whip saw action is severe-very tough

550k shares?Wow thats nuts man.I scalp for 5-20 cents but i trade maybe 10-20k shares a day...and i find that amount nerve wracking...pound fists?I go thru 1 keyboard a month and i curse like a sailor...i hate it but daytrading does that to me...I remember when i walked into a daytrading operation and they had a closet full of new keyboards!
I remember when i position traded and i made way more money with zero stress but the market dynamics changed as of mid 1996--thanks to the web etc....I got my head handed to me after that, lost everything.I learned that you shouldnt hold nasdaq stocks overnight.Therefore position trading out....I now daytrade dow 30 stocks and yhoo,orcl.Thats it for me.
 
Hello all i have enjoyed your posts I have been trading for about three years and have not gotten involved in groups before. I am really enjoying it... thank you Rog
 
cd23

Nice to see you are a fan. Obviously you do not comprehend what trading breakouts involves. False breakouts are part and parcel of any trading strategy, if you claim to trade without losers then you are not pulling the trigger.

Reread the part about cutting losers short. Trading breakouts is about knowing what to expect what price does what price will do. Most breakouts that turn into false breakouts in general will first give you a few ticks at worst to begin with, with proper risk (money management ) procedures you will tell from price action if the trade is a dud and you get out, plain and simple. Many rookie breakout traders are scared to trade breakouts from just what you mention about false breakouts. With solid signals, read levels , you have a great chance to catch the upcoming run and at worst will be able to tell if a trade is not at the moment in time proceeding to bring in the others to follow the breakout and make some bacon.

Reread the word "BREAKOUT", does that not tell you if you anticipated the breakout or not? A breakout simply means just what it says.........you have a few ticks in the bag and now it is up to you to manage the trade with your skills which came from experience and experience only. I have done my gruntwork, and now it is your turn to learn, good luck.

Please refrain from pretending to know how i trade. From your post i have a dam good idea that you have a lot to learn yet.


Blab away and try to discredit my ramblings which are intended to help others. Sorry you are such a poor sport. My friend be gentle on others when you are such a rookie. ..
:p

There is no such thing as a prefect trading strategy, all new traders have a hard time comprehending that simple fact. THERE IS NO PERFECT SIGNAL, never has been , never will be. IF and when you learn that .....then and only then will you be able to use proper money management with solid odds in your favorto make money. All else is wishful thinking. .. :D
 
The breakout and position traders tend to make more money when a trade goes their way, and the scalpers to make less money, but they make it more consistently.

A great deal of trading is really all about the individuals' personality, much more so than what the markets are doing.

So while some found the going today to be tough, others made their cake and then went about their business, and will do the same tomorrow.

No method is necessarily better than any other, it's all about the individual and their needs ...

... and I need to get paid. :D

Good trading,

JJ
 
jimyjam

Right on

We all learn our own way. Many do not understand this is a game of numbers, not intelligence. This is a game about the ODDS. A probability game can not be played any other way. Those that discredit others and their methods are just not winning traders. In my mind and many others minds, the breakout strategy is highest risk/reward method out there in a game of probability. Luck is not in my tool box, luck is not a winning strategy for the long haul. Sad but true, MOST new so called traders expect to find a way with zero losses and they drive themselves crazy whenever they get a loser and debunk the signal, method etc as not good. This is why it is so easy to tell who knows how to trade and others are just looking for a hand to hold. Their are no "MOMMY, MOMMY calling out in trading when these new guys find the game is no where as simple as it looks. Hand holders are rookies and thats the bottom line.

Jimyjam, good trading to ya and have a great holiday season. I look forward next year to pick your wallet for a few dollars. :eek:
 
'Zactly correct, bighog. For those with experience and a winning system, it was just another trading day, in another trading week.

Every-single-day is just another trading day, no matter what the market action.

Good trading to all. :cool:
 
Taken totally literally, the following question, sans question mark in the ora-ginal, is a fascinating study in the need for accuracy in trading advice:

"What would it be like to slow down the scalping and just reverse on each turn of the markets."

In my younger and less formative years, I spent $645 (when that was real money) for a day with the late lamented Eddie Toppel, who divulged just such a system for ES. It worked marginally then. It doesn't work at all now.

Pick ANY threshold of price-only in any time frame to indicate a reversal. Backtesting shows that it has negative expectancy.

As does following MOST (not ALL) of your advice. Only I know which of your advice to follow.
 
Quote from cd23:

Every day is a winner. Check the change in price of anything with respect to open price compared to closing price.

Every night is a winner. Check the difference in price of close to open.

Bighog talls us about his bugaboo and how he compensates for not having a trading strategy for what happens when he is in the market after he finds out he caught a no run.

Here time passes and he discovers false breakouts, retraces to work and "pesty" whipsaws. Obviously he cuts these losers short each day and is on the sidelines with all his capital for a while. He limits how much he pulls off the sidelines in the first place to be sure he has preserved capital all through the trading day. Obviously he can't say every day is a winner even though he is using a method with the best risk/reward ratio of all (he suggests).

So bighog trades BO's. What is a BO of a false BO? A BO of a retrace? Or a BO of a bugaboo whipsaw?

Lets say there is no false BO or no retrace or no bugaboo whipsaw? How does big hog exit? This is not his special case of cutting a loser short. It is a case of letting a winner run. When does he exit? We do not know as yet.

If he lets a BO become a false BO, then it is a BO that is a loser. He takes a BO and it becomes a retrace after a while; enough retrace passes the time for a while. What does he do with a BO trade that is retracing? He does something.

He, at some point, changes tactics. He is no longer looking at the BO strategy. Generally at this tactics change time, bighog observes it is the time when "off she goes". He watches.

Bighog doesn't win every day.

If you want to take the cure from this modus of trading, you need to learn to "read" the markets. To be able to "read" the markets, you need to be able to "see" the markets by having a comprehensive display.

Where do you look to see whipsaw coming into the picture? Name three places.

Where do you look to see that a BO is coming? Name 9 places.

What tells you in advance that a failure to BO is coming? Look 5 places.

Where do contrarians look to take entries at the beginnings of retraces? Look 7 places.

All the places counted are showing on my screen. Also I trade all of these because it is part of being in the market all of the time.

The excel posted shows a scalper going in and out of the markets. He does scalps for one reason: to make money. If he isn't he exits and waits for the next opportunity. 1 or 2 cars makes 7,000 dollars a day this way. It it possible to have a losing day trading this way? I don't think so.

What would it be like to slow down the scalping and just reverse on each turn of the markets. It wouldn't be just be BO trading, but it would include BO's, failure to BO, retraces and bugaboo whipsaws. This would turn the bugaboo whipsaws into a series of profitable segments.

There is always someone on the other side of bighog's trades when he cuts losses short. Look at the excel and see how much time price moved when the scalper was sidelined. Debrief and look at how the losing trades could have been cut short.....or reversed to make some money. Debrief the excel by circling the BO trades and note how the exit on the BO trade was done. Lots of ways.

The last exercise gives you a good picture of just how poor doing BO trading as the only trade really is. It is okay to think that BO trading is the greatest. It isn't as has been shown several ways but it is okay to think it is for a while until you are able to move on...... LOL..

This is such nonsense, and so long winded, it's almost inconceivable that such tripe would require so many words
 
Back
Top