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Why I am A loser
- Thread starter James3313
- Start date
I'm 20 and I've lost over 5k USD already. I'm slowly starting to turn profitable already and you know why? I know how much I can lose. With an account your size, I'd say at most 10k USD, how can you trade options? My account is currently around 5k, and I'm trading FX because thats the only instrument I can trade now. I trade micro lots on FX (10 cents a tick) and sure it's small, but it builds your experience on reading market sentiment, price action etc. What you want now is experience, not money. Sure, you most probably will blow up your next account, but do it slowly. Learn as you lose. Thats how you start growing.
I find it almost laughable to hear my fellow newbie brethren claim that somehow one can gradually gain one's "edge" over time. From what I have been told by other experts, such an edge hardly ever comes gradually. On the contrary, it comes rather quickly and quite unexpectedly just when you think you finally bit the dust.Quote from JodyOng:
I'm 20 and I've lost over 5k USD already. I'm slowly starting to turn profitable already and you know why? I know how much I can lose. With an account your size, I'd say at most 10k USD, how can you trade options? My account is currently around 5k, and I'm trading FX because thats the only instrument I can trade now. I trade micro lots on FX (10 cents a tick) and sure it's small, but it builds your experience on reading market sentiment, price action etc. What you want now is experience, not money. Sure, you most probably will blow up your next account, but do it slowly. Learn as you lose. Thats how you start growing.
Although it's never easy to define just what such an edge is, I will tell you this. It is far simpler than you might think or have been taught otherwise. Hint: who would have thought you could actually make money simply by religiously adhering to price actions (eg. support and resistance)?
Quote from saliva:
I find it almost laughable to hear my fellow newbie brethren claim that somehow one can gradually gain one's "edge" over time. From what I have been told by other experts, such an edge hardly ever comes gradually. On the contrary, it comes rather quickly and quite unexpectedly just when you think you finally bit the dust.
Heh, it's different for everyone. The system I use came piecemeal from things I learned over a long period of time. Then it was refined from an entire year of staring at every minute of the market religiously. Yes, there were months where I didn't trade and just sat and stared at the market/patterns/price action going on.
That's a litmus test for newbie traders too. If you can stare at the market for months and still enjoy what you are doing then you have a chance in this gig.
Some of it is simple but requires adaptation, discipline, and common sense. Those 3 things I mentioned are difficult for the vast majority of people to master. "Easy" trades are made difficult by second guessing and/or lack of understanding of the market.Although it's never easy to define just what such an edge is, I will tell you this. It is far simpler than you might think or have been taught otherwise. Hint: who would have thought you could actually make money simply by religiously adhering to price actions (eg. support and resistance)?
Quote from saliva:
I find it almost laughable to hear my fellow newbie brethren claim that somehow one can gradually gain one's "edge" over time. From what I have been told by other experts, such an edge hardly ever comes gradually. On the contrary, it comes rather quickly and quite unexpectedly just when you think you finally bit the dust.
Although it's never easy to define just what such an edge is, I will tell you this. It is far simpler than you might think or have been taught otherwise. Hint: who would have thought you could actually make money simply by religiously adhering to price actions (eg. support and resistance)?
I find it laughable that one can properly test and learn a system or method with a sample size of 10 trades.
How do you think an edge is developed? How do you think Livermore started making money? By observing price movements first.
Of course, you're probably talking the lazy man way where you just take somebody elses system and cookie cutter it for yourself.
if you want to suvcceed in this bussiness:
first you need sufficent fund, if your account is just around 3k~30k, that is not enough. you must fund your account at least above $50k. my suggestion, go back to school, get educated and get a good career, then rent an aprtment (do not buy house using mortgagae), stay there 3 to five years, you will end up with lots of cash, at the same time, after your regular job, practice and learn the market deligently.
when your fund is enough big and your investment knowledge is sufficent enough and your trading skills are good, you can start to quit your job and enjoy the journey to RICH GUY.
otherwise the chance for you to succeed in this business is slim, almost 100% you are doomed to failure.
if you want to kill a prey, you need hone your knife first.
the sharp knife includes sufficent fund, and the knowledge and skill you acquired.......
wealth built upon deligence, not luck
first you need sufficent fund, if your account is just around 3k~30k, that is not enough. you must fund your account at least above $50k. my suggestion, go back to school, get educated and get a good career, then rent an aprtment (do not buy house using mortgagae), stay there 3 to five years, you will end up with lots of cash, at the same time, after your regular job, practice and learn the market deligently.
when your fund is enough big and your investment knowledge is sufficent enough and your trading skills are good, you can start to quit your job and enjoy the journey to RICH GUY.
otherwise the chance for you to succeed in this business is slim, almost 100% you are doomed to failure.
if you want to kill a prey, you need hone your knife first.
the sharp knife includes sufficent fund, and the knowledge and skill you acquired.......
wealth built upon deligence, not luck
Quote from trader_david:
if you want to suvcceed in this bussiness:
first you need sufficent fund, if your account is just around 3k~30k, that is not enough. you must fund your account at least above $50k. my suggestion, go back to school, get educated and get a good career, then rent an aprtment (do not buy house using mortgagae), stay there 3 to five years, you will end up with lots of cash, at the same time, after your regular job, practice and learn the market deligently.
when your fund is enough big and your investment knowledge is sufficent enough and your trading skills are good, you can start to quit your job and enjoy the journey to RICH GUY.
otherwise the chance for you to succeed in this business is slim, almost 100% you are doomed to failure.
if you want to kill a prey, you need hone your knife first.
the sharp knife includes sufficent fund, and the knowledge and skill you acquired.......
wealth built upon deligence, not luck
He is exactly right. Take his advice. One of the main components to trader success is a large capital base. And don't trade options, trade stocks which are more forgiving. Use moving average setups with MACD confirmation to avoid big drawdowns.
Keep reading everything you can. Stockmarketmentor.com would be a great starting place for someone in your shoes (I have no affiliation).
Quote from James3313:
I am about to sell my losing trade that I have been in for 35 days. My unrealized loss is -$1,260 (soon to be realized).
This isnât the first time I lost money; my last trades included total loss of -$2,300.
You see, I work a shitty job. I get paid minimum wage plus commission (8.75+ commissions).
My average weekly paycheck is $380.00; I am 23 years old and a college dropout.
Bottom of the American society barrel.
NOTE: Parents feel free to show your kids this post to show them what life is like when a person decides to drop out of college.
I have been trading options for the last 8 months with a total loss of -$3,695 and counting. Here is a blog where some, not all, of my trades have been recorded. http://jsochi.blogspot.com/
How did I get to this place, read onâ¦
Rewind a year back, I was a college student on my way to attend Sac state. Given my ambitious personality I wanted to be rich. I started reading articles on investing and over and over again kept hearing that the best time to start investing is in the 20s. With time on your side, it will compound of the years.
So I started doing research on investing. My friend told me that he made 1000% almost every month trading Google options (this was when Google was making its run to $750 a share) and thatâs how I discovered options.
Given my extreme personality I jumped right in and started researching options. Soon I didnât have time for school anymore (didnât register for next semesters) , no social life, just work and researching. Cut expenses to the bone. Nothing except necessities. Save, save, save.
My schedule is this;
Get up at 6:30am (pacific time) watch market until 1pm
2:00pm go to work
10pm come home do research, read books, online articles etc, analyze charts, discover indicators, etc..
12am go to sleep
6:30am get up
In the mean time save, save, save.
Now its 8 months later and Iâve lost a total of $3695.
I am currently saving up again.
This time I have plan. My plan is -10% stop loss on any trade (no matter what you undisciplined retard!!!!)
I watch XLF Spy on 10 day 60 minute chart with 12ma. Go long short whenever with 10% stop loss.
AAPL, ACH, QQQQ on 1 year daily chart with 30 MA. Go long short when price crosses MA with 10 stop loss.
I want to grow my account 25-35% per month, which is reasonable with options. I have been paper trading (yea yea I knowâ¦) my strategy this time it really seems like its got some potential, according to results.
I hope this time will be different. Armed with my stop loss and strategy I feel like its going to a lot easier from here on. I have clearly outlined my rules for this strategy.
They say that doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results is the definition of insanity. I consider myself ambitious and determined to succeed no matter what.
My goal is to be a consistently profitable options trader. I will either spend my whole trying to succeed at it, or achieve my goal. I have given up everything to be good at this, I don't want anything else in life but this, I want to be a successful options trader.
Why aren't you a winner?
First, you've only been at this for 1 year.
It takes, on average, 5 years for a trader to become successful - regardless of instrument.
It took me 6 years.
Second, you have no strategy or comprehension of risk.
Risking no more than 10%, per trade, is way too much. Shows you haven't a clue.
Huge losses make that even more apparent.
Third, don't confuse a brains with a bull market. Your friends success resulted from a massive equity boom that made him rich selling premium short, right?
Those conditions will not return for at least 3-5 years.
You will not be able to replicate your friends success. Nor will your friend.
Fourth, all instruments trade similar. Figure out why I said this. Re-evaluate your strategy. Some of the simplest strategies work the best. Use them.
Fifth. go back to school (your parents are paying right?). That way, you've got room and board covered. Plus a back-up vocation. Take a reduced course load. Schedule classes so you've got 1-2 weekdays off.
Use those days to study and papertrade the market until you're successful. Further, I'd recommend opening a FX paper account. That way, you can log the THOUSANDS of HOURS of live market screen time needed to achieve success.
If you're not ready to invest 2,000 to 4,000 hours - reading posts, books, screen-time, paper-trading - then its time to re-evaluate. And those hours are not hyperbole.
Right now, its obvious you're trying to get rich quick without a clue. You will lose every cent of that money if you continue.
Having said all that, yes, its possible.
The Question Is: How Bad Do you Want it??!??
Quote from lilduckling:
Options is not what you want to be trading when just starting off..... anyone that tells you otherwise is a lying sack of shit.
Your expectations are unrealistic 25% to 35% a month...... its easy only in the sense that its mathematically possible.
Put together a business plan.... a well planed business plan with stages and expectations. If you meet a girl and move in with her..... your business plan must be rewritten to reflect it..... if you move in with mom and dad..... your business plan must be rewritten..... any change at all in your life, must be reflected in your business plan.
Put together a trading plan. Not just a 1 page sheet of paper with basic rules for entry / exit, but a detailed plan that takes into account every nuance of trading. When, what, why, how, etc.... you should never feel "lost" in a trade or in a trading day because of an event that wasn't taken into account in your trading plan.
My opinion, your current trading plan needs work.... just by the simple fact when you say 10% loss is going to be your max..... 10% of what??? Your account? Your risk amount? What if someone has 3 losers in one day... all 4% losers, thats 12% loss for the day!
Although you do have a set schedule... which is very good, what does your trading plan say when you dont stick to your regiment?
All these little details must be written into your trading plan.
Stay away from options when new to this (cant say that enough)
Paper trade first. Paper trading wont make you a better trader, but if you dont have the discipline to stay focused, use proper money management, follow your own rules..... while paper trading with no stress......... then most likely, when under pressure from the market with real money on the line, you wont have the discipline to keep a cool head to follow your plan... your fear or greed will get the best of you.... and you will make a mistake.
Alot of people have no idea what role paper trading has.... since it cant make you a better trader.... well thats true, but paper trading is a great litmus test on your personality and patience to follow through. Again, I repeat, if you can not follow your trading plan while paper trading because its too boring or you get impatient.... then forget about the stock market.
$3695 loss in 8 months is not bad at all (although i don't know what that is percentage wise) but the important thing is to look at the trend of your loses. Are they getting bigger? smaller? staying about the same?
I have a spreadsheet in excel that I programed my self...... it keeps track of every single statistic and aspect you can think of, in my trading.... both for month to month, year to year, and a running average of everything. You can always go back a compare trends with issues that go on with your life..... there are correlations!
When you are going through long term tough times and just constantly think about throwing in the towel..... DO IT! Quit trading altogether.... focus on your job or education, family.... dont think about the market. A year or 2 later, begin to get back in.... lo and behold, you will have a different outlook and perspective altogether! Quitting doesn't mean quitting for ever.... its not a race.
Lastly..... do not listen to gurus. It will save you lots of head aches. Gurus only want 2 things from you, to feed their wallets, or to feed their egos. You can spot them a mile away..... dont waste your time with them..... believe me, i learned that the hard way when I started off.
Well said. I like reading your comment.