Why would anyone care if a soldier was gay?
- Thread starter ChkitOut
- Start date
Based on my own experience onboard ship, that is untrue.
Issues of ANY kind involving sex are distruptive to a workplace. This is especially true in a military unit where you can't simply walk away from someone who shows an interest in a sexual relationship, or ignore someone who wants to aggressively display their sexual preferences.
Don't Ask Don't Tell was a good rule for everyone. It was stupid to overturn it.
Issues of any kind involving race, religion, lifestyle, sex, politics or any number of personal choices are often disruptive to a workplace.
So?
Don't we have soldiers trained to follow orders and just be focused on the task at hand?
Or do we have a bunch of emotionally driven adolescent people who have nothing better to do than to fight amongst themselves over what is really none of their business?
Why is it that most homophobes think gays want to have sex with them?
Sort of vain, isn't it? Homophobes really think some gay guy is going to come on to them? Why is that?
You think some gay guy in a group of straight men is going to risk getting a code red order from a Col. Jessup by acting in a way that is going to antagonize the group?
My guess is that like prison, there is a lot more gay sex going on in the military than any one is going to freely admit...
Guys are horny, and nothing but guys around...and you think it doesn't happen anyway?
Get over yourselves homophobes...the straights aren't the gays type anyway...they like gays, not straights...at least in a sexual way.
Seriously, be honest and ask yourself straight guys...how many times have you been hit on by a gay guy?
Gays like gays, not straights...so straights have nothing to worry about.
...unless of course the macho guys inside aren't as straight as they want every one else to think...
So?
Don't we have soldiers trained to follow orders and just be focused on the task at hand?
Or do we have a bunch of emotionally driven adolescent people who have nothing better to do than to fight amongst themselves over what is really none of their business?
Why is it that most homophobes think gays want to have sex with them?
Sort of vain, isn't it? Homophobes really think some gay guy is going to come on to them? Why is that?
You think some gay guy in a group of straight men is going to risk getting a code red order from a Col. Jessup by acting in a way that is going to antagonize the group?
My guess is that like prison, there is a lot more gay sex going on in the military than any one is going to freely admit...
Guys are horny, and nothing but guys around...and you think it doesn't happen anyway?
Get over yourselves homophobes...the straights aren't the gays type anyway...they like gays, not straights...at least in a sexual way.
Seriously, be honest and ask yourself straight guys...how many times have you been hit on by a gay guy?
Gays like gays, not straights...so straights have nothing to worry about.
...unless of course the macho guys inside aren't as straight as they want every one else to think...
Let me try to explain the best I can.
The military is unlike any workplace in existence. It is most likely not like where you work at right now.
The differences are is that anyone within a certain age can walk into the recruiters office and sign up. If they want Infantry then thats what they will probably get. There is no "interview process" like you have at most companies. Yeah, there is some basic testing, but that doesnt really screen the soldiers too well. Its not like at a real workplace where they can select among a bunch of candidates.
So the Captain, the LTs and the NCOS get stuck with whoever comes into their unit. They can't just say to the Army, "hey this guy sucks" and send him back or fire him. There are disciplinary actions and such, but basically you are stuck with that guy. So you have to work with him. Problem is that he is 18-19 years old and doesnt have a lot of experience at anything. He might be insecure or unconfident or unfocused. The officers and NCOs have a tough job as managers.
Now lets say you throw in gay relationships into a unit. Will it happen? Of course it will happen if two gay individuals are put into the same unit and there is that chemistry. It happens in combat support units all the time where females are mixed with males. Sometimes you might even walk in accidentally on a male/female soldier in the act. Many times women do get pregnant while deployed.
So lets say a gay relationship happens, then what? Well, then comes emotions and different new issues that these NCOS and Officers have to manage. They already have 18 year old Private Jones who cant seem to focus and is unconfident. On top of that, now they have to be the arbiters of a gay relationship which will ultimately happen. So the officers and NCOS will become distracted away from their command and training duties. They will most likely spend more time on these issues...time they dont really have.
Now lets take a moment and think. What if one of these gay relationships goes bad? What if the relationship is between two men in the same Platoon or work unit? Then there comes distraction. Not only will the two soldiers or sailors become distracted, but so will the rest of the unit. You can imagine what might happen during a firefight on the battlefield, but what about off the battlefield? There are certain individuals in the military trusted with high explosive weapons. What if they become unfocused while handling those weapons? What if an airplane mechanic becomes unfocused while doing their job?
Lets take a look at a real life example. The Battleship Iowa.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Iowa_turret_explosion
So the thing that the military worries about is distraction. Commanders need to be able to control these young adults. These same young adults are the ones that would normally get in trouble in college with drinking and drugs. You see how much harder it can be to control them under certain situations. What about the roughnecks or the gang members in these infantry platoons? If someone comes out and says "Im gay" then their safety might be in jeopardy.
Honestly, I believe there will be more bodies coming home as a result of all this.
The military is unlike any workplace in existence. It is most likely not like where you work at right now.
The differences are is that anyone within a certain age can walk into the recruiters office and sign up. If they want Infantry then thats what they will probably get. There is no "interview process" like you have at most companies. Yeah, there is some basic testing, but that doesnt really screen the soldiers too well. Its not like at a real workplace where they can select among a bunch of candidates.
So the Captain, the LTs and the NCOS get stuck with whoever comes into their unit. They can't just say to the Army, "hey this guy sucks" and send him back or fire him. There are disciplinary actions and such, but basically you are stuck with that guy. So you have to work with him. Problem is that he is 18-19 years old and doesnt have a lot of experience at anything. He might be insecure or unconfident or unfocused. The officers and NCOs have a tough job as managers.
Now lets say you throw in gay relationships into a unit. Will it happen? Of course it will happen if two gay individuals are put into the same unit and there is that chemistry. It happens in combat support units all the time where females are mixed with males. Sometimes you might even walk in accidentally on a male/female soldier in the act. Many times women do get pregnant while deployed.
So lets say a gay relationship happens, then what? Well, then comes emotions and different new issues that these NCOS and Officers have to manage. They already have 18 year old Private Jones who cant seem to focus and is unconfident. On top of that, now they have to be the arbiters of a gay relationship which will ultimately happen. So the officers and NCOS will become distracted away from their command and training duties. They will most likely spend more time on these issues...time they dont really have.
Now lets take a moment and think. What if one of these gay relationships goes bad? What if the relationship is between two men in the same Platoon or work unit? Then there comes distraction. Not only will the two soldiers or sailors become distracted, but so will the rest of the unit. You can imagine what might happen during a firefight on the battlefield, but what about off the battlefield? There are certain individuals in the military trusted with high explosive weapons. What if they become unfocused while handling those weapons? What if an airplane mechanic becomes unfocused while doing their job?
Lets take a look at a real life example. The Battleship Iowa.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Iowa_turret_explosion
So the thing that the military worries about is distraction. Commanders need to be able to control these young adults. These same young adults are the ones that would normally get in trouble in college with drinking and drugs. You see how much harder it can be to control them under certain situations. What about the roughnecks or the gang members in these infantry platoons? If someone comes out and says "Im gay" then their safety might be in jeopardy.
Honestly, I believe there will be more bodies coming home as a result of all this.
Either the commanders are able to control their men/women, or they aren't.
If there are breaking of rules, they are enforced.
Period.
It is not nearly as complicated as you try to make it.
Be serious, there are gay relationships right now in the military, in the NFL, in the NBA, etc.
So?
What makes you think the queer soldiers are now going to flaunt it in front of their commanders and other soldiers?
They are still a small minority, they aren't looking for trouble, or to be beaten up by a bunch of macho jar heads.
They have just as much right to be stupid and join the military to die needlessly at the whim of a politician as an straight guy...
Maybe you might look at it this way; the military will give a chance for those 18 year old homophobes to grow up and act like men, not teenage boys who are bigoted against gays.
Face it, gay sex exists, and while it may not be your preference...it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.
If a gay breaks the rule of relationships with another soldier, then just like a woman having sex with a male soldier and getting caught...they suffer the appropriate punishment.
Assuming you are not constantly raped by gay guys because they find you "so hot" you don't walk around in fear of gay guys raping you, right?
It is only a big deal when people make it a big deal. It really is no big deal, it is just sex.
Guys have guy on guy sex in prison...that makes it a big deal, or just sex because there are no women around they have sex with guys?
Nature will take care of things, don't worry your little head about the gays, they will keep to themselves just like straights keep to themselves...
Just like a right wing soldier can serve with a liberal soldier, just like a Jewish soldier can server with a Southern Baptist soldier...learning to accept differences and not fear them is actually part of becoming fully an adult...
If there are breaking of rules, they are enforced.
Period.
It is not nearly as complicated as you try to make it.
Be serious, there are gay relationships right now in the military, in the NFL, in the NBA, etc.
So?
What makes you think the queer soldiers are now going to flaunt it in front of their commanders and other soldiers?
They are still a small minority, they aren't looking for trouble, or to be beaten up by a bunch of macho jar heads.
They have just as much right to be stupid and join the military to die needlessly at the whim of a politician as an straight guy...
Maybe you might look at it this way; the military will give a chance for those 18 year old homophobes to grow up and act like men, not teenage boys who are bigoted against gays.
Face it, gay sex exists, and while it may not be your preference...it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.
If a gay breaks the rule of relationships with another soldier, then just like a woman having sex with a male soldier and getting caught...they suffer the appropriate punishment.
Assuming you are not constantly raped by gay guys because they find you "so hot" you don't walk around in fear of gay guys raping you, right?
It is only a big deal when people make it a big deal. It really is no big deal, it is just sex.
Guys have guy on guy sex in prison...that makes it a big deal, or just sex because there are no women around they have sex with guys?
Nature will take care of things, don't worry your little head about the gays, they will keep to themselves just like straights keep to themselves...
Just like a right wing soldier can serve with a liberal soldier, just like a Jewish soldier can server with a Southern Baptist soldier...learning to accept differences and not fear them is actually part of becoming fully an adult...
The issue is not if gays have a right to serve. Of course, everyone should have a right to serve. I am all for civil rights. However, the question is if Private Jones will be more likely to come home in a box as a result of this.
Will an Infantry or Armor unit, which is mostly composed of 18-23 year old uneducated men who come from all backgrounds, be able to focus and concentrate on their jobs. If an 18 year old runs into a tent to find two male soldiers in his Infantry unit fucking then what will happen to that unit? Then it becomes the topic of conversation and everyone is thinking about it when they should be thinking about how to aim that M16.
Before you come to a conclusion, then go to a soldier's funeral. Look at icasualties.org. Read up on the circumstances behind that soldier's death. Talk to their families. More then likely, the reason for the death was because someone lost focus and a mistake was made. Many of the deaths you see are from accidents where a young soldier lost focus and didnt do their job.
Ask yourself if a gay relationship in an Infantry unit would distract that large group of young men? Would it distract a bunch of young men in a college dormitory? I think it would.
So its not about gay rights, its about bringing home Private Jones safely to his family alive and not in that box.
Will an Infantry or Armor unit, which is mostly composed of 18-23 year old uneducated men who come from all backgrounds, be able to focus and concentrate on their jobs. If an 18 year old runs into a tent to find two male soldiers in his Infantry unit fucking then what will happen to that unit? Then it becomes the topic of conversation and everyone is thinking about it when they should be thinking about how to aim that M16.
Before you come to a conclusion, then go to a soldier's funeral. Look at icasualties.org. Read up on the circumstances behind that soldier's death. Talk to their families. More then likely, the reason for the death was because someone lost focus and a mistake was made. Many of the deaths you see are from accidents where a young soldier lost focus and didnt do their job.
Ask yourself if a gay relationship in an Infantry unit would distract that large group of young men? Would it distract a bunch of young men in a college dormitory? I think it would.
So its not about gay rights, its about bringing home Private Jones safely to his family alive and not in that box.
So following your "logic"
If the majority of men in a platoon hated blacks, or hated Muslims, or hated Jews with a passion, that platoon should not allow blacks, or Muslims, or Jews...
Try thinking...
You have little faith in the military if you think these young men can't be trained to do their job and keep their biases and bigotry to themselves...
If the majority of men in a platoon hated blacks, or hated Muslims, or hated Jews with a passion, that platoon should not allow blacks, or Muslims, or Jews...
Try thinking...
You have little faith in the military if you think these young men can't be trained to do their job and keep their biases and bigotry to themselves...
You sound like someone who has never been in management. I have been in management and its not as easy as it seems. Its not easy to control people. You have to persuade and cajole. You have to use charisma. If you think ordering someone about and giving them an Article 15 (non-judicial punishment) is going to keep people under control, then you have another thing coming.
A Captain has to keep control of 200 men and a LT 40 men. This is a large group of guys and its simply impossible to have total control over them. If only one guy becomes unfocused and he doesnt do his job, then that might mean 10 or more others dead.
If you have ever managed anyone before, then you would know its just not that easy to keep people under control especially young 18 year olds.
You sound like someone who has been in management and did not know how to handle subordinates...