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Why do people use Volume, Range and Tic charts?
- Thread starter fearless9
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may i suggest, to those discussing this type of esoteria, to read
"equity markets in action" by schwartz and francioni
its a good primer on the actual structure of markets and how they work instead of hearsay, phony structures to catch traders instead of profits, and proflogic type applications.
understanding market structure made it clear to me that there is little to nothing to the claims of different tic charts or ergo indicators, et al .
one can continue to follow gurus and play in esoteric minutae or one can begin to understand the way markets really work. the choice is yours.
regards,
surfer
http://www.amazon.com/Equity-Market..._bbs_sr_1/002-8273654-7608860?ie=UTF8&s=books
"equity markets in action" by schwartz and francioni
its a good primer on the actual structure of markets and how they work instead of hearsay, phony structures to catch traders instead of profits, and proflogic type applications.
understanding market structure made it clear to me that there is little to nothing to the claims of different tic charts or ergo indicators, et al .
one can continue to follow gurus and play in esoteric minutae or one can begin to understand the way markets really work. the choice is yours.
regards,
surfer
http://www.amazon.com/Equity-Market..._bbs_sr_1/002-8273654-7608860?ie=UTF8&s=books
Quote from ProfLogic:
Price is always moving from Support to Resistance and back. Now the million dollar questions is WHICH Support buys and Resistance sells are the best. Determine trend by defining Support at extreme levels for trend then all other oscillations are entry and exit points.
Gm Prof.
Care to expand on this comment please.
Quote from fearless9:
Gm Prof.
Care to expand on this comment please.
Sure f9 & good morning.
It is common knowledge that price moves methodically back and forth from Support and Resistance and back again. But what is important are the levels at which those Support and Resistance levels are created. These levels help traders see the strength and weakness of each of the markets oscillations so they can better see the clearer and safer entry and exit points. Trading is all about safe consistent profitable trades.
I designate 2 types of oscillations. Trend Resistance & Support (those created at extreme levels that are used to determine Trend only) and Trading Resistance & Support oscillations (those created that are not extreme). It makes is really simple, any oscillation that is not a Trending oscillation "IS" a potential Trading oscillation. Now by reading the strength of both one can safely choose the Trading opportunities that offer the clearest entry and most profit potential.
Common sense would dictate that if one could precisely determine the Trend of price on any particular chart then the oscillations in between the confirmed Trend Resistance top oscillation and Trend Resistance bottom oscillation would be labeled as trading opportunities. If that determined Trend was a Bull then one would be safer in trading the failed oscillations long back up toward Trend Resistance than short from Trend Resistance to Trend Support. The exact opposite would apply if the determined Trend were a Bear.
The creation of a confirming oscillation at a Trend Resistance top or Trend Support bottom will allow you to trade against the determined Trend as well but a trader learns that these aggressive positions aren't necessary. Just like anything though some traders thrive on more risk so they still occasionally take these positions but understanding the risk better gives them the ability to monitor those trades a little more closely for conservative exits.
I use one indicator to determine those extreme levels. I used to use the Stochastics but it was way to noisy and was range bound. If you have used it you know that in extreme up moves or down moves in any market the Stochastics will literally stick on the top or bottom of its range. The range was a little better using the MACD but the noise factor was awful. The key here is to eliminates much of the noise (confusion) as possible. After many years of research I settled on the Ergodic because it was really really smooth and wasn't range bound. The Ergodic's range is (+)100 and (-)100 but my extreme levels are (+)10 and (-)10. Plenty of room to breath. With some tweaking of the specific parameters of the Ergodic I got it to reflect the movement of price pretty well. We all know that indictors lag and that is fine. I don't trade from what the indicator is showing me, I trade what price is showing me AFTER the indicator has confirmed it.
I want to add that some traders do not see the value in viewing or watching the markets in non varying environments. Personally, I find that eliminating the "noise" created from as many variables as possible adds to the clarity of my trade entry and exit points and makes defining Trend clearer as well.
Viewing the market in this manner is definitely different and more precise than watching the markets viewing minute charts and therefore uncomfortable for some traders in the beginning. Learning anything new usually is but without an open mind to at least assess the possibility of something better, your days as a consistently sucessful trader are numbered.
Viewing the market in this manner is definitely different and more precise than watching the markets viewing minute charts and therefore uncomfortable for some traders in the beginning. Learning anything new usually is but without an open mind to at least assess the possibility of something better, your days as a consistently sucessful trader are numbered.
Quote from Lamont_C:
Nice summary, but surfer still won't understand it . . .
LC
Yeah, but I did.
Thanks for the compleat dialogue on trading ProfLogic. You've pretty much covered everything that a trader needs for their trading setup. In summation the topics covered are as follows:
1a. Chart Setup
1b. Concepts and Theory behind the chart setup and why certain configurations are better than others.
1c. How to look at and understand price action.
1d. Exact indicators used when charting.
2a. Major Trend Determination.
2b. Minor Trend Determination.
2c. How to trade with the Minor Trend.
2d. How to trade against the Minor Trend (1).
2e. Inclusive in the above section is a correct understanding of how to trade Support & Resistance.
3a. General discourse on trading which includes:
3b. Why a trader would enter a trade.
3c. Applying the methodology to multiple markets, why and how this would be optimal.
Traders are free to pick & choose and apply to their trading any and or all of the concepts expressed.
Best Regards,
Jimmy Jam
(1) When it is supported by the Major Trend.
Quote from ProfLogic:
I want to add that some traders do not see the value in viewing or watching the markets in non varying environments. Personally, I find that eliminating the "noise" created from as many variables as possible adds to the clarity of my trade entry and exit points and makes defining Trend clearer as well.
Viewing the market in this manner is definitely different and more precise than watching the markets viewing minute charts and therefore uncomfortable for some traders in the beginning. Learning anything new usually is but without an open mind to at least assess the possibility of something better, your days as a consistently sucessful trader are numbered.
do you obtain 90% plus success while trading in this manner, as you previously claimed?
surfer
Prof-
Thanks for your input and help on this topic...very informative.
Could you expand on what goes into the decision to use tick charts or volume charts? Are there any mechanical triggers or criteria that cause you to use one or another. I have read that you would prefer volume charts, but in your spreadsheet, you seem to use both. Are there any benchmarks you would use to determine which to use, or is it just a 'feel' issue?
Thanks for your input and help on this topic...very informative.
Could you expand on what goes into the decision to use tick charts or volume charts? Are there any mechanical triggers or criteria that cause you to use one or another. I have read that you would prefer volume charts, but in your spreadsheet, you seem to use both. Are there any benchmarks you would use to determine which to use, or is it just a 'feel' issue?
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