You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
What should I learn?
- Thread starter rtr1129
- Start date
Quote from rtr1129:I would like to learn how to trade.
I am a relative newcomer to trading, as I started my journey in July 2012, but I did not know then that it would be a journey. I am still on that journey. But I have learned how to trade. I still have much to learn, surely. But I can trade for a regular profit. Here is how I did it:
I started to participate on an internet message board similar to elitetrader.com, just as you are doing here. And dbphoenix posted in response to one of my posts the same post he addressed here to you:
Quote from dbphoenix:
RWK is correct, and you're going to have to ask yourself some questions first so that people can provide answers you can actually use. The following may be helpful:
In order to succeed at trading, you must have an edge. Your edge begins with the knowledge you gain through your research and testing that a particular price pattern or market behavior offers a level of predictability and a risk to reward ratio that provides a consistently profitable outcome over time.
__________________________________________________
And so on . . . (http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/wyckoff-forum/15535-developing-plan-trading-journal.html)
My goal when I started, just over a year ago, was to retire from my trade - I am a self-employed, blue collar tradesman - within six months, which would have been by January 2013.
I did not make it. But I was able to reduce my work week first by one day, then by two days by January 2013. Then in May/June I reduced my work week to just two market days and Saturday. As of August 2013, I am now trading the opening 60-120 minutes of the NY session everyday, and I work my trade in the afternoon/evening, and some Saturdays.
I will be retired from my trade completely by January 1, 2014.
I am not an expert trader. But I learned how to trade. And here is how I did it:
I read DbPhoenix's Wyckoff forum. I studied his eBook. I studied everything Richard Wyckoff wrote that I could get my hands on. I watched a lot of price action in real time. I am now learning to draw straight lines.
I am a rookie, an apprentice, and when you are my age and you've done what I've been doing for a living for close to thirty years, you appreciate once again having the opportunity to become "an apprentice." As one rookie to another, let me advise you this: Most people on these message boards are not here to help you. Most of them really do not have much market knowledge or sense. Most have started right where you are today and have remained there for year upon blessed year filling their heads with myths and their hearts with fear and loathing. Most will spend more energy and time discouraging others or fighting others than trying to better themselves or help another. Most, but not all.
DbPhoenix is one who does know this business. I cannot say that his way is the only way to trade, but from what I have learned from him and from Wyckoff studies about how the market works, I cannot conceive of any other way to trade the market.
If you want to learn to trade, a good place to start would be to follow his link to the trading journal/trading log, and then look for his journal here at ET called "If you can draw a straight line ..."
I can also recommend looking up nodoji here at ET. I spent some time the last few weeks reading her posts going all the way back to her first day trading stocks journal from five years ago. She learned how to trade, and you can learn from her posts also.
Good luck to you!
Quote from fortydraws:
I am a relative newcomer to trading, as I started my journey in July 2012, but I did not know then that it would be a journey. I am still on that journey. But I have learned how to trade. I still have much to learn, surely. But I can trade for a regular profit. Here is how I did it:
I started to participate on an internet message board similar to elitetrader.com, just as you are doing here. And dbphoenix posted in response to one of my posts the same post he addressed here to you:
My goal when I started, just over a year ago, was to retire from my trade - I am a self-employed, blue collar tradesman - within six months, which would have been by January 2013.
I did not make it. But I was able to reduce my work week first by one day, then by two days by January 2013. Then in May/June I reduced my work week to just two market days and Saturday. As of August 2013, I am now trading the opening 60-120 minutes of the NY session everyday, and I work my trade in the afternoon/evening, and some Saturdays.
I will be retired from my trade completely by January 1, 2014.
I am not an expert trader. But I learned how to trade. And here is how I did it:
I read DbPhoenix's Wyckoff forum. I studied his eBook. I studied everything Richard Wyckoff wrote that I could get my hands on. I watched a lot of price action in real time. I am now learning to draw straight lines.
I am a rookie, an apprentice, and when you are my age and you've done what I've been doing for a living for close to thirty years, you appreciate once again having the opportunity to become "an apprentice." As one rookie to another, let me advise you this: Most people on these message boards are not here to help you. Most of them really do not have much market knowledge or sense. Most have started right where you are today and have remained there for year upon blessed year filling their heads with myths and their hearts with fear and loathing. Most will spend more energy and time discouraging others or fighting others than trying to better themselves or help another. Most, but not all.
DbPhoenix is one who does know this business. I cannot say that his way is the only way to trade, but from what I have learned from him and from Wyckoff studies about how the market works, I cannot conceive of any other way to trade the market.
If you want to learn to trade, a good place to start would be to follow his link to the trading journal/trading log, and then look for his journal here at ET called "If you can draw a straight line ..."
I can also recommend looking up nodoji here at ET. I spent some time the last few weeks reading her posts going all the way back to her first day trading stocks journal from five years ago. She learned how to trade, and you can learn from her posts also.
Good luck to you!
+1
where is dbPhoenix's ebook? on TL?
Input one may think that the operations in the forex currency market are something completely new and difficult, however, the basics are easy to learn. Only need to have knowledge of language and specific terms and understand how forex market works.Quote from rtr1129:
I would like to learn how to trade. I've read a lot of books, and see there are many markets and many strategies and approaches to trading. When I learned to play online poker, I lost my full account the first go round, but I learned, improved, and made money at it. But trading seems a bigger beast than poker. I expect I will lose a lot as I start, just like poker, but how do I decide which markets to put my money in, and which strategies to learn and apply?
I plan to spend time saving and learning the rest of this year, and then start small with a few thousand dollars in 2014 and add $500-1000 every month. I have a somewhat flexible work schedule as a consultant, so I can be at the computer sometimes during work hours, but not always.
I've read about many different approaches, like swing trading, options strategies like covered calls and spreads, and many systems like CANSLIM, Turtle trading, ACD, Elliott waves, Jack Hershey's method, and so on. Any of these surely take a long time to reach a high level of competency. How do you choose, and what do you do on a daily basis to consistently improve?
Quote from rtr1129:
I would like to learn how to trade. I've read a lot of books, and see there are many markets and many strategies and approaches to trading. When I learned to play online poker, I lost my full account the first go round, but I learned, improved, and made money at it. But trading seems a bigger beast than poker. I expect I will lose a lot as I start, just like poker, but how do I decide which markets to put my money in, and which strategies to learn and apply?
I plan to spend time saving and learning the rest of this year, and then start small with a few thousand dollars in 2014 and add $500-1000 every month. I have a somewhat flexible work schedule as a consultant, so I can be at the computer sometimes during work hours, but not always.
I've read about many different approaches, like swing trading, options strategies like covered calls and spreads, and many systems like CANSLIM, Turtle trading, ACD, Elliott waves, Jack Hershey's method, and so on. Any of these surely take a long time to reach a high level of competency. How do you choose, and what do you do on a daily basis to consistently improve?
Did you ever lose your sanity playing poker?
Jack Hershey method. Bwhahaha.
there is nothing you should learn in trading.
forget about those idicators, eliiot waves, random walks,...
all of them.
did you once go to some auction place,like ebay to buy somthing through bid/ask? if you do, you already know how to trade.
trading is play emotions. I remeber I goto ebay to buy an old computer, I try to lower my bid, but someone raised bid, and ask is rasied too.
after several rounds, I feel annoyed, I raised my bid at above ask. oops, I get deal. when I checked other sites, I realized I pay way too much!
so next time, you may think youlearned a lesson, you start to put a lower ball bid, but who cares, you dont get teh deal, and the auction goes crazy, the final deal is way too high (you think)
or did you go fishing?
sometimes it is so easy to catch lot lot lot of fishes
but sometimes it is so hard, change lots of bait /spots, just didnot catch anything!
forget about those idicators, eliiot waves, random walks,...
all of them.
did you once go to some auction place,like ebay to buy somthing through bid/ask? if you do, you already know how to trade.
trading is play emotions. I remeber I goto ebay to buy an old computer, I try to lower my bid, but someone raised bid, and ask is rasied too.
after several rounds, I feel annoyed, I raised my bid at above ask. oops, I get deal. when I checked other sites, I realized I pay way too much!
so next time, you may think youlearned a lesson, you start to put a lower ball bid, but who cares, you dont get teh deal, and the auction goes crazy, the final deal is way too high (you think)
or did you go fishing?
sometimes it is so easy to catch lot lot lot of fishes
but sometimes it is so hard, change lots of bait /spots, just didnot catch anything!
trading is so easy
trading is so hard
when I spot the best strong trend, I feel I can become instant millionaire in one second
when I am stuck in a murky no trending market, I feel sick, I want to quit and give up trading
avoid murky markets as possible as you can: do not chanllenge yourself, youcannot figure out the wayout.
join those cleanly defined trends:almost cruise control, then sleep, play
trading is so hard
when I spot the best strong trend, I feel I can become instant millionaire in one second
when I am stuck in a murky no trending market, I feel sick, I want to quit and give up trading
avoid murky markets as possible as you can: do not chanllenge yourself, youcannot figure out the wayout.
join those cleanly defined trends:almost cruise control, then sleep, play
If you really want to find out, I would suggest that you start here, and then actually follow the steps outlined. If you do follow them, you will discover whether or not you might achieve your goal with your current "trade idea.":
Quote from dbphoenix:
In order to succeed at trading, you must have an edge. Your edge begins with the knowledge you gain through your research and testing that a particular price pattern or market behavior offers a level of predictability and a risk to reward ratio that provides a consistently profitable outcome over time. Without it, one is just "playing" the market in order to have something to talk about on message boards. To get it, you have to know exactly what you're looking for and what to do with it once you've found it. This process is what the journal is all about.
The journal goes through several stages depending on where you are. Once you've decided where you want to concentrate your efforts (at this level, the journal may resemble a diary), then you begin the process of developing a system (or method, strategy, procedure, whatever you want to call it). Here the journal takes on a different character. Once you've developed a tentative/preliminary system, you begin testing/trading it, and the journal adopts a still different character.
The first step is to decide what kind of trader you want to be.
- What do you want to accomplish with your trading? Is it recreational? Supplementary income? A part-time job? Do you want to make a living at it? Even the greenest of the green knows whether or not he wants to make a living at it, trade only part time, trade for recreation, trade for the action, trade to have something to talk about with other traders (for whatever reason), trade only long enough to earn money to do or buy X.
- Do you have any idea what sort of trading is most comfortable? Long or intermediate-term trading? Short-term trading? Day-trading? Trend-trading? Scalping? (Note here that a short-term trader, for example, does not become a long-term trader just because his stop was hit and he didn't sell; a long-term trader doesn't become a short-term trader because he chickened out and sold too soon. Each of these approaches are selected deliberately and for thoroughly-considered reasons.) How patient are you? How adventurous? Are you a leader or a follower (most people think they're leaders)?
The second step is to decide what you're going to trade and when you're going to trade it.
- Have you found an instrument -- futures, stocks, ETFs, bonds, options -- that provides you with the range and volatility you require but also the safety that enables you to relax and trade in an objective and rational manner?
- Have you yet found a time (5m, hourly, weekly) or tick (1t, 200t) or volume (1K, 100K) interval that gives you enough trading opportunities but also gives you enough time to think about what you're doing? If you want to limit your trading to the "morning", are you physically and psychologically prepared to trade all day? If not, can you shrug off whatever opportunities you may miss by limiting the amount of time you spend trading?
And so on . . . (http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/wyckoff-forum/15535-developing-plan-trading-journal.html)