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Why do Conservatives Embraces Libertarians, but Neo-Liberals Don't?
- Thread starter RCG Trader
- Start date
You are thinking "neolib" as in, non classical lib. THEY use the term "neo lib" to pejoratively describe Classical libs, when actually THEY are the neo libs. Classical libs are, well, classic.
Quote from RCG Trader:
And, if anyone is confused, I believe in free markets. No one should have been bailed out.
Free markets.
If I fuck up, then the free markets will eliminate me.
I have no issue with that.
That is why i am a trader.
Quote from phenomena:
You are thinking "neolib" as in, non classical lib. THEY use the term "neo lib" to pejoratively describe Classical libs, when actually THEY are the neo libs. Classical libs are, well, classic.
Ive noticed that, and I have also noticed that they except for trefoil, remain strangely, quiet.
You know, the constitution is an astoundingly simple document. How did we so badly screw up, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness?
The founders would be tragically amused at what we have done to ourselves.
Quote from trefoil:
Ricter's trying to educate you. One more time:
Neo-liberals are monetarists; they were the "Chicago boys". They basically prescribed neo-classical solutions to the Chilean government. The Chicago School of monetarism I've seen described as "Austrian light".
I leave it up to you to decide how close or far they are to your school of thought, but they have nothing to do with modern liberalism, which are the folks you're aiming at.
We, as you know, like Keynes, Minsky, people like that.
Our beef on a theoretical level with you guys is simple: you don't actually live in the real world. It's very easy to say "no" to everything, but you know, once you get past the age of two, that kind of reaction gets old.
How childish do we think you are? The below is from "A Dynamic Theory of Forward Exchange", an old book by Paul Einzig on how forward exchange influences and is influenced by the spot fx exchange rate. It details how Mises insisted, despite detailed evidence to the contrary, that the Austro-Hungarian central bank responded to a currency crisis not through the forward exchange market, but through buying and selling gold, in a manner consistent with the classic gold standard. It's long but worth it for the light it sheds on the libertarian mindset:
Theory over fact. If the world doesn't fit your theory, make it fit. That pretty much describes libertarianism.
I beg to differ. A true libertarian would take the world as it is, and say let me MAKE my place in it, without taxes, tolls, and tickets.
Who, then, polices, builds the roads and bridges, inspects the food, the elevators, etc., enforces customs laws, arbitrates disputes, enforces contracts, and so on?
In the real world, nations, and the provinces underneath them, exist to do all of the above. Who does this in your theoretical libertarian utopia?
In the real world, nations, and the provinces underneath them, exist to do all of the above. Who does this in your theoretical libertarian utopia?
Libertarian policy allows for government to do all these things. Classical liberalism makes allowances for government to do all the things you mentioned.
I personally would like to see some domestic security outsourced to private service providers. I'd also like to see more private bridges and roads allowed to be built. Nonetheless, Libertarian policy allows for all the things you mentioned, as does Laissez Faire economic policy.
I personally would like to see some domestic security outsourced to private service providers. I'd also like to see more private bridges and roads allowed to be built. Nonetheless, Libertarian policy allows for all the things you mentioned, as does Laissez Faire economic policy.
Quote from trefoil:
Who, then, polices, builds the roads and bridges, inspects the food, the elevators, etc., enforces customs laws, arbitrates disputes, enforces contracts, and so on?
In the real world, nations, and the provinces underneath them, exist to do all of the above. Who does this in your theoretical libertarian utopia?
Taxes(income, consumption, real estate, etc), tariffs, tolls.
Some libertarians want a consumption only tax. Others want a combination. Some want flatter, lower income tax with more consumption tax. Opinions differ within the movement. However the universal sentiment is for flatter, and lower taxes. Something along the lines of Hong Kong would be ideal for most Libertarians and classical liberals.
EDIT: When I say tariffs, I mean taxes on particular goods (alcohol, tobacco, drugs, ammunition, etc), fees for licensing and registration of all kinds which are currently charges. Another thing- most of us want all income taxed equally. Income is income, it's not the government's place to differentiate types of income and tax them separately. Income, capital gains, inheritance, bonuses etc to be taxed at the same rate. After all, it's all income.
Some libertarians want a consumption only tax. Others want a combination. Some want flatter, lower income tax with more consumption tax. Opinions differ within the movement. However the universal sentiment is for flatter, and lower taxes. Something along the lines of Hong Kong would be ideal for most Libertarians and classical liberals.
EDIT: When I say tariffs, I mean taxes on particular goods (alcohol, tobacco, drugs, ammunition, etc), fees for licensing and registration of all kinds which are currently charges. Another thing- most of us want all income taxed equally. Income is income, it's not the government's place to differentiate types of income and tax them separately. Income, capital gains, inheritance, bonuses etc to be taxed at the same rate. After all, it's all income.
Quote from trefoil:
You wouldn't know that from the posts around here, but I'll grant you the concession, as it's a tenet of conservative political philosophy.
Next: who pays for it, and how?
Quote from phenomena:
Taxes(income, consumption, real estate, etc), tariffs, tolls.
Some libertarians want a consumption only tax. Others want a combination. Some want flatter, lower income tax with more consumption tax. Opinions differ within the movement. However the universal sentiment is for flatter, and lower taxes. Something along the lines of Hong Kong would be ideal for most Libertarians and classical liberals.
EDIT: When I say tariffs, I mean taxes on particular goods (alcohol, tobacco, drugs, ammunition, etc), fees for licensing and registration of all kinds which are currently charges.
I personally would like to see a flat income tax along with sales or usage tax. Tax should not be applied to licenses because they ultimately provide services that benefit the state. Licenses that allow people freedom within the state( I don't know). It would depend on what the states revenue stream would be to see if that were needed.
Bottom line. Curb severely entitlements, then use taxes to equalize revenue to expenditures.
The problem is that what politico will cut an entitlement that their district has grown used to?