Why is it scarier to spend money when you have it, then when you dont?

[intradaybill]

Quote from peilthetraveler:

This is what i notice...broke people love to spend money and put everything on their credit cards. By broke i mean people living paycheck to paycheck. Now I have 10s of thousands just in my savings, and im scared to make any luxury purchase over 300 dollars.

You aks the question and you also provide the answer. The answer is simpler than most people think:

You are rich because you are cheap.

 

[Sandybestdog]

Quote from peilthetraveler: Sandybestdog, Wow, thats a great post. It brings me back memories of my first job at mcdonalds. (where i was making 4.40 per hour and happy that i was making 15 cents an hour more than min wage) When i worked in the drive thru, I could tell the poor people from the rich people( or even middle class) The rich/middle class generally had their order ready at the speaker and when they got to the window they had their money ready. The poor people (even though they ate at mcdonalds 3 times a week) never knew what they wanted. It was like someone else drove them there and they just woke up and were told they were at mcdonalds and surprised that they had to order right then. Also, just like with your pizza orders, they were yelling. To this day, i still remember this black guy yelling into the speaker ordering french fries and saying to me "Nigga, i want my shit hot!" (i'm like wtf? im white!) Then when they got to the window to pay, even though they had been waiting in line for 5 minutes to get to the window, they still dont have their wallet out and they dont know how much it is for the food. Or even worse...they start ordering more food AFTER they hand me the money. For instance...they ordered something and it came to 4.50....they hand me a 5 dollar bill then start ordering 3 more dollars worth of food. Some of the more unscrupulous ones would try to tell me they gave me a $20 bill, or pull that scam where they try to give you different money, ask for the original money back and get you confused. Some of them even had the nerve to laugh at me because i worked at mcdonalds even though they were most likely unemployed. Boy...i sure hated that job for the whole 11 months i had it.

Thanks. It’s funny how we’ve had the same experiences. Except I’ve been doing it for a lot longer than 11 months. I don’t think the dumb customers I dealt with were as smart as yours. The most they really tried was saying they got the wrong pizza or it took too long and they want it free. Of course you then bring them a new pizza for free and ask for the old one, and of course they ate it. How come they ate the pizza that they supposedly didn’t want? But most of the problems are with stupid employees not caring. They don’t ask the customer for their address and I waste 30 minutes going to the wrong address and then the right one and I ask them why they can’t get the right address and even show them how and what questions to ask the customer and they get mad at me tell me they don’t give a crap. Then the manager says she’s leaving and doesn’t care. I’m made out to be the bad guy when their the ones who screwed up.

You know it’s so great to have a change of pace from the restaurant. Working at the golf course now, I am around good, honest people who are helpful and nice. It seems everybody is there to do a good job and the customers are really great as well. What a world of difference.

 

[Sandybestdog]

Quote from Cutten: That's like saying who'd pay $30 for a bottle of wine, or $300 on a pair of shoes, or $75k on a Porsche. Higher quality and luxury goods generally sell at a premium. Yeah they're not silk but a $90 pair of jeans from a decent company will generally fit and look better than a pair at $30. Now paying $300 for the same quality jeans but with a load of holes and rips in it, I agree that's dumb as hell

I can tell you these clothes are not higher quality. It’s all in the name. He’s given me a bunch of clothes and shoes and there is nothing special about them. It’s like those $400 North Face jackets that all the poor people get now. Anybody who tells you they got one because their good jackets, is lying in my opinion. They got them because everybody else has one and that’s why it costs so much.

Now obviously there is a difference between paying for higher quality goods and $100 jeans with rips and holes in it because that’s the style and name brand. The golf course I work at charges like $300 for a guest to play, I think. While that’s expensive and I’d rather play a public course 10 times for that price, I can see why someone would want to do that.

 

[Sandybestdog]

Quote from peilthetraveler: This is an excellent point, but i think it goes deeper than that. I think its the whole "I want it now" attitude. People who want everything now, spend everything now. Its also the reason why poor people are more likely to be adicted to drugs. They want that high feeling now and do not want to wait until they get to a place in there life where they just feel good all the time. I think when you delay your gratification, it makes you wealthier. Like if you want something and you decide to put money away and save for it...then when you have finally saved for it, sometimes you find that you dont really want it as much, which has happened to me when i wanted to buy a new computer, or a new TV. I put money aside every month, and when i actually had that hard saved cash in my hand i was like...why do i want to blow it on something i already have? So i put that cash away in some investment and save for the next thing i want.

I don’t think it’s a “want it now” attitude. Like I said before when you have no hope, when everything seems so out of reach, then you just spend what you have. You don’t care. Think about it. It used to be a father could go down to the local factory, work 40-50 hours and support his wife, 2.4 kids and dog, buy a small house with a white picket fence and retire with a nice pension. Well those jobs are gone. Now somebody has to go to college, go thousands in debt, maybe tap some credit cards to cover expense, then graduate and maybe get an entry level job and hope you don’t get laid off, get outsourced, or get replaced by a cheaper immigrant. When it takes that much just to survive, why bother trying? Besides, if someone spends money now, at least it’s not getting eaten up by inflation if they instead tried to save it.

I know this personally. I used to work like crazy and try to save money. I used that to start a few businesses and trade with. After 7 years, I’m broker than ever. All that hard work and saving got me nothing (maybe a lot of experience). I have more tax write offs than I know what to do with. I know the key is not to make money, but to make your money work for you to make more money, so why bother working to make money when I haven’t figured out how to use it to make more money? Labor value and purchasing power is constantly being eroded away, so if you can’t figure out a way to make more money using money, then why bother trying? Your climbing an uphill battle. Just spend the money you have now and at least you’ll enjoy it now.

Oh and I think this also ties in to drugs and alcohol. You are much more likely to keep better care of your body when you have something to live for. I have noticed this while working at the golf course. In the rich area that it’s located, I have not seen one fat person. I have also seen very few, shall we say, not the greatest of looking people. There are sidewalks everywhere and people are always biking and jogging. These people have a life to live and something to look forward to. For poor people, it doesn’t have to be a country club membership or new mansion that you’re working towards. It could be something as small as buying a car to go to work in or working towards a promotion at work. But again when these things seem so out of reach, you’re likely to not even bother trying. Obviously there will always be people who get addicted to drugs and are lazy, but for a lot of people, making things more achievable will provide all the incentive needed.

 

[Sandybestdog]

Quote from Persdawg: haha. good post indeed! I'm the same way anytime I use a coupon...Always order above and beyond just because the coupon is helping me take the hit.

That's great. Use the coupons and take any advantage of the company any way you can while not burdening the employees. Order online too. There's usually good specials there. Just remember to take care of the driver!

 

[Sandybestdog]

Quote from drcha: Disclaimer--I'm admitting that I'm one of the people like those in the book. Yes, driving around in a dirty old Toyota, sitting on a 20 year old couch and buying clothes from the Lands End catalog. I think that any of my friends would be shocked to know what my bank account looks like. Once again, no need to enlighten them! And yes, when the pizza guy comes to the door I do have a coupon (and a very nice tip) all ready.

Keep the coupon. The driver will never ask for it unless you don’t tip him, or management is making him get it. One time the place I was working wanted us to start collecting coupons. One day I got back from a run and the manager asked me where the coupon was. I said the customer gave it to me and I gave it back to him and told him to use it again. She nearly freaked. I said Oh, no God forbid someone uses the coupon again and we make more money. No we don’t want that. I don’t think she figured that out.

Yea I’d probably would like to be like you one day too. When I go to work now, the parking lot is littered with Mercedes and BMW’s. Everyday I’ll see at least 1 or 2 ”other” cars (Rolls Royce, Ferrari, Bentley). They don’t really interest me. My 1992 Camry gets me from point a to point b just fine. Although I do have to say that when I see a brand new Rolls Royce convertible, I start to question whether I’d want one of those or Jessica Alba. It’s a hard pick really. Can’t say.

 

[TrueProp]

Quote from marketsurfer:

that's called an addict, not a trader.

Nope. A trader that is addicted to trading for the sake of trading is called a soon-to-be former trader. Addicted traders trade for the sake of trading -- not to make money.

I'm not afraid to take vacations. I've taken two in the past 2 months with another one coming up this month. Still, the thought of missing a trade that I could make $100K+ in less than 3 minutes aggravates me. I'll be trading via wi-fi in the airport terminal on my laptop. Lol.

 

[TrueProp]

Quote from Sandybestdog:

I can tell you these clothes are not higher quality. It’s all in the name. He’s given me a bunch of clothes and shoes and there is nothing special about them. It’s like those $400 North Face jackets that all the poor people get now. Anybody who tells you they got one because their good jackets, is lying in my opinion. They got them because everybody else has one and that’s why it costs so much.

Now obviously there is a difference between paying for higher quality goods and $100 jeans with rips and holes in it because that’s the style and name brand. The golf course I work at charges like $300 for a guest to play, I think. While that’s expensive and I’d rather play a public course 10 times for that price, I can see why someone would want to do that.

I didn't read your post about whoever gave you whatever brand/type of apparel. For some more expensive items of clothing, there is a clear difference in the quality of the material used, and the way in which the item is cut. The cut definitely makes for a better fit in many cases. I'll wear my cashmere sweaters every winter day versus wearing a cotton or nylon stitch. And FYI, I may be wearing it under a North Face jacket thank you very much!

You work on a golf course. You should be able to tell the difference between a nice button-up a shirt and a not so nice button-up shirt. Either way, everyone isn't really into clothes and how they look in their clothes. I care depending on where I'm going. If I'm going into the office, I don't care at all.

I would say that having taste is like trading acumen, you either have it or you don't...BUT, taste can be acquired via exposure. Trading ability on the other hand, not so much.

 

[Kevmeister]

Quote from Sandybestdog:

These people have a life to live and something to look forward to. But again when these things seem so out of reach, you’re likely to not even bother trying.

The rich people you referenced in sentence one did not have the attitude you have in sentence two.

 

[Sandybestdog]

Quote from TrueProp: They are really dumb? Interesting that you think that people from the ghetto would have money to even purchase internet services. It's pretty dumb that you can't spell hardly properly.

I hardley think that the fact that can’t hardley spell “hardley” correct, hardley disqualifies anything else I might say.

Quote from TrueProp: They're used to bitching about everything? Which one of the 3 things that you feel like saying to them would NOT be considered bitching?

Are you talking about my 3 suggestions to them being bitching? I don’t see how you can say that. #1 if people don’t tip me, they are not paying for my services. That is stealing from me. If your employer didn’t pay you one Friday, you’d be bitching to. So I don’t see what’s wrong with me suggesting that they don’t order delivery unless they pay for it. They can always pick it up. Of course I don’t say this to them, because I’d probably get fired, but it doesn’t mean I can’t think it. #2 What’s wrong with suggesting that they go online or use a coupon? I’m trying to help them. What do I care if they use a coupon? #3 If I only had $20 in my pocket, I don’t think I’d be spending it on a full service pizza. If I really wanted one, I’d go get a frozen one and cook it, but that’s just me.

Quote from TrueProp: You feel guilty using a coupon to get something for free so you spend money? Makes no sense to me at all. Do you buy a drink on SouthWest Airlines when you turn in a free drink ticket because you feel guilty?

If Southwest gave you a coupon, I’m guessing that is because you bought a plane ticket. So you paid for the drink anyways. I just don’t believe in getting something for nothing. There are only 3 people in this world in my opinion. Givers, takers, and self sustainers. If I pay for something because I’m getting something else for free, I guess that make me a giver. If you just get something for free, that makes you a taker. So in the end all I’m doing is paying for your taking.

Quote from TrueProp: Even though I can understand where you are trying to go with your post and I agree with your underlying reasoning (I don't feel it was articulated very well at all), I disagree wholeheartedly with your blanket generalizations of the reasoning abilities of the different economic classes. I find what you said very condescending and closed-minded -- especially for a pizza delivery man or a caddy. The idea that any type of class of people all act the same way is just flat out incredibly, emphatically wrong! Judging from your present career situation, I'm guessing that you didn't come from one of the best economic upbringings as a child. It seems like you should understand that the socio-economic factors that cause people to be in dire financial circumstances are, in many cases, beyond their control. Some of these school kids cannot even take their school books home because the school won't allow them to do it! I've watched parents check their kids math homework (they're making an effort to help at least) and they have no idea what they're doing! I'm not letting people off of the hook here and saying that people aren't responsible for their results, but a little understanding goes a long way. I've had to accept this, especially after mentoring a few young children from "the ghetto", as you call it. I'm an Ralph Waldo Emerson, self-reliant, bootstrapper, that believes if you commit yourself to something you can do anything. At the same time, I realize that I was brought up by parents that hammered that home to me my entire life and that made it a second nature of thinking for me. My parents are from that "ghetto" that you speak of. They made great successes of themselves. They are the outlier. They had parents that worked hard everyday and hammered that home to them and they passed it on to me -- again, they are the outlier. Many of these people were raised in situations where they don't have two parents that try to engender the principles of hard work, goal-setting and the importance of education. Many times they don't have two parents at all, and the one they do have doesn't set a very good example anyway! All I'm saying is that during my life I've had to deal with obstacles. We all have had obstacles in life -- especially in becoming a profitable trader (7 months of obstacles for me)! But the obstacles I had as a kid pale...PALE in comparison to what some of the people in lower income brackets were forced to face, and in some cases overcome. Be grateful that you are blessed with the opportunity to see both sides of the tracks and that you can learn from each of them accordingly.

There’s a difference between ghetto and poor. I’m broke now, but at least when I go to McDonald’s, I’m polite and know what I want. I don’t critisize people for being from the ghetto, I’ll critisize people for the way they act. My parents lived paycheck to paycheck for many years in our small townhouse.

I guess I pretty much agree with everything else you said. Like you said it’s often beyond their control. But I don’t see what legitimate excuses there are for people acting loud and stupid on the phone and not opening the door after 5 minutes of knocking. It’s just ignorance.