what's the deal with collective2?

Not sure what your beef is with me presenting my opinions on this. Calling someone an idiot for presenting a few educated conjectures is not a great way to present your retort, but have it your way.


" I can tell you that the better systems on C2 are currently earning between $10,000 and $15,000 per month in subscriber revenue. We anticipate this number will grow as more users sign up at the site. Since C2 spends a lot of money advertising the site, we expect our user base to continue its growth.

Matthew


Matthew Klein
matthew@collective2.com
www.collective2.com

"

So I guess whitehouse.gov should start running google ads too, just 'cause it makes some extra money.

I got the 20g figure from an earlier post in this thread.

I wrote profitable, I meant popular. Wow what a scandal that was.

I know C2's business model is crap enough for me not to want to ever use them from either a vendor or subscriber side. Unless C2 drastically improves things they will be dead in a few years, count on it.

You are probably an intelligent and nice person in the real world. I wont stoop to name calling here over mere opinions about a stinking business.
 
There WAS a reason why I called you idiot, I will prove it. But don't take it so hard, it is just my style. I had a hard childhood. :)

Quote from popstocks:

I guess whitehouse.gov should start running google ads too, just 'cause it makes some extra money.

Did you miss the .gov in your example??? You picked a very wrong analogy, because that is a not for profit government website.

Do you have anything against profitmaking? As long as the ads are not for Pepsi or Viagra or too intrusive, I don't have a problem with them.

I got the 20g figure from an earlier post in this thread.

That is not necessery true. You quoted Matt saying 10-15K which could be true or was true at one point. By the way he brought up another valid point : it also cost to advertise C2. Guess where that money comes from?

C2 is similar in one way to ET, that it is not a content, but a platform provider. (a blog would be content) So it is worth as much as the USERS make it. So if the vendors are bad on C2 then it makes the website bad too, just like bad posters make ET bad.

Now if you couldn't find a system worthy of your subscription that is a lost costumer for C2. But if you are a vendor, $100 is nothing to basicly able to run a business for yourself.

Unless C2 drastically improves things they will be dead in a few years, count on it.

It is not its business model that can cause its end but the lack of talent/vendors. If most would be subscribers decide not to subcribe that eventually drives away the vendors too. Although if its cost is low enough, practicers and testers could make it still profitable.
 
From page 9:

Quote from rolextrader:
Good developers earn between $10,000 and $15,000 per month. The very best (a handful) earn over $20,000 per month.
More...

Quote from Pekelo:

You just simply CAN NOT know, since you don't know the # of subscribers... :)
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Quote from rolextrader:
This came from the horse's mouth so to speak.
More...
 
As a subscriber to several C2 systems I have to agree with Pekelo (I don't agree with the language he uses to characterize the previous poster whos post was valuable in the sense that it stimulated a good response by Pekelo).

I subscribe to a few profitable systems on C2 after learning how to weed out all the junk ones which the vast majority are. Matthew is constantly improving the platform and it seems to me he is gaining both more vendors and subscribers.

If anybody knows a better platform with a similar business model please let me know.
 
Around 6 months ago there was one week where Collective2 had 700 signals on the grid. Today there are 556 signals showing on the grid. That represents 20% less signals. Also the traffic count site I like to watch shows a significant loss of web traffic on Collective2.
 
Website Value Report for collective2.com
Based on publicly available information, this report outlines estimated traffic levels received by the submitted URL, overviews possible income sources for the site, and proposes a resale value.

Your site is worth $111
 
Quote from 15rms:

Around 6 months ago there was one week where Collective2 had 700 signals on the grid. Today there are 556 signals showing on the grid. That represents 20% less signals. Also the traffic count site I like to watch shows a significant loss of web traffic on Collective2.
More...


Ponderables:

1. 6 months ago the SPX was at 1300. Maybe the market dropping 40% has something to do with people less interested in trading or investing in traders, don't you think?

2. Unless you are a vendor, you should be interested in good systems and not overall traffic. So if you found 5 good systems 6 months ago and you can still find 5 good ones now you shouldn't worry.

3. I don't have a stats on it but the number of systems I would use is rather constant. (very few, all the time)


For NKHOI, automatic website valuations are worthless, you could make an offer to Matt and see if he is willing to sell for $100. :)

Right now there is simply no better site similar to C2, and as long as we stay in the bearmarket I don't expect these type of sites to multiple.
 
<i>"Auto-fading any system or a portfolio of systems could not be easier on C2"</i>

... nor could someone pick a more stupid way of losing their money than that. Basic human logic equates taking the other side of all losing trades as a winning proposition. No need for further thought, now is there?

Yes there is.

How many of those losing trades saw price action barely stop them out before either turning again in what was their original favor, or stringing sideways within persistent two-way chop? How many losing trades actually run deep the other way, deep enough to provide entry & profitable exit on the system fades?

Fading a losing system results in creating another losing system. Both of them will lose side by side, taking opposite signals because enough sideways chop exists to whack them both out over time.

*

Basic human nature = shallow logic will never change, therefore preserving valid reasons why most aspiring traders will always lose money. That fact will never change.
 
Exactly. I have had some trade get blown out on both the long and the short due to chop. Reversing the signals would not have made a profitable trade, only by holding through the chop would have made a profit if you picked the right direction.

If the market trends say down for over a year, and you have a system on C2 that is shorting the market, it may due well for that period, but then may blow up in a bull market, same is true for the reverse. Let's say you have 1,000 systems, over time a few of them will be profitable just because of random luck, but that does not mean that they will stay profitable forever.



Quote from austinp:

<i>"Auto-fading any system or a portfolio of systems could not be easier on C2"</i>

... nor could someone pick a more stupid way of losing their money than that. Basic human logic equates taking the other side of all losing trades as a winning proposition. No need for further thought, now is there?

Yes there is.

How many of those losing trades saw price action barely stop them out before either turning again in what was their original favor, or stringing sideways within persistent two-way chop? How many losing trades actually run deep the other way, deep enough to provide entry & profitable exit on the system fades?

Fading a losing system results in creating another losing system. Both of them will lose side by side, taking opposite signals because enough sideways chop exists to whack them both out over time.

*

Basic human nature = shallow logic will never change, therefore preserving valid reasons why most aspiring traders will always lose money. That fact will never change.
More...
 
Quote from 15rms:

Around 6 months ago there was one week where Collective2 had 700 signals on the grid. Today there are 556 signals showing on the grid. That represents 20% less signals. Also the traffic count site I like to watch shows a significant loss of web traffic on Collective2.
More...

Some of those are probably free systems, so hard to tell...
 
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