Why capital is so important or even critical in successful trading?

.00019orbust · Jun 11, 2008

Quote from Pa(b)st Prime:

You're mising the point that me and others are making about probability . What's more "probable'? Turning 1 million into 2 million or turning 3k into 2 million?

i know i couldn't turn 1 mill into 2

i know i couldn't turn 1 mill into 1.5k.

but i could definitely turn 1.5k in risk deposit into 70-80k

makloda · Jun 11, 2008

Quote from JaiSreeram:
I am confused as many business grew big with small capital. They might have been careful,made small steps and many other factors that made them successful.

You mean so many businesses you know and heard of in the media that were successful over time with very little capital needs. What about the millions of businesses that are being started with too little capital every year that fail and you never hear about because they get no media coverage?

Just because Microsoft was started with no capital whatsoever doesn't mean it is easily replicated by following a simple recipe. Turning a garage setup into a multi billion dollar global company with no initial capital whatsoever is extremely rare (1 in a million or worse) just like you don't hear about too many guys turning $350 into $1 billion trading eminis.

Quote from JaiSreeram:
Do we small traders need to do pooling of money to be successful in trading?

Depends on what you mean with "successful". If somebody trades a 10k account part time and manages to extract $4000 each year on his capital base to supplement his working income I would say he's hugely successful.

However, it doesn't mean he would be able to successfully trade full time and cover his expenses and then some with that kind of capital base.

Shagi · Jun 11, 2008

Quote from epetrov:

I'd guess that method and discipline are the keys.
Under capitalisation may be an excuse for not being successful in trading.

There is the key and truth about $5k accounts that end up $0.

Shagi · Jun 11, 2008

Undercapitalisation and Overcapialisation makes no difference to a trader who cant trade. No difference at all if one has $5 or $50k, if you dont know what you are doing.

As already said put $5k-$10k in the hands of those that know what they are doing thats all they need. Now give them $100k and they will soon be millionaires and thats from my experience and first hand experiences of some individuals close to me and not some book.

makloda · Jun 11, 2008

Quote from Shagi:
Undercapitalisation and Overcapialisation makes no difference to a trader who cant trade. No difference at all if one has $5 or $50k, if you dont know what you are doing.

But it makes a big difference to a trader who can trade. It can make the difference between being able to trade for a living and and being forced to work a daytime job forever.

But I guess I am off-topic. The topic was 'successful', not 'successful fulltime'.

Shagi · Jun 11, 2008

Quote from makloda:

But it makes a big difference to a trader who can trade. It can make the difference between being able to trade for a living and and being forced to work a daytime job forever.

But I guess I am off-topic. The topic was 'successful', not 'successful fulltime'.

I agree it makes a diffrence to a trader who can trade, if you can there is a difference between $5K and $100k account -but my point is it makes no difference to a trader who can't trade.

MandelbrotSet · Jun 11, 2008

Quote from Shagi:

Undercapitalisation and Overcapialisation makes no difference to a trader who cant trade. No difference at all if one has $5 or $50k, if you dont know what you are doing.

As already said put $5k-$10k in the hands of those that know what they are doing thats all they need. Now give them $100k and they will soon be millionaires and thats from my experience and first hand experiences of some individuals close to me and not some book.

Actually, it makes no difference to a trader who can trade either ... $5k to $100k is just a matter of time and opportunities, that's all it is.

They'll get their $100k from the $5k soon enough ...

JaiSreeram · Jul 1, 2008

Thanks, makloda for your answer, it was really logical.

Quote from makloda:
You mean so many businesses you know and heard of in the media that were successful over time with very little capital needs. What about the millions of businesses that are being started with too little capital every year that fail and you never hear about because they get no media coverage?
Just because Microsoft was started with no capital whatsoever doesn't mean it is easily replicated by following a simple recipe. Turning a garage setup into a multi billion dollar global company with no initial capital whatsoever is extremely rare (1 in a million or worse) just like you don't hear about too many guys turning $350 into $1 billion trading eminis.
Depends on what you mean with "successful". If somebody trades a 10k account part time and manages to extract $4000 each year on his capital base to supplement his working income I would say he's hugely successful.
However, it doesn't mean he would be able to successfully trade full time and cover his expenses and then some with that kind of capital base.

However, it looks that my earlier statement stands as people can make millions out of a $5 account, if they know how to trade, as seen in the following responses:

Quote from Shagi:
Undercapitalisation and Overcapialisation makes no difference to a trader who cant trade. No difference at all if one has $5 or $50k, if you dont know what you are doing.
As already said put $5k-$10k in the hands of those that know what they are doing thats all they need. Now give them $100k and they will soon be millionaires and thats from my experience and first hand experiences of some individuals close to me and not some book.

Quote from makloda:
But it makes a big difference to a trader who can trade. It can make the difference between being able to trade for a living and and being forced to work a daytime job forever.
But I guess I am off-topic. The topic was 'successful', not 'successful fulltime'.

Quote from MandelbrotSet:
Actually, it makes no difference to a trader who can trade either ... $5k to $100k is just a matter of time and opportunities, that's all it is.
They'll get their $100k from the $5k soon enough ...

I am still confused!

Can one succeed or not with a small amount of capital?

ammo · Jul 1, 2008

Quote from JaiSreeram:

Thanks, makloda for your answer, it was really logical.

However, it looks that my earlier statement stands as people can make millions out of a $5 account, if they know how to trade, as seen in the following responses:

I am still confused! Can one succeed or not with a small amount of capital?

if you were a successful trader and u tapped out,it happens, you don't need much more than a small amount, a chance and you'll make money,the key to this is if you already know how to trade,give a carpenter a set of tools and a pile of lumber and he'll build you a house,he knows how to build,if you don't know what you're doing that house won't get built

increasenow · Jul 1, 2008

honestly...if you really know how to trade, really know how to trade...you can trade the YM successfully with a $300 daytrade margin and $500 in your account...and...AS well as trading the YM with a $3,000 margin in a $20,000 account...this is the honest truth...honestly