a SSD installed internally, bays empty - that is the expensivbe ASUS board, overclocked "defensive" to 4ghz PER CORE UNDER FULL LOAD...

My own workstation is such a little beast, too, with 6 discs (2 internal, 4 in a http://www.supermicro.com/products/accessories/mobilerack/CSE-M14.cfm) and a blue ray drive and.... a ATI 6970 graphics card, which definitely is "higher end" (2nd top model from the 6xxx series). The board can take two graphics cards

All expansion I will ever need on my desk.

saxon22 · Jun 1, 2012

Quote from Pekelo:

Since the OP didn't say if there is a special usage (let's say graphics or music), I really don't see the point of going old, instead of getting a low budget new desktop. When you can buy a new one for under $300, why bother with old, unless you like to tinker with it?

But to be helpful, here is a reliability comparison from 2009:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/1874..._most_and_least_reliable_brands.html#desktops

Interestingly, eMachines is in the top in the "Any core component problems" category as better than the rest.

Edit:

As a surprise, it turns out that nowadays desktops are LESS reliable than laptops, so if it is a big issue for you, go laptop:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/211081/2010_reliability_and_service_survey_desktops.html

By the way, Dell for Home got really bad reviews...

It is a brand new world out there when it comes to PCs, but I digress. I want a PC that is not the latst and greatest but the most reliable. That is why I am willing to go back in time a little bit to get that build like a tank quality. For that it seems that dell workstations are still the ones to beat.

NetTecture · Jun 1, 2012

Quote from saxon22:

I want a PC that is not the latst and greatest but the most reliable.

That does not compute. Processors and hardware have a limited lifespan. You want to buy old end of life stuff because you think it is more reliable?

Does not work for hardware.

easymon1 · Jun 1, 2012

Quote from NetTecture:

Sure What you want to know? As in - this is really very varying. Currently I have a couple of that cases in reserve:
Thanks NetTecture

johnkurtz · Jun 1, 2012

Quote from saxon22:

It is a brand new world out there when it comes to PCs, but I digress. I want a PC that is not the latst and greatest but the most reliable. That is why I am willing to go back in time a little bit to get that build like a tank quality. For that it seems that dell workstations are still the ones to beat.

What makes DELL so bulletproof? Do they utilize "special" components in their builds? How is their RAM, motherboards and HD's so superior to those from high quality brand manufacturers such as ASUS and GIGABYTE for instance?

I just don't get it

saxon22 · Jun 2, 2012

Some machines are built to work 24/7 and some are not. One day you will get it.

WinstonTJ · Jun 2, 2012

Quote from johnkurtz:

What makes DELL so bulletproof? Do they utilize "special" components in their builds? How is their RAM, motherboards and HD's so superior to those from high quality brand manufacturers such as ASUS and GIGABYTE for instance?

I just don't get it

Every computer manufacturer has different levels of parts. Dell has everything from throw-away (or garbage) to top of the line servers. Dell's Precision line is essentially server-grade hardware in a robust desktop/workstation chassis. There is a massive difference between the machines & hardware that run Intel's Xeon CPU's and the regular "retail" CPU's.

HP has a factory outlet too... HP's workstations are just as robust but HP tends to 'option out' higher than Dell - meaning that HP usually comes with faster clock speed CPU, more memory, etc. Also for example, a Dell machine (take the T5400/T7400) was only available to be shipped with a 3.16ghz CPU whereas the similar HP machine (xw8600) could be purchased with a 3.2ghz CPU (dell = xeon x5460 vs. HP = xeon x5482). It may seem like a small difference but the x5482 is a far better CPU than the x5460... so I'll buy the cheap Dell & put the better CPU in it.

The difference is something made for home/retail vs. small business vs. enterprise.

To put it another way the difference is like trading on a home/retail platform (like etrade, schwab, scottrade, etc) vs. an IB or entry level prop firm vs. being colocated and getting direct data feeds.