Which books should you read if you want to learn trading?

[Xela]

Comparing apples to oranges and think it is the same?

No; I don't think it's the same.

Nor did I say it's the same. Nor did I say anything like that. Nor did I imply that. I simply mentioned that I myself probably wouldn't be making a living without having read some trading books. And I'm still saying that, because it's still true.

I'm surprised that pointing that out apparently incurred such wrath and forceful language.

However, now that the insulting, attacking language and name-calling have been removed from your post above - I don't know whether that was by you or by a moderator - I've decided to reply anyway (for what it's worth, if anything).

What you think all of the world multimillionaires and billionaires read trading books to get to where they are?

As a response to my observation about the great value to me of having studied some accredited textbooks, that isn't comparing apples with oranges: it's comparing apples with violin sonatas.

I'm well aware that there are some comparatively undereducated and comparatively illiterate multimillionaires and billionaires. My perspective on that subject is that they're a small and extreme minority; indeed that it's partly because they're such a small and extreme minority that we've all heard of them and know something of their backgrounds. In other words, there's also some significant selection-bias and survivorship-bias at play behind your perfectly valid observation.

You ever thought about completing a higher education and then from there perhaps sparked an idea, run a company?

Thanks, but I already have a PhD and - strangely enough - it was partly on the basis of already having run an independent trading business successfully that I became an institutional trader, when eventually offered a deal one simply "couldn't decline".

If you don't see how most wealthy families invest then let me give you a clue.

Thanks again, but I may have a little more of a clue than you appreciated.

And if you think the fact that I happen to be young and female means you can freely insult me, and/or win anyone over to your perspective with a personal attack, you might be well advised to think again.

Not studying some dumb moving averages and indicators and shit, and looking at the screen like numb nut 24/7 to make a living, that’s just CHUMP change. Agree or disagree?

On that last point, as it happens, I pretty firmly agree with you, and have thought that for years (though I usually don't express it in quite those terms, myself). I don't understand why anyone might associate any of that "shit" with anything I said, above, but maybe you just took a guess about who you were replying to, and guessed very, very wrong?

Never mind ... welcome to the forum, anyway. I may be mistaken, but I suspect that perhaps making fewer assumptions about the people with whom you interact here than you've demonstrated on this occasion might, in the long run, work both to your own advantage and to that of other members.

 

[speedo]

Lesser minds should not mess with Zela, those with class wouldn't consider it.

 

[beerntrading]

I'm well aware that there are some comparatively undereducated and comparatively illiterate multimillionaires and billionaires. My perspective on that subject is that they're a small and extreme minority; indeed that it's partly because they're such a small and extreme minority that we've all heard of them and know something of their backgrounds.

A bit like plane crashes in that respect, so rare and so extreme you hear of every one as they happen.

 

[Zodiac4u]

Are old books also good in order to learn technical trading mostly?Or do you need books from 2017. The problem i have with books is that the newer ones that are good are all bought up by wall street and the good information never reaches the little guy.

So what do you guys think. Will the oldies be enough i have time to educate myself i`m young i just need to be on the right path.

When it comes to trading its best to stay away from trading books. Open up a Demo account and mess with techi stuff that you get with the charting software. Let your eyes see what works and what doesn't.

 

[Xela]

When it comes to trading its best to stay away from trading books. Open up a Demo account and mess with techi stuff that you get with the charting software. Let your eyes see what works and what doesn't.

How do you know what to look for without reading a book (or other, equivalent informational source) first?

(It's only my own perspective, but it seems to me that sometimes the difference between people who've really had three years' experience and those who've had something more like a month's experience repeated 36 times over is that the people in the first group had read a book or two before they started.)

 

[speedo]

Best to look at a map before you set out.

 

[beerntrading]

Best to look at a map before you set out.

There's also something to be said for getting lost and finding your way. You learn a lot about the lay of the land that way. My experience with that is actually real maps and visiting new places--there's nothing quite so enriching as being in a foreign country where you don't speak the language and getting lost to sharpen your navigation skills. To some extent, my trading experience has been the same. Having losses 3x your commissions seems really scary when you're lost there the first time--but any seasoned trader has already taken that one to its conclusion that it's actually a really good place to be in.

 

[speedo]

There's also something to be said for getting lost and finding your way. You learn a lot about the lay of the land that way. My experience with that is actually real maps and visiting new places--there's nothing quite so enriching as being in a foreign country where you don't speak the language and getting lost to sharpen your navigation skills. To some extent, my trading experience has been the same. Having losses 3x your commissions seems really scary when you're lost there the first time--but any seasoned trader has already taken that one to its conclusion that it's actually a really good place to be in.

I don't disagree. I tour a new city by just setting out and walking but I do keep a map in my back pocket. I have also learned how to trade by watching price development over many hours but books accelerated the process by teaching me the vernacular...and there is nothing wrong with noting the observations of smart, experienced people.

 

[Truth_]

No; I don't think it's the same.

Nor did I say it's the same. Nor did I say anything like that. Nor did I imply that. I simply mentioned that I myself probably wouldn't be making a living without having read some trading books. And I'm still saying that, because it's still true.

I'm surprised that pointing that out apparently incurred such wrath and forceful language.

However, now that the insulting, attacking language and name-calling have been removed from your post above - I don't know whether that was by you or by a moderator - I've decided to reply anyway (for what it's worth, if anything).





As a response to my observation about the great value to me of having studied some accredited textbooks, that isn't comparing apples with oranges: it's comparing apples with violin sonatas.

I'm well aware that there are some comparatively undereducated and comparatively illiterate multimillionaires and billionaires. My perspective on that subject is that they're a small and extreme minority; indeed that it's partly because they're such a small and extreme minority that we've all heard of them and know something of their backgrounds. In other words, there's also some significant selection-bias and survivorship-bias at play behind your perfectly valid observation.





Thanks, but I already have a PhD and - strangely enough - it was partly on the basis of already having run an independent trading business successfully that I became an institutional trader, when eventually offered a deal one simply "couldn't decline".





Thanks again, but I may have a little more of a clue than you appreciated.

And if you think the fact that I happen to be young and female means you can freely insult me, and/or win anyone over to your perspective with a personal attack, you might be well advised to think again.





On that last point, as it happens, I pretty firmly agree with you, and have thought that for years (though I usually don't express it in quite those terms, myself). I don't understand why anyone might associate any of that "shit" with anything I said, above, but maybe you just took a guess about who you were replying to, and guessed very, very wrong?

Never mind ... welcome to the forum, anyway. I may be mistaken, but I suspect that perhaps making fewer assumptions about the people with whom you interact here than you've demonstrated on this occasion might, in the long run, work both to your own advantage and to that of other members.

It’s like going back to 1565; an indefatigable spirit.

Saw the full post by “The Lout” and simply put him on ignore.

The low post, zero likes, seem to be the earmarks of the troll. Useful to know. A lot of them seem to have sprung from the earth as of late.

Also seeing the 100+ posters that are telling flat out lies, but that is something else.

In real life it is so different. Imagine a group of ladies and gentlemen in a restaurant, enjoying a meal, and having a discussion about trading; or in my case, a somewhat rowdy small town bar. A lout approaches and hurls an insult at one of the ladies. The result is predictable, obvious, and violent. In fact it is so predictable no one in their right mind would offer such an offence, in real life.

But with the anonymity of the internet the misogynist can feed his mental imbalances. The fool can spout his gibberish and feel good inside; satisfying those needs that his mother could not.

Oddly enough, @Xela ’s premise on educational texts (one that I agree with) could be refuted. But it would be the premise under attack not the person (the classic ad hominem).

Perhaps the lout could have pointed to truly successful, and well known traders, such as Paul Tudor Jones. He could have pointed out that Mr. Jones learned his craft trading cotton futures and the tutelage of Eli Tullis, not a text.

Richard Dennis one of the founders of the Turtle traders, started in the Chicago pits and turned $1,600 into $200 million. Same with his partner in the Turtles; William Eckhardt. Although Eckhardt did have advanced degrees in mathmatics and left his PhD program to trade the pits. I guess he had a bit of “book learning”.

I could go on with another dozen or so examples where traders emanated from the old open out cry pits in Chicago. A by-gone era, but one that generated a significant number of outstanding traders. All from an apprenticeship style approach; an instructor and daily work in the endeavour.

It could have been a reasoned response, it could have created further discussion, it could have helped others reading this discussion at some point in the future.

It of course could be countered with other examples of traders that came from an academic background. I’ll offer James Simons and Ed Thorp as two quick examples.

Then it could be pointed out that both these cohorts miss the point of the average retail trader. How do they advance? Especially when they are prey. Little baby gazelles trying to learn how to trade while the jackals and hyenas (brokers and educators) steal their money. The published, peer reviewed text would seem to offer some recourse. Ah, full circle without insult.

But louts, by definition, are ignorant, selfish creatures, with little understanding of anything outside their own skin.

I hope it was the moderator that made the deletions. Better that the board take care of such matters, rather than relying on the conscience of the lout.

 

[777]

Comparing apples to oranges and think it is the same? What you think all of the world multimillionaires and billionaires read trading books to get to where they are?

You can be making chump change for the rest of your life and if that’s what makes you happy then more power to you. You ever thought about completing a higher education and then from there perhaps sparked an idea, run a company?

Seriously, a guy started out selling dumb books online is now the richest man in the world. Some idiot laying on the couch watching movies, then one day thought about sending a DVD via the mail to himself to see if that stupid idea can turn into a business and started the biggest online streaming multimedia company in the world.

If you don't see how most wealthy families invest then let me give you a clue. They observe geo political stance and take up positions for weeks and months and years, then they also run their business and enjoy their wonderful lives. Not studying some dumb moving averages and indicators and shit, and looking at the screen like numb nut 24/7 to make a living, that’s just CHUMP change. Agree or disagree?

Look jackass... if we could see who you are I bet we would find an insecure, not wealthy (tho he wishes he were), losing trader who likes to pontificate about things he does not understand well.

Yes, yes, yes!!!

Never try to learn from smart people who have put their ideas in a book.


And since you are on a trading forum, I commend you for belittling trading in general and insulting Xela, a winning trader who shares her knowledge.

Very smart to start leveling an unprovoked personal attacks within your first 10 posts.

Brilliant to suggest Xela complete a higher education. How many PhD's would you like her to have!?

Part of the success of the billionaire-trader founders of Sesqhanna can be traced to something one of them read. Part of the success of a group of blackjack players who collectively have made a few billion betting horses in Hong Kong can be traced to something one of them read.

Not all successful people read a lot but most do, as Buffett has pointed out. Dalio, Thorp, Simmons are all prodigious readers.

Who are you and why are you here?