Why Profitable Trading Is So Difficult

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macattack said:
I think it's almost impossible to try & follow somebody else's trading method. It seems like you can learn a few tips & tricks from other people, but you have to create your "own" method.
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On this point I totally agree.

I don't trade like Al Brooks, but my trading is based on several concepts I learned from him.

I don't trade like AustinP, but a video he posted a link to almost 4 years ago planted the seed that grew into my personal trading plan.

I don't trade like Bob Volman, but in a well-defined trend many of my entries can be taken right out of his book.

I don't trade like Bighog, but I trade off the same technical signals he does.

I don't trade like Redneck...

Wait...you know, it's actually quite possible that I do trade like Redneck. :p (Seriously, I owe that guy a million thanks for latching me onto the multiple chart idea.)
 
Bullshit. I know guys trading 50 cons on CL.

Bottom line---- if you know what your doing, and you've been trading for some time now, you should be well beyond one contract.

NoDoji said:
Piker size.

I love that phrase.

As if 99% of the members here have a true grasp of the leverage they're playing with when they trade a single futures contract.

CL is a highly leveraged and often volatile contract with a fraction of the liquidity of the S&P futures.

To put it into perspective:

Trading a single contract of CL controls 1000 barrels of oil.
Trading a single contract of CL is similar to trading 3000 shares of USO.
Trading a single contract of CL is similar to trading 8-10 contracts of NQ.

There's nothing wrong with trading "piker size" CL, no matter who you are. I trade piker size because I'm able to maintain a trader's mindset at a certain level of leverage.

When I want to play with more significant leverage, I swing trade options, and my downside is fixed.

And since we've brought Big Mike's into the thread, I'll tell you it's refreshing to have a forum where excellent moderation allows traders to maintain threads where pertinent information doesn't have to be meticulously mined out of pages of garbage.
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Since this thread is about why profitable trading is so difficult and there are non-pikers chiming in about how laughable it is for a profitable trader to trade piker size (which, for the purpose of this challenge, I'll define as less than 6 lots of CL, NG and 6E, less than 10 lots of ES, and less than 20 lots of NQ), I challenge any of the non-pikers here to post their trade log for today. There were many significant price swings in each of the futures contracts I mention above.

It would be a fantastic inspiration for everyone to see the level to which we should all aspire. :cool:
 
The reason why trading is so hard is because what worked yesterday might not work today because of "market behavior".. Trust me it's not your fault, it's just how the market is design.. The good thing is the market only trends or it's a range.. The bad thing is trying to find one strategy that fits all.. People love to talk about trends but the problem is we hardly have very strong trend days..

I have no problem with nodoji sprinkling ideas here and there. But, she needs to understand (and think she does) once you are out in the open people will criticize you.. But, she also needs to understand that sprinkling ideas isn't going to make anyone profitable.. I firmly believe no one can be a profitable trader by reading a book or reading what someone else wrote on a forum.. Do you think Micheal Jordon read a book on how to play basketball and then overnight he became the best? Do you think michael phelps read a book about swimming and somehow it made him the best over night? Do you really think you can read a book about how to be a Lawyer, and suddenly become a good lawyer over night?

Nodoji is cool and has a good heart from what I see..and I don't blame her if she doesn't want to share exactly how she trades.. But I do think some of her stuff is discretionary (she might not admit it).. and somewhat hard to teach unless you are inside her brain or watching her everyday... Just my opinion.
 
NoDoji said:
On this point I totally agree.

I don't trade like Al Brooks, but my trading is based on several concepts I learned from him.

I don't trade like AustinP, but a video he posted a link to almost 4 years ago planted the seed that grew into my personal trading plan.

I don't trade like Bob Volman, but in a well-defined trend many of my entries can be taken right out of his book.

I don't trade like Bighog, but I trade off the same technical signals he does.

I don't trade like Redneck...

Wait...you know, it's actually quite possible that I do trade like Redneck. :p (Seriously, I owe that guy a million thanks for latching me onto the multiple chart idea.)
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I think there are a few minor differences, the biggest being you’re more “technical” than I… (technical as in methodical about testing/ defining - I simply read it)

However I believe we could trade each other’s charts with no problem

I do think my chart may be a little more bare… for instance I start out each day with my 5 min blank (scrolled all the way to the left)

But from what I’ve seen – we see it pretty much the same – and any trades we take would make sense to the other

============

Damn this thread has sure morph into the bazaar

Shame for it held such potential

RN
 
MarketAddict said:
Nodoji is cool and has a good heart from what I see..and I don't blame her if she doesn't want to share exactly how she trades.. But I do think some of her stuff is discretionary (she might not admit it).. and somewhat hard to teach unless you are inside her brain or watching her everyday... Just my opinion.
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If ND is successful, and I have no reason to believe that she -- unlike some people -- isn't, it's that she understands behavior. She can go through all the gobbledygook about moving averages and triangles and whatever the hell else and what difference does it make? It's part of her process, and the bottom line is that she and I almost invariably end up in the same place, only for different reasons. Why? The only common denominator is our focus on what traders are doing. In fact, I suspect she could dump all that in the recycling bin and come out the other side doing exactly as well as she appears to be doing now because none of that is central to her understanding of and sensitivity to behavior.

The failures, on the other hand, don't have the least inkling of how price movement is a manifestation of behavior: of wants, desires, fears, greed, hopes, frustrations, anxieties, confusions. Because she has achieved an almost Zen level of calm detachment, she can observe all this in others and profit from their confusions et al. How can she scratch so easily and so readily? Because she has no emotional investment in the trade.

Those who trade their "feelings" instead of a consistently-profitable trading plan aren't going to understand this because their feelings are such a mess. But then their feelings are very likely a mess in their private lives as well.

Why do failures fail? Partly because they have no plan. But also partly, perhaps largely, because they're so uncentered they don't even know where center is.
 
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