What kind of Edge you have?

[Speculate]

Just to clarify your comments Speculate. You seem to say that an edge is a guarantee that what you hope will happen will and that there are no other edges than existing market defects. Is that what you meant to say or did I misunderstand your comments.

Hmmm.

No guarantees in life pal. But the risk is much less than punting an out right. The list I gave probably do include a lot of misspricings and similar examples/defects, but I wouldnt say they are the only ones. Superior HFT will have an edge for example if they can be one of the first on every price.

Its a similar way to how a brokerage or casino makes money. As long as there are punters, there will be almost guaranteed opportunity over time.

You can still make bags of money without trading an edge with talent and understanding. Perhaps more. After reading Alchemy of Finance, I wouldnt say Soros had an 'edge' but he did have great trade management, cut his losses early and let his winners run. Most of his hypothesis on what the market should do based on reflexivity didnt work out did they? Great trader, but no edge as such. Some could disagree and say his concept of reflexivity allowed him to understand that the markets were mispriced where others couldnt see that. It's an interesting point to me. I think if it was a valid edge, then a lot more of his trades would have come good. Eitherway, it's academic, cos the dude milked it - and still is. And thats all that matters at the end of the day.

Back to the markets....

 

[wrbtrader]

Not really.

This is like saying a chef needs a set of sharp knives. It's common sense. It gets you in the game with a hope. Your list wont give ANYONE an advantage what so ever - let alone compete for a genuine edge.

Stress management lol. Whats stressful about being able to make money? Stress is for losers pal. Where shall I go on holiday this month - ahh shooot. I cant handle the stress of deciding. LOL. Happens all the time!

You've twisted what I said. I didn't equate it to sharp knives.

In contrast, I'm saying the CHEF is the edge. Don't you even watch TV chef cook-off. Contestants all given the same ingredients to make a particular dish. Than the judges determines via taste which one cooked that meal more delicious than the other chefs.

They all are given the same ingredients is like saying the traders are all given the same trade strategy. Cooked with the same equipment, cooked in the same room, cooked via the same deadline clock and cooked in front of the same judges. Yet, its the chef, the one that's able to make that meal more delicious than the other chefs...that chef will win.

That's trading and many threads here for fact have proven the above analogy. Members sharing their trade strategy (ingredients) but the results from member to member are different in comparison to each other.

Seriously, how can multiple traders in one trade journal be trading the exact same trading instrument via the exact same trade strategy via the same time frame get different trade results ?

Hint: Each trader are different in other areas of their trading plan...things that are not trade signal strategy.

For example, I once watched a live trading competition in Europe...both guys happen to be using the same trade strategy. You can clearly see one more cool under pressure while the other was not. You can see clearly distracted by noises in the room while the other was not. You can clearly see both putting on different position size although both using the exact same capital. You can clearly see them take their rest periods differently than the other and you can clearly see the differences in their trade errors...this is discretionary trading (traders not using automation).

Take a look at the trade journals closely here at ET...read carefully about other things these folks mention while trading. There's guys squeezing in trades while a manager, another trading full time after a back injury put him home for several months, another has heavy financial debts and undercapitalized, another going through a nasty divorce, another loss a spouse (car accident)...

You seriously believe there's NO stress while trading...please tell me what planet you're own. Everybody is in a different situation due to personal differences in their life...it does in fact impact their trade results.

With that said, that's just a discussion about stress. Don't forget all the other components of a trade plan (e.g. capitalization, risk management, discipline and so on)...if the trader doesn't know how to manage all of it or get them to work together as a team. Who's at fault...yep...the trader.

The Chef is the key even though having proper kitchen tools is important too.

By the way, most of the top institution firms have either in house psychologists and psychological evaluations for incoming employees...if job stress isn't an issue as you suggested...I guess these top firms are wasting their money in thinking that problems in one's personal life can impact one's job performance.

(A profitable trader that had one bad day)

Food for Thought

 

[londonkid]

It's also a really time and mentally intensive way to trade. IMO we as traders don't consider enough how much time is actually worth.

I came to the same conclusion when trading from a DOM. I tried it years ago and realised it wasn't for me. These days I just want to know the inside price, sometimes I look at the amount on the bid/offer to attempt to get a 'good' entry as price is leaving.

For me everything I do is geared towards longevity. I put my first trade on at the age of 22 and I am now 38 (i haven't been trading that long though, there were gaps). My thought process was if I am going to put years of my life into something to make it work I want to make sure I can and will want to trade the same way at age 70+. So for me staring at a DOM was not an option as it is not something I enjoy doing now let alone as I get older. I will still happily day trade though, i guess as I get older I will start to cherry pick days and sessions.

GL

 

[Autodidact]

You've twisted what I said. I didn't equate it to sharp knives.

In contrast, I'm saying the CHEF is the edge. Don't you even watch TV chef cook-off. Contestants all given the same ingredients to make a particular dish. Than the judges determines via taste which one cooked that meal more delicious than the other chefs.

They all are given the same ingredients is like saying the traders are all given the same trade strategy. Cooked with the same equipment, cooked in the same room, cooked via the same deadline clock and cooked in front of the same judges. Yet, its the chef, the one that's able to make that meal more delicious than the other chefs...that chef will win.

That's trading and many threads here for fact have proven the above analogy. Members sharing their trade strategy (ingredients) but the results from member to member are different in comparison to each other.

Seriously, how can multiple traders in one trade journal be trading the exact same trading instrument via the exact same trade strategy via the same time frame get different trade results ?

Hint: Each trader are different in other areas of their trading plan...things that are not trade signal strategy.

For example, I once watched a live trading competition in Europe...both guys happen to be using the same trade strategy. You can clearly see one more cool under pressure while the other was not. You can see clearly distracted by noises in the room while the other was not. You can clearly see both putting on different position size although both using the exact same capital. You can clearly see them take their rest periods differently than the other and you can clearly see the differences in their trade errors...this is discretionary trading (traders not using automation).

Take a look at the trade journals closely here at ET...read carefully about other things these folks mention while trading. There's guys squeezing in trades while a manager, another trading full time after a back injury put him home for several months, another has heavy financial debts and undercapitalized, another going through a nasty divorce, another loss a spouse (car accident)...

You seriously believe there's NO stress while trading...please tell me what planet you're own. Everybody is in a different situation due to personal differences in their life...it does in fact impact their trade results.

With that said, that's just a discussion about stress. Don't forget all the other components of a trade plan (e.g. capitalization, risk management, discipline and so on)...if the trader doesn't know how to manage all of it or get them to work together as a team. Who's at fault...yep...the trader.

The Chef is the key even though having proper kitchen tools is important too.

By the way, most of the top institution firms have either in house psychologists and psychological evaluations for incoming employees...if job stress isn't an issue as you suggested...I guess these top firms are wasting their money in thinking that problems in one's personal life can impact one's job performance.

(A profitable trader that had one bad day)

Food for Thought

The Dumbass using the IB TWS could had been using the Demo account and just playing an act.

 

[jimmiebarton]

i voted price action, but that isn't all of it. PA, but in CONTEXT of greater sentiment!
Read B/W the lines!
IE, intuition forged from experience in the trench, firefight

 

[GiantDog]

It seems to suit me. I only trade for a couple of hours a day and take frequent breaks. The time spent learning was brutal though.

What hours do you trade the 6e? The London open? Or?

 

[wartrace]

I came to the same conclusion when trading from a DOM. I tried it years ago and realised it wasn't for me. These days I just want to know the inside price, sometimes I look at the amount on the bid/offer to attempt to get a 'good' entry as price is leaving.

For me everything I do is geared towards longevity. I put my first trade on at the age of 22 and I am now 38 (i haven't been trading that long though, there were gaps). My thought process was if I am going to put years of my life into something to make it work I want to make sure I can and will want to trade the same way at age 70+. So for me staring at a DOM was not an option as it is not something I enjoy doing now let alone as I get older. I will still happily day trade though, i guess as I get older I will start to cherry pick days and sessions.

GL

Staring at the dom would get old quick. I have Jigsaw trading's DOM and it will show you what is being pulled and if there is being size added.

What hours do you trade the 6e? The London open? Or?

Too early for me. I am up at 3am cst to trade.

 

[londonkid]

Staring at the dom would get old quick. I have Jigsaw trading's DOM and it will show you what is being pulled and if there is being size added.

Yes I understand why day trading off a DOM appeals to some. It just doesn't appeal to me very much. horses for courses.

 

[Speculate]

You've twisted what I said. I didn't equate it to sharp knives.

In contrast, I'm saying the CHEF is the edge. Don't you even watch TV chef cook-off. Contestants all given the same ingredients to make a particular dish. Than the judges determines via taste which one cooked that meal more delicious than the other chefs.

They all are given the same ingredients is like saying the traders are all given the same trade strategy. Cooked with the same equipment, cooked in the same room, cooked via the same deadline clock and cooked in front of the same judges. Yet, its the chef, the one that's able to make that meal more delicious than the other chefs...that chef will win.

That's trading and many threads here for fact have proven the above analogy. Members sharing their trade strategy (ingredients) but the results from member to member are different in comparison to each other.

Seriously, how can multiple traders in one trade journal be trading the exact same trading instrument via the exact same trade strategy via the same time frame get different trade results ?

Hint: Each trader are different in other areas of their trading plan...things that are not trade signal strategy.

For example, I once watched a live trading competition in Europe...both guys happen to be using the same trade strategy. You can clearly see one more cool under pressure while the other was not. You can see clearly distracted by noises in the room while the other was not. You can clearly see both putting on different position size although both using the exact same capital. You can clearly see them take their rest periods differently than the other and you can clearly see the differences in their trade errors...this is discretionary trading (traders not using automation).

Take a look at the trade journals closely here at ET...read carefully about other things these folks mention while trading. There's guys squeezing in trades while a manager, another trading full time after a back injury put him home for several months, another has heavy financial debts and undercapitalized, another going through a nasty divorce, another loss a spouse (car accident)...

You seriously believe there's NO stress while trading...please tell me what planet you're own. Everybody is in a different situation due to personal differences in their life...it does in fact impact their trade results.

With that said, that's just a discussion about stress. Don't forget all the other components of a trade plan (e.g. capitalization, risk management, discipline and so on)...if the trader doesn't know how to manage all of it or get them to work together as a team. Who's at fault...yep...the trader.

The Chef is the key even though having proper kitchen tools is important too.

By the way, most of the top institution firms have either in house psychologists and psychological evaluations for incoming employees...if job stress isn't an issue as you suggested...I guess these top firms are wasting their money in thinking that problems in one's personal life can impact one's job performance.

(A profitable trader that had one bad day)

Food for Thought

Sorry, I find this all slightly moronic.

1. You've just completely reversed your initial argument.
2. The psychologists you talk of are there to help reach and maintain peak performance. Not help stressed out losers lick their wounds and feel better about themselves. They dont even get to sit down.
3. Your 2nd YouTube clip - How on earth do you know he's a profitable trader? Because he said so? I'm sorry, thats just idle of you. I only watched the first 40 secs and could see he has no discipline and is totally unable to see the market objectively and act accordingly. He's just so far away from what a consistent trader has to behave and act like its funny.
4. The final clip is of that 'Anton' character. Mr. self proclaimed 'celebrity trader'. He's a clown. He used to be a flow trader at GS. Whoopie-doo! The guy is just an ego who talks a game for the newbies. An English version of Jim Crammer. Wouldnt be surprised if he sells courses next: How to trade like a GS trader. LOL.

 

[Jakobsberg]

Wouldnt be surprised if he sells courses next: How to trade like a GS trader. LOL.

You can already pay Anton 2000 USD for his 20 lecture DVD and a certificate from "The institute of traders" One for your Christmas wish list :eek: