Why must I lose?

cashmoney69 · Jul 10, 2008

Why is it that traders, both newly consistant and professionals

alike both have more losing trades than winning trades?....is it

possible, or better yet, does anyone know of someone that has

more winners than losers over several years?

Champion · Jul 10, 2008

Quote from cashmoney69:

Why is it that traders, both newly consistant and professionals

alike both have more losing trades than winning trades?....is it

possible, or better yet, does anyone know of someone that has

more winners than losers over several years?

Jeez, cashmoney you've been going since 2005 so why are you still talking dogshit? More losing trades than winning trades by consistent traders and professionals!!!!! That is not consistent and not professional. Also there are almost no professionals on ET.
You appear to live in a world of ignorance.

Why are you still on ET? No offence old pal, but hopeless cases usually disappear pretty quickly whereas you've been jacking around here for over 2 years.:eek:

Qwerty · Jul 10, 2008

So let me guess, you're grasping at straws because the market is puzzling you right? When you feel the market should rise, it does the opposite & vice versa? Is that about right?

It's possible to have many more winners & an occasional losing trade. Contact me & I'll gladly show you how it's possible.

nutmeg · Jul 10, 2008

does anyone know of someone that has

more winners than losers over several years?

-----------------------------------------

What will that prove? Just trade more money on the losers than on your higher % of winners and you'll still be down.

jeb9999 · Jul 11, 2008

Quote from cashmoney69:

Why is it that traders, both newly consistant and professionals

alike both have more losing trades than winning trades?....is it

possible, or better yet, does anyone know of someone that has

more winners than losers over several years?

Professionals have more losing trades than winning trades because they know how to take quick small losses and let their winners run.

hausse · Jul 11, 2008

I'd say that is due to cutting losses which is a necessity. Fairly close stops are triggered often, resulting in low win rates. One has to be right on direction and on timing and both can go wrong.

High win rate is psychologically nice but if one is interested in profitable trading and has an elephant hide then there are also other ways. One of my systems only has about 30% winners but they are 8.5x the size of the losers on average, as an example.

cashmoney69 · Jul 11, 2008

Quote from hausse:

I'd say that is due to cutting losses which is a necessity. Fairly close stops are triggered often, resulting in low win rates. One has to be right on direction and on timing and both can go wrong.

High win rate is psychologically nice but if one is interested in profitable trading and has an elephant hide then there are also other ways. One of my systems only has about 30% winners but they are 8.5x the size of the losers on average, as an example.

Yes, I trade Andrews Pitch fork set ups, and I can have great r/r..

usually 4:1, however because of the small stops, I get stopped

out more than I'd like too. This week I made 1440.00 before

giving back around 960. From personal experience, after I take a

trade I'll set a hard stop, then once I have a nice profit,

sometimes i'll either move my stop to breakeven or slightly

above to lockin some $, but more often than not, the pair (fx)

likes to retest my entries or the highs, which my stops are a few

pips behind..so I'd actually have a higher loss % if I were to set

my stops to breakeven. I'm up 71.6% ytd, so maybe I dont really

have anything to be upset about, but I'd just like to see more

green numbers on my journal than red ones. Not to sound

greedy.

hausse · Jul 11, 2008

Quote from cashmoney69:

Yes, I trade Andrews Pitch fork set ups, and I can have great r/r..

usually 4:1, however because of the small stops, I get stopped

out more than I'd like too. This week I made 1440.00 before

giving back around 960. From personal experience, after I take a

trade I'll set a hard stop, then once I have a nice profit,

sometimes i'll either move my stop to breakeven or slightly

above to lockin some $, but more often than not, the pair (fx)

likes to retest my entries or the highs, which my stops are a few

pips behind..so I'd actually have a higher loss % if I were to set

my stops to breakeven. I'm up 71.6% ytd, so maybe I dont really

have anything to be upset about, but I'd just like to see more

green numbers on my journal than red ones. Not to sound

greedy.

Nice trading!

Maybe you'd fare better by putting your stops some distance below breakeven or even better ignoring breakeven altogether and determine some objective stop rule. You could check past trades to see if that would be beneficial. I observed that people often have an irrational liking for breakeven stops. Many things that feel good are unfavorable in trading, IMO. Sacrificing a shining win rate - which is quite irrelevant anyway - in exchange for catching large moves has served me well.

It is also important to be able to execute one's strategy. So if operating the way you do is what you do well then that is cool but trying to improve is never wrong.

ProfitTakgFool · Jul 11, 2008

This is not necessarily true. I have a long-term win rate above 90% but the answer to your question is because traders put far too much emphasis on timing.

Quote from cashmoney69:

Why is it that traders, both newly consistant and professionals

alike both have more losing trades than winning trades?....is it

possible, or better yet, does anyone know of someone that has

more winners than losers over several years?

pulsescan · Jul 11, 2008

Quote from ProfitTakgFool:

This is not necessarily true. I have a long-term win rate above 90% but the answer to your question is because traders put far too much emphasis on timing.

Timing is key.

But you must act precisely or you will incur more risk. Stops need to be extremely wide so that you can ride the volatility in the market. All you need is to be on the right side of the move and the money will take care of itself. scared money don't make money.

Bears make money

Bulls make money

pigs get slaughtered!