I'm not a kid. I know money makes the world turn and the chances someone training me for free is a pipe dream. I get it.
I have lived a life that I've learned a lot from. Believe me on this...
Why do you trade?
- Thread starter Chris Paciello
- Start date
I'm not a kid. I know money makes the world turn and the chances someone training me for free is a pipe dream. I get it.
I have lived a life that I've learned a lot from. Believe me on this...
> Is that true, 10 minutes and they can teach you how to trade >successfully?
I think a solid trader can teach you what to focus on very quickly. If I know what a trader is watching, if I know how much of his time his attention he is spending on different activities then I can structure my activity in a similar way. I came up with this idea and thought of it as "attention-activation processing model".
Successful traders "mold" their attention processing models to their strengths in processing data. I don't take much that Jack Hershey says seriously and he doesn't back up his arcane claims, he does bring attention to the importance of market feedback loops and attention-reaction models. The best trader will work in a niche where his information processing abilities are strongest.
I think it might be possible to tell someone what to do. But, learning to do it will take more time. Everyone has a different basic ability to process information and not everyone has the ability to process information in the way that I do. I think that if the student had the same information processing aptitude then it may be possible.
There is also a constant struggle, at least for the discretionary trader. I'm always trying to evaluate myself. There is always some uncertainty about whether I still have what it takes.
It is a good question. This question deals also with the concept of limits. Think about this: any stimuli must be remembered instantly to be paired with a memory. There is no other way it can happen. The memory must be created instantly when the stimuli occurs (or else it won't even exist). And, yet people study and study and then one day they claim to know something. Yet, studies show that only a small fraction of a what is studies is remembered. What is the student really learning.. what does the expert really acquire. It is a combination of strategies, skills, confidence... it is the tangible and intangible.
I think a solid trader can teach you what to focus on very quickly. If I know what a trader is watching, if I know how much of his time his attention he is spending on different activities then I can structure my activity in a similar way. I came up with this idea and thought of it as "attention-activation processing model".
Successful traders "mold" their attention processing models to their strengths in processing data. I don't take much that Jack Hershey says seriously and he doesn't back up his arcane claims, he does bring attention to the importance of market feedback loops and attention-reaction models. The best trader will work in a niche where his information processing abilities are strongest.
I think it might be possible to tell someone what to do. But, learning to do it will take more time. Everyone has a different basic ability to process information and not everyone has the ability to process information in the way that I do. I think that if the student had the same information processing aptitude then it may be possible.
There is also a constant struggle, at least for the discretionary trader. I'm always trying to evaluate myself. There is always some uncertainty about whether I still have what it takes.
It is a good question. This question deals also with the concept of limits. Think about this: any stimuli must be remembered instantly to be paired with a memory. There is no other way it can happen. The memory must be created instantly when the stimuli occurs (or else it won't even exist). And, yet people study and study and then one day they claim to know something. Yet, studies show that only a small fraction of a what is studies is remembered. What is the student really learning.. what does the expert really acquire. It is a combination of strategies, skills, confidence... it is the tangible and intangible.
That makes sense. Showing someone what to do and them knowing how to apply it is two different things.
Let's hear some more responses...
Let's hear some more responses...
Chris,
Have you been struggling to trade for four years? You made this thread back in 2006 asking for advice saying you were trying to "learn"
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=72669
How much time have you devoted to trading?
I've devoted a good amount of time over the years. Mostly was on my own at the beginning and did not have a clue on anything. I still jumped in and made it happen. I did fairly well at times. I think if I had a mentor or someone who can clarify what I am looking at to find what I'm looking for would have made a huge difference. I do believe with the proper guidance, I can make it work
I've learned a lot. Just on the overall parts of how to respect and trade the markets. Now, on how to trade it is another story.
I've learned a lot. Just on the overall parts of how to respect and trade the markets. Now, on how to trade it is another story.
I was always interested in stocks going back to just after graduating from college. I started more frequent swing trading in 1995 and after a year I felt I could make a living doing that full time. I actually took a leave of absence under FMLA when my Dad had a health issue so I could trade full time all day for 3 months. Trading was not forced on me -- I was doing well in my corp. job but I was turned off by politics. And I also recognized that trading offered incredible freedom to trade when I wanted. I've been fortunate over time in trading and now spend 2-3 mornings a week volunteering in a high poverty school working with kids on math. Sure I am away from the markets during that time and may be costing myself some $$$ but it's refreshing to give some time to others and you realize how fortunate you are when seeing the plight of others.
I started trading at home for 2 years then went to an office for 2+ years and have been remote almost 11 years since I left the office. I found there to be too much "noise" there although some of the traders were good guys and the social interaction had some positives.
I did develop a business plan and treated this like a business from day one.
I'd venture that 99.9% of failed traders did fairly well at times. Successful trading involves doing consistently well.
What do you think a mentor can provide in terms of what to look for and how to trade it once you recognize it, that you can't get from studying comprehensive book such as "Reading Price Charts Bar By Bar" while sim trading the live market action, making meticulous notes every day and collating enough information to formulate a rock solid trading plan?
A mentor can show you all that stuff, and share a lot of little details that took him/her a long time to learn, but the chance of you duplicating the mentor's success without your own sweat equity and mastery of your faith in the system is minimal.
I had a few experienced traders explain and/or demonstrate for me over a long period of time exactly what they do day after day to produce consistent profits and I couldn't do it until I put in my own time and study and created a plan I could trust.
Bighog went so far as to give me specific rules for setups, entries and trade management and I watched it work again and again and I could not bring myself to trade that way until I found my own way there.
I'm not saying that will happen to you, but I mentored a few people and this is a common pattern. They understand the setups, they understand the rules, and they struggle terribly with the execution because of either a lack of faith that the system will continue to work consistently, or because of an obsessive need for certainty in an environment where the outcome of every deal (trade) is uncertain.
One of my own biggest hurdles was trusting my own system enough to trade it properly despite months of consistent data demonstrating a rock solid edge.
Great advice!
I do understand that even with a mentor there is more to it. I feel it would greatly benefit me.
I do understand that even with a mentor there is more to it. I feel it would greatly benefit me.