Why Is The Obvious Not So Obvious?

[The Expert]

Quote from macattack:

Why does my stop order always get hit when I move it to breakeven?

Doesn't matter how far away it is; it's like a magnet.

Simple MK, YOU are moving it at the wrong TIME, for, as we keep saying, TIME = MONEY

Now, ponder this, and go back and look at your trades where the stop was hit.

What would have happened if YOU had re-entered after your stop was hit?

When you are targeting GOOD money, commissions do not matter, really, so, if you are piddly pissin around worrying about a few $ in comms, then, odds are you will never master the art of taking money from thick idiots

The wind can change direction very fast, and, so must a trader if the need be such!

Remember the child who can make money trading, and says;

"Look Daddy, it's going UP so I am going to BUY it, and, when it stops going up and starts to come down, I am going to SELL it"

"Can I keep the money Daddy, when I make it?"

"Son, you can KEEP all the money you make, but, ALWAYS remember, it is not YOURS until you take it out and put it in YOUR back pocket"

"Thx Daddy, and I will give you some of it for bringing me into this kind and generous world"

" It's OK Son, for Daddy does not need the money, but, if YOU like YOU can give some to your Mammy, as SHE is the one who had to do the REAL hard work"

TE

 

[Celine]

Quote from macattack:

Why does my stop order always get hit when I move it to breakeven?

Doesn't matter how far away it is; it's like a magnet.

That's funny, I have the same problem, lol

 

[Mysteron]

Quote from The Expert:

Hmm, whilst Ftrs are not a must for daytradig stocks, watching them can help with placing some low risk trades if you have not done your homework in time:eek:

Remember the drunk form Down Under, and how he rightly said that divergence with Cash & Ftrs is good sign AT CERTAIN LEVELS

Did you find that little book I told you about MN, remember, as I am nearly certain it was YOU, but if not, then I must apologize and send you the name of it?

If you are watching the S&P cash only, then add a chart for the NYSE Composite Index, and LOOK if you can see any divergence between the S&P Cash and the broader market.

You also need to watch the Tick Tock for daytrading, but, always remember that its chime plays a sweeter tune at certain times

Tick Tock Tick Tock
Listen Listen
Else You Missin
And End Up Pissin

Know The Diff
Keep It Stiff
Play You Must
Else you Go Bust

When Chime Is High
And in The Sky
Watch The Major
To See If Favor

Roll The Dice
Keep It Nice
When In Tune
Come $$$$ Soon

TE

I've read BR, thanks. I'll have to use free stock charts to view NYSE Composite Index and $TICK as my broker doesn't supply those either. I'm not sure if either is delayed though. In fact I'm not familiar with how to use $TICK so I'll do some research.

 

[macattack]

Quote from The Expert:

Simple MK, YOU are moving it at the wrong TIME, for, as we keep saying, TIME = MONEY

Now, ponder this, and go back and look at your trades where the stop was hit.

What would have happened if YOU had re-entered after your stop was hit?

When you are targeting GOOD money, commissions do not matter, really, so, if you are piddly pissin around worrying about a few $ in comms, then, odds are you will never master the art of taking money from thick idiots

The wind can change direction very fast, and, so must a trader if the need be such!

Remember the child who can make money trading, and says;

"Look Daddy, it's going UP so I am going to BUY it, and, when it stops going up and starts to come down, I am going to SELL it"

"Can I keep the money Daddy, when I make it?"

"Son, you can KEEP all the money you make, but, ALWAYS remember, it is not YOURS until you take it out and put it in YOUR back pocket"

"Thx Daddy, and I will give you some of it for bringing me into this kind and generous world"

" It's OK Son, for Daddy does not need the money, but, if YOU like YOU can give some to your Mammy, as SHE is the one who had to do the REAL hard work"

TE

I actually did re-enter my best trade today right after being stopped out.

One other really difficult part of trading is knowing when to cash out & when to hold on. If you keep cashing out every time you are up a bit you end up with small winners which are easily negated by a couple average losers.

Of course it seems the times you don't cash out your small winners quickly disappear; the times you do cash out are the times it keeps running.

My biggest winners have been when I entered a trade, put in a stop and a target and walked away for an hour or so. If I had stayed in front of the screen I would have probably been fooled and cashed out long before my target was reached.

 

[The Expert]

Quote from macattack:

I actually did re-enter my best trade today right after being stopped out.

One other really difficult part of trading is knowing when to cash out & when to hold on. If you keep cashing out every time you are up a bit you end up with small winners which are easily negated by a couple average losers.

Of course it seems the times you don't cash out your small winners quickly disappear; the times you do cash out are the times it keeps running.

My biggest winners have been when I entered a trade, put in a stop and a target and walked away for an hour or so. If I had stayed in front of the screen I would have probably been fooled and cashed out long before my target was reached.

Well MK, I am not sure if you said it before, but, from the way you are speaking it is clear that you are trading Ftrs.

Never do something just because you HAVE TO:eek:

There is always another way of doing things, but, very few will put the time and effort into finding the best solution.

Having traded many markets, for many years, daytrading US stocks is one of the least risky ways of daytrading, far less risky than daytrading Ftrs, for OBVIOUS reasons.

Risk control is ALWAYS the first priority when gambling, so, the first real job for any real gambler should be to find and utilize the least risky way of gambling. Once the process has been chosen, it is just a matter of fine tuning the variables to get the odds on your side.

Know that a real gambler will ALWAYS have winners and losers, for that is part of gambling, but, it is the SIZE of the winners versus the losers that matter most.

As I have demonstrated in the past, you can do 5 trades in a day, have 4 losers, and still come out making GOOD money, for, that is the REALITY of daytrading, but, knowing what is REAL and doing what is REAL, are not one and the same.

Know this, no one gives a shit about YOU when it comes to making money, so, YOU MUST not give a shit about anyone, and, YOU MUST look on all other traders as idiots who you are going to take GOOD money from

Knowing + Doing = $$$$$$

TE

 

[RedDuke]

Quote from The Expert:

... Having traded many markets, for many years, daytrading US stocks is one of the least risky ways of daytrading, far less risky than daytrading Ftrs, for OBVIOUS reasons. ...

Totally disagree with this post. Can you please explain why, you think trading stocks is less risky than trading index futures.

 

[The Expert]

Quote from RedDuke:

Totally disagree with this post. Can you please explain why, you think trading stocks is less risky than trading index futures.

Why is trading stocks less risky than index futures?

1. Spread

2. Order Routing

3. Market Makers / Specialists

4. Rebates

5. Sectors

6. Pension Funds

 

[RedDuke]

Quote from The Expert:

Why is trading stocks less risky than index futures?

1. Spread

2. Order Routing

3. Market Makers / Specialists

4. Rebates

5. Sectors

6. Pension Funds

1) Major liquid index futures have 1 tick spread, can not beat that

2) This is a disadvantage with stocks, since the market is difragmented, and you will need to know in which situation which routing to use. With futures, just one exchange

3) I am surprised you think this is an advantage. With all these HFT shops around, and with sub penning, flash orders and so on, this actually is a huge disadvantage, especially if one trade manually and can not compete with extremely expensive hardware.

4) This is a good plus, if one does decent volume

5) Not sure what you mean here

6) Once again not sure what this means. If you talk about tracing volume, the real decent size is hidden in dark pools these days.

With all of the above. Socks are not safer or a better vehicle. Each one has its pluses and minuses.

Futures, however do provide a more level playing field to a small trader, plus they are much more advantageous when paying taxes.

Regards,
redduke

 

[The Expert]

Quote from RedDuke:

1) Major liquid index futures have 1 tick spread, can not beat that

2) This is a disadvantage with stocks, since the market is difragmented, and you will need to know in which situation which routing to use. With futures, just one exchange

3) I am surprised you think this is an advantage. With all these HFT shops around, and with sub penning, flash orders and so on, this actually is a huge disadvantage, especially if one trade manually and can not compete with extremely expensive hardware.

4) This is a good plus, if one does decent volume

5) Not sure what you mean here

6) Once again not sure what this means. If you talk about tracing volume, the real decent size is hidden in dark pools these days.

With all of the above. Socks are not safer or a better vehicle. Each one has its pluses and minuses.

Futures, however do provide a more level playing field to a small trader, plus they are much more advantageous when paying taxes.

Regards,
redduke

1. Major stocks have 1 cent spread, and less, can't beat that.

2. Auto routing (with right broker) gets best offer / bid from several exchanges.

3. It is only an advantage if you know how to use them to your advantage.

4. Some traders just trade volume for rebates.

5. Money moves from one sector to another.

6. Pension funds can not sell short, as it is too risky

7. You have a very large pool of high probability candidates to choose form.

8. You can "predict" the future price movement of "certain stocks" based on the index futures contracts.

Futures are highly leveraged products and are not for those with small money to be messing around in the markets with:eek:

There is a time and a place for everything.

Cash is KING.

Taxes are but part of the business, and, there is more than one way to reduce your tax bill

TE

 

[pairsarbtooo]

pension funds do certainly sell short....i don't know where you came up with this gem...but you are incorrect.

certain ira accounts cannot be sold short, maybe you are confused.

the retirees are not really concerned with how they get their return, as long as they get it

and despite the bad press of a few hedge fund blow ups...hedge funds generally earn excellent returns.

the bias is that individuals have to be qualified investors to invest in hedge funds...but as a whole the mass dollars in a pension certainly qualifies.

these kind of comments speak strongly to the lack of financial and trading knowledge prevalent in this thread...most of this stuff has nothing to do with profitable trading...its theoretical nonsense, and much of it is even incorrect, even before it has no practical application.