In Finances and accounting we study maths, it's not the main subject but we do it too.
What should I do to become a professional trader?
- Thread starter Mikkel
- Start date
Well I'm interested in technical subjects, I'm a finance student, not a business management or an economics student, we work with numbers everyday. Maths are not my passion but I like them and since I was very young I have been very good on them, they aren't difficult for me.
And I'm not a CS student but I've self-learned some things, I've been very curious about everything related with computers since I was young. The only difference between maths and CS is that I've been teached on it in the school since I was a kid, all that I know about computers is self-learned.
So the problem is not that I don't like maths or CS at all, the problem is that I prefer finance and accounting, I like it, and I think that is important to enjoy what you have to be doing for 4 years.
Thanks for your reply
Yes, you are right, I want to be an institutional trader, and as you I think that is not needed to be a mathematical for reach success in the trading world. I would like to be any of the types of traders that you have mentioned, not just an algo/systematic/hft.
I also have head for numbers, I like them, but I prefer to study finance, I don't want to be four years doing maths all the day, but I like them.
I think that is important to enjoy what you do and put passion on it, but watching what people says it seems that it's impossible to become an institutional trader without studying maths/CS/engineering...
I'm glad to see this kind of answers. I think that studying what I like and giving my best I can reach succes, but hearing what people says around there it looks impossible to do it without maths.
Is this really such a closed world?
Check out the requirements for the position you want then you will have a better idea of what you need to get there. "Trading" is a broad term and means many different things. If you want to be HFT then CS and math is required but you indicated that you want to be an institutional trader. That I don't know much about. If and only if, during your research you see that they want someone with a CFA then you should pursue that. I really don't know. I am a fan of studying what you enjoy. If your school has a alumni in the financial world he/she can mentor or advise you.
On the simulator note I only have experience with TOS I think they are probably all OK.
It is also important to keep up your psychological capital. Success has to do with self mastery. So eat right, sleep right, exersize at a minimum. Adding anything that keeps you healthy is good IE yoga, martial arts, meditation, relaxation. Have some hobbies and be social. Have a life outside of your career pursuits. My two cents.
Yes. Trading is pretty broad term. Maybe it's possible to get a trading job at a hedge fund still without a lot of technical knowledge. I've seen music / psicology majors there but that was some time ago. But they are more liquidity finders and execution providers than what people here might commonly think of as a trader. But it's not a job you'd get right out of school.
won't waste too much time with this one.....either you can program the next best HFT program, or something that can beat it, or turn 10k into 100k or maybe have a good track record for years. then be #1 in your class or very high. prepare to work 100 hours weeks for years and never see the big picture (let the managers worry about that, ok kiddo). if you can trade, prove it with your own cash. use crazy algos and design something that can turn 100,000 into a lot more. if not u are not adding value, there are enough sheeps out there. and remember, the big paychecks have left years and years ago.....it's a new game now
Trading is a very broad term. I have been a proprietary trader my whole career (10 years or so) and I don't even have a degree (started an economics degree but hated it), most of the people that fail are highly academic, I have lots of reasons why that might be but thats another thread. Haven't looked back since.
Would I get hired at a bank without a top class degree, almost certainly not. But that's fine by me, banks aren't even allowed to take speculative positions any more (without jumping through legal loopholes)If you want to go the institutional route I would suggest computer science or at least get some basic C# programming qualifications under your belt.
Then you have the longer term money managers, but that is not what I or most people on this forum would refer to as "trading" it is more an analysts role that occasionally take a long term position based on their view.
Then you have hedgefunds. I have worked for a fund as a trader, you really get all sorts of people. Quantum Physicists, Statisticians, prop traders with a good track record, 19 year old kids that haven't finished their degrees, it all depends on what the fund manager likes, they have carte blanche to mould the company with the talent they think work best.
If you want to compete on academics you need to make sure you are the top 5% of the candidates applying, a degree doesnt really cut it, you need a masters. That isn't because they make better trader's it is because hiring managers are so overwhelmed with candidates they can pick who they want and if you have 1000 applicants for 3 positions and they are all pretty much the same (what else do you have to put on your cv when youve spent your whole life in education) they just pick the masters degrees because they can.
I got my break by starting off as a broker where you just need to be quick witted and a bit of a salesman. I got out of that asap but had a year on my cv showing market experience. Then opened a trading account and traded that on my own. Was a tiny account, like 5k but just to prove I had passion to trade and knew how to break even pretty much. The went around every prop house in London with my results and begged for a chance and then got a break.
I wish I could give a more step by step guide to getting in, but the fact is traders in the sense we refer to them are "the enemy" these days with government regulations a lot of the top institutional teams have set up their own boutique funds and proprietary trading desks which arent quite so easy to find as just sending your CV to Citi Bank
My $0.02
Tom
Would I get hired at a bank without a top class degree, almost certainly not. But that's fine by me, banks aren't even allowed to take speculative positions any more (without jumping through legal loopholes)If you want to go the institutional route I would suggest computer science or at least get some basic C# programming qualifications under your belt.
Then you have the longer term money managers, but that is not what I or most people on this forum would refer to as "trading" it is more an analysts role that occasionally take a long term position based on their view.
Then you have hedgefunds. I have worked for a fund as a trader, you really get all sorts of people. Quantum Physicists, Statisticians, prop traders with a good track record, 19 year old kids that haven't finished their degrees, it all depends on what the fund manager likes, they have carte blanche to mould the company with the talent they think work best.
If you want to compete on academics you need to make sure you are the top 5% of the candidates applying, a degree doesnt really cut it, you need a masters. That isn't because they make better trader's it is because hiring managers are so overwhelmed with candidates they can pick who they want and if you have 1000 applicants for 3 positions and they are all pretty much the same (what else do you have to put on your cv when youve spent your whole life in education) they just pick the masters degrees because they can.
I got my break by starting off as a broker where you just need to be quick witted and a bit of a salesman. I got out of that asap but had a year on my cv showing market experience. Then opened a trading account and traded that on my own. Was a tiny account, like 5k but just to prove I had passion to trade and knew how to break even pretty much. The went around every prop house in London with my results and begged for a chance and then got a break.
I wish I could give a more step by step guide to getting in, but the fact is traders in the sense we refer to them are "the enemy" these days with government regulations a lot of the top institutional teams have set up their own boutique funds and proprietary trading desks which arent quite so easy to find as just sending your CV to Citi Bank
My $0.02
Tom
Is that you Tom ? 
kidding of course. Though the London prop scene being small, I am pretty sure that yep it is Tom.
I would add to your post : GET some internships under your belt.
The advantages : you will be able to see what it is, and find out the realities and how it feels for yourself.
Definitively start trading your own account.
kidding of course. Though the London prop scene being small, I am pretty sure that yep it is Tom.
I would add to your post : GET some internships under your belt.
The advantages : you will be able to see what it is, and find out the realities and how it feels for yourself.
Definitively start trading your own account.