Which brokers allow bitcoin futures?

m22au said:
This thread: (https://www.elitetrader.com/et/threads/td-ameritrade-will-offer-btc-futures.315669/) started off as a discussion about TD Ameritrade providing Bitcoin futures trading, but more generally:

Interactive Brokers: long positions only
https://www.interactivebrokers.com/en/index.php?f=25379
https://ibkr.info/article/3049

"Due to the extreme volatility of cryptocurrencies, clients will be unable to assume a short position including as part of a spread. The only time a short order will be allowed will be in the case of a roll trade that results in a long position. In addition, market orders will not be accepted."
More...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...eek-100-margin-on-some-bitcoin-futures-trades

"Interactive Brokers Group Inc., which has said it handled 53 percent of the first day’s trading in Cboe’s bitcoin futures, will require a margin of 50 percent for long investments, and about 240 percent for short selling, based on current rates, according to Interactive spokeswoman Kalen Holliday."

Looking now at the updated "Knowledge Base" article, (https://ibkr.info/article/3049),
the 240% margin for short positions looks to be based on a flat rate of $40,000 margin for a short position.

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margin requirement still very high.

I was expecting 24 times leverage,
not 240% margin for trading.

for shorting CME bitcoin, margin needed would be $200 000 per lot !
with $200 000, we can probably trade ~ 50 lots of ES !
IB needs to rethink.

With such a lousy margin requirement, it is better to trade other financial instruments with attractive leverage.

anyway I believe there are other brokers which offer more attractive margin requirement.
 
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maxinger said:
margin requirement still very high.

I was expecting 24 times leverage,
not 240% margin for trading.

for shorting CME bitcoin, margin needed would be $200 000 per lot !
with $200 000, we can probably trade ~ 50 lots of ES !
IB needs to rethink.

With such a lousy margin requirement, it is better to trade other financial instruments with attractive leverage.

anyway I believe there are other brokers which offer more attractive margin requirement.
More...

Actually, IB is very smart with this.

The average IB customer is retail and small professionals (advisors and brokers), meaning the risk of somebody doing something stupid is rather high.

So imagine one of the not so smart commentators in this thread shorts 24 Bitcoin Futures in a 100k $ account (24x5x20k = 2.4M notional divided by your 24 : 1 leverage is 100K) on a Friday to leave it open over the weekend...just to find out on Monday that this thing jumped 20%

Account is 380k in the red and the guy is basically flat broke. Where does IB get the money from? Now imagine a Swiss Franc scenario where everyone and their moms is on the same side. One such trade and IB goes belly up.

It's just not worth the risk to provide high leverage to morons in one single contract. If you want high leverage, just stay with your ES.









And now people will chime in and be like "nah dude, nobody would be THIS stupid to use that much leverage" and I'll say: Here you go

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/h...hed-and-now-i-owe-e-trade-10644556-2015-11-19

If I was an IB user, I'd be applauding to such a decision, because I know my funds aren't in danger due to a horde of degenerate gamblers
 
maxinger said:
margin requirement still very high.

I was expecting 24 times leverage,
not 240% margin for trading.

for shorting CME bitcoin, margin needed would be $200 000 per lot !
with $200 000, we can probably trade ~ 50 lots of ES !
IB needs to rethink.

With such a lousy margin requirement, it is better to trade other financial instruments with attractive leverage.

anyway I believe there are other brokers which offer more attractive margin requirement.
More...

I agree. The margin is way too high compare to other futures.
 
m22au said:
TD Ameritrade to allow trading of Bitcoin futures on Monday

"Bitcoin futures are about to get another big boost"
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/12/15/bitcoin-futures-are-about-to-get-another-big-boost.html

Margin requirement is 1.5 times the CBOE requirement of 44% (1.5 * 44% = 66%)
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/td-ameritrade-to-open-trading-on-bitcoin-futures-2017-12-15

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More...


It looks more attractive than IB.

unfortunately bitcoin futures volume has been very pathetic.
so brokerage firms wouldn't earn much.

perhaps it should be yen based or won based, or margin should be reduced drastically to increase volume.
 
maxinger said:
I was expecting 24 times leverage,
not 240% margin for trading.
More...

No one expects...
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