What kind of specific education background would lead to a career as a quant trader?

[MTE]

Quote from SCI new york:

Wow. Just another reason why this board is a disease. Instead of doing the right thing for someone by giving them a simple answer or better still not posting at all, you take your misery (probably due to the fact that you still can't make money even on your paper trading account) and you spill it over to another poster trying to gather information on what is supposed to be a board filled with intelligent people who trade. Do everyone else here a favor and kill yourself

The question about education is asked at least every few weeks here on ET, so the person should try to find past discussions on the subject, just in case this may have been already discussed, before yet again starting a new thread on the same subject.

So anyone who's too lazy to even google a few terms before asking a question on a discussion board let alone do his/her own research doesn't deserve a simple answer.

Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish; and you have fed him for a lifetime.

 

[Buy1Sell2]

Quote from ezbentley:

First of all, what are the differences among these terms:
1. quantitative trading
2. algorithmic trading
3. mechanical trading
4. black box trading

What education discipline is most relevant to a quant trading career? Financial engineering? Statistics? Computer Science? Or is it more multidisciplinary? I am an outsider and if I want to go back to school with the goal of eventually becoming a quant trader, what program should I aim for?

Any advice is appreciated.

I would disregard all but number 3. In addition, no education is required--in fact, less is better. --Common sense is all that is required in trading. Thank you for your time--Ishmael

 

[vita]

Quant Trading is about "trading" using quantitative signals. There is huge difference between a Quant and a Quant Trader. More than 90% of Quants have nothing to do with trading. They are hired to build derivative pricing and hedging engines, conduct research and write code for the infrastructure. Hull's book is a typical Quant text, nothing to do with Quant Trading.
1. quantitative trading (think of it as a "mathematical" technical analysis which may also include e.g. DOM, TICK, etc. to generate signals)
2. algorithmic trading (are high frequency models to minimize the market impact while executing large orders. This is mainly a institutional game, but there are Hedge Funds using them to scalp for 1-2 ticks)
3. mechanical trading (a systematic way of creating trading signals without any discretion, many swing and day traders are doing this)
4. black box trading (high-frequency and fully automated, one operator monitors multiple boxes for potential IT or data problems.

Also read Mark Joshi's Article on Quants Career Path:
http://www.markjoshi.com/downloads/advice.pdf

 

[Stosh]

I know this doesn't answer your specific question, but for what it is worth: If I wanted to be successful in the world of finance and trading, after taking all the basic courses, I would learn all I could about economics, international economics, world affairs, geography, finance, politics, foreign affairs, etc. This will help you comprehend the big picture, sift through the noise, and make independent decisions. Also, most professors will have political and other biases.....so don't latch on to any heroes or gurus until you have studied all the details yourself (don't drink any kool aid).
Just an opinion from a 65 year old who has been down many roads (some dead ends). Good luck.

 

[Kap]

Quote from vita:

Quant Trading is about "trading" using quantitative signals. There is huge difference between a Quant and a Quant Trader. More than 90% of Quants have nothing to do with trading. They are hired to build derivative pricing and hedging engines, conduct research and write code for the infrastructure. Hull's book is a typical Quant text, nothing to do with Quant Trading.
1. quantitative trading (think of it as a "mathematical" technical analysis which may also include e.g. DOM, TICK, etc. to generate signals)
2. algorithmic trading (are high frequency models to minimize the market impact while executing large orders. This is mainly a institutional game, but there are Hedge Funds using them to scalp for 1-2 ticks)
3. mechanical trading (a systematic way of creating trading signals without any discretion, many swing and day traders are doing this)
4. black box trading (high-frequency and fully automated, one operator monitors multiple boxes for potential IT or data problems.

Also read Mark Joshi's Article on Quants Career Path:
http://www.markjoshi.com/downloads/advice.pdf

"a cake has 3 cherries on top", oh no, you couldnt be further from the truth , a cake has 4 cherries on it !

I've been a quant trader, and let me tell we dont look at the Dom or the Tick - that made me lol

http://www.wilmott.com/

 

[asiaprop]

not sure what your exact understanding of "quant trading" is. You do not need any particular quantitative skills for most of your below mentioned points. Programming skills are possibly the most important for those.

However, if you express interest in trading derivatives as part of prop (currently most banks do not commit a whole lot to prop groups inside their sell-side outlets) or if you are interested in pricing and trading exotic fixed income or equity derivatives then I can highly recommend the following programs (I attended one of them), listed in no particular order:

1) FinEng at UCB
2) MSCF at CMU
3) NYU Quant programs

So, it depends on what you actually want to do and what fits your actual skills. All above programs are highly competitive but well worth it especially if you want to trade exotics. I hear that their placement rates are still pretty high. You may want to enter such programs already with strong math and analytical skills and some experience in programming would also help a lot. I absolutely do not believe in the value of any MBA program, my take is its for those who prefer to be political to make up for their lack of mathematical and reasoning skill sets. I would always prefer to hire a highly energetic guy who is hungry and has already developed trading strartegies with edge and taken risk to run those, even at home, over someone with a title in his arm and a lot of pride that he graduated with an MBA from UPenn or the like. I find the quant programs so much more applicable because those who did not cheat their way through the program generally bring to the table the skills necessary to get them started at a vanilla or exotic derivs desk.

PM me if you want more info but please come with specific questions.



Hope this helps.

Quote from ezbentley:

First of all, what are the differences among these terms:
1. quantitative trading
2. algorithmic trading
3. mechanical trading
4. black box trading

What education discipline is most relevant to a quant trading career? Financial engineering? Statistics? Computer Science? Or is it more multidisciplinary? I am an outsider and if I want to go back to school with the goal of eventually becoming a quant trader, what program should I aim for?

Any advice is appreciated.

 

[lolatency]

Quote from ezbentley:

First of all, what are the differences among these terms:
1. quantitative trading
2. algorithmic trading
3. mechanical trading
4. black box trading

What education discipline is most relevant to a quant trading career? Financial engineering? Statistics? Computer Science? Or is it more multidisciplinary? I am an outsider and if I want to go back to school with the goal of eventually becoming a quant trader, what program should I aim for?

Any advice is appreciated.

... I am a 'quant trader' -- I have a BS in computer engineering and a masters in statistics. I can't tell you how awesome this combination of degrees is. The reason is because the math you pick up from the electrical engineering side of computer engineering, the software and algorithms side from the CS aspect of computer engineering, and the mathematics from statistics.

 

[lolatency]

Quote from lolatency:

... I am a 'quant trader' -- I have a BS in computer engineering and a masters in statistics. I can't tell you how awesome this combination of degrees is. The reason is because the math you pick up from the electrical engineering side of computer engineering, the software and algorithms side from the CS aspect of computer engineering, and the mathematics from statistics.

One comment, though. I have the unfortunate predicament of being only able to work in large institutions. All the strategies I work with and employ require so much infrastructure that my career is very dependent on wealthy organizations.

Trying to go independent has been extremely difficult for me, particularly because of the structure of retail trading.

 

[Kap]

Quote from lolatency:

One comment, though. I have the unfortunate predicament of being only able to work in large institutions. All the strategies I work with and employ require so much infrastructure that my career is very dependent on wealthy organizations.

Trying to go independent has been extremely difficult for me, particularly because of the structure of retail trading.

The infrastructure is a lot cheaper now than it was, alternatives to Bloomy and Reuters are plenty, but yah still gotta do volume to make it pay -also you do however need that base chunk $ to work off. I have made the transition and run prop millsecond Algos, chuck me a pm if u wish to discuss.

 

[academic]

Quote from lolatency:

Trying to go independent has been extremely difficult for me, particularly because of the structure of retail trading.

When you say "infrastructure" are you referring to the technology you run your strategies on and the connection to the market?

What prevents retail traders from having access to those things?