Nothing against you VINDAGO, but I can't help but wonder what traders mean when they say keep it simple. I know you can't speak for others, but do you mean simple leads to profitability and/or leads to making a good living at trading? I don't necessarily believe in "more complex" the better...either. My experience with simplicity led me to being profitable, but did not allow me to make a good living. UNIQUE best describes my path to making a good living. If you and some of the other traders make a good living with simplicity...that's awesome, but is there an element of uniqueness to your methodology? I just can't believe the MAJORITY of the profitable "keep it simple" traders make a good living without some unique element to it. It seems that market condition changes would overwhelm a strait simplicity approach. I'm speaking only of directional/intraday trading...not option selling or arbitrage approaches,etc.. Could it be that YOU are the unique element of your trading method? I definitely agree with focusing on the process and trading small while going through the learning curve! THANKS
Why Is The Obvious Not So Obvious?
- Thread starter nysestocks
- Start date
VO can of course answer for himself, but here are some of my thoughts.
Many think they can make a living from trading with small money, and how they came to think that way is obvious, due to the media and advertising by those who sell.
If you have $100K to spare, you have a much better chance of making money trading, than if you have $10k with a margin account, and use high leverage.
1% return on $100k is $1k.
If you keep it simple, as in risk (max risk) no more than 0.25% to 0.5% per trade, it is very easy make 1% return per week.
Can you live on $1k per week, well, if you can't you have been sucked in like most to borrowing loads of money, working endless hours for someone else, and probably have a wife who likes to keep up with the Jones'.
Frugality is common sense, but in today's world most people are unable to think for themselves, which is another whole discussion.
Key to any success is to start small, learn what is required, ignore everyone else in relation to what they have, or have not, and most importantly, understand that wisdom only comes with age, but for most it comes too late in life, mainly due to idiotic ways of thinking.
This is why, trading is 99.99% mental, and the act of trading is the easy peasy bit.
So, yes, in a way you are correct, it is all about YOU, but not the way you might think it is!
J_S
Many think they can make a living from trading with small money, and how they came to think that way is obvious, due to the media and advertising by those who sell.
If you have $100K to spare, you have a much better chance of making money trading, than if you have $10k with a margin account, and use high leverage.
1% return on $100k is $1k.
If you keep it simple, as in risk (max risk) no more than 0.25% to 0.5% per trade, it is very easy make 1% return per week.
Can you live on $1k per week, well, if you can't you have been sucked in like most to borrowing loads of money, working endless hours for someone else, and probably have a wife who likes to keep up with the Jones'.
Frugality is common sense, but in today's world most people are unable to think for themselves, which is another whole discussion.
Key to any success is to start small, learn what is required, ignore everyone else in relation to what they have, or have not, and most importantly, understand that wisdom only comes with age, but for most it comes too late in life, mainly due to idiotic ways of thinking.
This is why, trading is 99.99% mental, and the act of trading is the easy peasy bit.
So, yes, in a way you are correct, it is all about YOU, but not the way you might think it is!
J_S
BC, I agree 100% with all J_S just wrote.
I will just add from my experience that being consistently profitable is the key to make a good living with Trading as once consistency is achieved it becomes a matter of Capital and fine tuning to start making the good money.
What I mean by simplicity in trading, at least for me, is to isolate the few simple facts that are true 90% of the time for the instrument I trade from the noise of other things that happens, than trade these simple facts and be ready for the 10% of the time that things goes differently.
This has become possible only after long hours watching the screen live for the instrument I decided to trade doing so I start to get a "feeling" for PA, I have identified few simple facts that are true 90% of the time and how to recognize when i am in the remaining 10% of the time so that I can either take advantage of the situation or most likely get the hell out of my trade.
At the end I am becoming a human analog computer that uses the holistic abilities of the human brain to reverse engineer the Algo that move price.
This is my way and as it is working for me I am fine with it.
Regs,
VO
I will just add from my experience that being consistently profitable is the key to make a good living with Trading as once consistency is achieved it becomes a matter of Capital and fine tuning to start making the good money.
What I mean by simplicity in trading, at least for me, is to isolate the few simple facts that are true 90% of the time for the instrument I trade from the noise of other things that happens, than trade these simple facts and be ready for the 10% of the time that things goes differently.
This has become possible only after long hours watching the screen live for the instrument I decided to trade doing so I start to get a "feeling" for PA, I have identified few simple facts that are true 90% of the time and how to recognize when i am in the remaining 10% of the time so that I can either take advantage of the situation or most likely get the hell out of my trade.
At the end I am becoming a human analog computer that uses the holistic abilities of the human brain to reverse engineer the Algo that move price.
This is my way and as it is working for me I am fine with it.
Regs,
VO
its been a while..time for smile
as life not long..not much song
so many seek..what is so bleek
but only so..cause they don't know
to make some cash..do not be rash
most speak of things..that never brings
why it so tough..this trading stuff
it will be so..unless YOU say NO
they speak of trend..and waves that bend
of forms that look..taken from book
but one thing sure..it is not pure
just thoughts you see..from many be
a thought outside..can be miles wide
as came from head..not in your bed
History do show..what few do know
and reason clear..for those who peer
your head is tight..to guide you right
but works in way..from words you say
so to advance..snap out of trance
next time you think..look into ink
the goal it be..to make money
but fore you add..you can't be sad
if risk too tall..you will stay small
so use your mind..be one of kind
J_S
as life not long..not much song
so many seek..what is so bleek
but only so..cause they don't know
to make some cash..do not be rash
most speak of things..that never brings
why it so tough..this trading stuff
it will be so..unless YOU say NO
they speak of trend..and waves that bend
of forms that look..taken from book
but one thing sure..it is not pure
just thoughts you see..from many be
a thought outside..can be miles wide
as came from head..not in your bed
History do show..what few do know
and reason clear..for those who peer
your head is tight..to guide you right
but works in way..from words you say
so to advance..snap out of trance
next time you think..look into ink
the goal it be..to make money
but fore you add..you can't be sad
if risk too tall..you will stay small
so use your mind..be one of kind
J_S
VINDAGO...would you agree that your ability to be "intuitive" during that "10% of the time" is the UNIQUE element of your methodology and is crucial to your consistency...so crucial that without it, you would lose your ability to make a living and/or lose "elite trader" status...even if the "90%" of the simple facts continue? I have my own personal history book of market conditions and volatility changes...all documented like blue prints. It requires "intuitive/unique" mental approach to conclude what condition/volatility is forming in the market and then match the most optimal "fact based" setup to it...without this...no consistency...no making a living! My point is, is your intuition during the "10% of time" not so simple after all...yet without it, it kills much of the "90% simple facts" to a detriment? I'm trying to help newbies with the question of...what is a typical ratio of logic:art approach to trading for successful traders, and that it's possible that trading is never "simple". For me, it's difficult to measure because I use the art part infrequently, but without it...I have nothing! THANKS!
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BC, I totally agree and I have the F...ing proof, unfortunately!
After a great couple of months trading with almost no day at a loss, went on vacation for 10 days, I came back and told myself: I need a few days w/o trading to get in synch with the market, unfortunately i did not follow my own advice and...I ended up in that 10% situation on the wrong side of the market, now I am in a couple of bad trades that will not get any better anytime soon, so over the weekend I elaborated the loss and Monday I will get out (way later than I should have) with my losses as I know for a fact that I was in the hope area, which is the worst place you can be together with the greed area...
So, Intuition or market reading is the key element in my trading but there is another key element that is necessary and that I will never stop developing: feeling recognition since I know that as as soon as I enter the Hope/Fear/Greed area it is time to get out of my trade no matter what!!!
VO
After a great couple of months trading with almost no day at a loss, went on vacation for 10 days, I came back and told myself: I need a few days w/o trading to get in synch with the market, unfortunately i did not follow my own advice and...I ended up in that 10% situation on the wrong side of the market, now I am in a couple of bad trades that will not get any better anytime soon, so over the weekend I elaborated the loss and Monday I will get out (way later than I should have) with my losses as I know for a fact that I was in the hope area, which is the worst place you can be together with the greed area...
So, Intuition or market reading is the key element in my trading but there is another key element that is necessary and that I will never stop developing: feeling recognition since I know that as as soon as I enter the Hope/Fear/Greed area it is time to get out of my trade no matter what!!!
VO
Thanks for responding and GOOD LUCK with those positions! I hate that HOPE feeling too!
The whole purpose of trading is to make money, not lose it!
It really does not matter what way you trade, once you end up making money each day, week, or month, based on your chosen time frame due to your circumstances and available time.
It can be best to forget about everyone else, take everything you read with a pinch of salt, and realize that profit is not real profit until the trade is closed.
If you panic when you are trading, you will find it very hard to make any money.
It is best to take every trade as a loser from the word go, that way, if you lose you will not be disappointed, and will also not risk too much on an individual trade.
Made some bad trades(mobile phone
) and some good ones(PC) here, but lost on none of them, which is the main thing, as that means some money was made.
You will never go broke taking profits!
If you can't make small money, you sure as hell won't be able to make big money!
J_S
It really does not matter what way you trade, once you end up making money each day, week, or month, based on your chosen time frame due to your circumstances and available time.
It can be best to forget about everyone else, take everything you read with a pinch of salt, and realize that profit is not real profit until the trade is closed.
If you panic when you are trading, you will find it very hard to make any money.
It is best to take every trade as a loser from the word go, that way, if you lose you will not be disappointed, and will also not risk too much on an individual trade.
Made some bad trades(mobile phone
) and some good ones(PC) here, but lost on none of them, which is the main thing, as that means some money was made. You will never go broke taking profits!
If you can't make small money, you sure as hell won't be able to make big money!
J_S