This is b.s. I met alot of bible thumpers growing up cause i was in a catholic school, until grade 8, and of all the guys (who were friends of mine)that i remember being deeply religious, there isnt a single one who has kids out of wedlock. Im not saying that 100% of religious people dont have kids out of wedlock, im just saying that they are much more inclinced to have kids in a 2 person household, that in and of itself is a monster benefit in terms of creating a kid who will not be a burden to society.
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what it means to be morman. do we want a man as president who believes this tripe?
- Thread starter Free Thinker
- Start date
This is b.s. I met alot of bible thumpers growing up cause i was in a catholic school, until grade 8, and of all the guys (who were friends of mine)that i remember being deeply religious, there isnt a single one who has kids out of wedlock. Im not saying that 100% of religious people dont have kids out of wedlock, im just saying that they are much more inclinced to have kids in a 2 person household, that in and of itself is a monster benefit in terms of creating a kid who will not be a burden to society.
Quote from Max E. Pad:
This is b.s. I met alot of bible thumpers growing up cause i was in a catholic school, until grade 8, and of all the guys (who were friends of mine)that i remember being deeply religious, there isnt a single one who has kids out of wedlock. Im not saying that 100% of religious people dont have kids out of wedlock, im just saying that they are much more inclinced to have kids in a 2 person household, that in and of itself is a monster benefit in terms of creating a kid who will not be a burden to society.
that is a great point..
I can't tell you how many Catholic guys I know who married the girl they got pregnant in high school or college. I know 3 sons from the same family.
My wife's good good friend got pregnant in college and got married for the same reasons.
Its funny cause there son is in college their daughter is getting married soon and by comparison getting out of diapers.
Quote from Epic:
Indeed. For some people this personal definition is cultivated and expressed through religion, while for others it is developed regardless of religion. For those who feel that structured religion has provided this, it is understandable that they would assume others would be benefited by it also. For those who feel like they have the personal strength to develop these virtues without religion, it is understandable that they would view religion as pointless and annoying. But an atheist doesn't have any place telling a believer that they are stupid if that is what the believer feels enables them to develop the very characteristics that we all strive for. On the same token, the believer has no place assuming that atheists can't develop those virtues without religion.
I believe that a large portion of our society needs to believe in something greater, to give them purpose and drive them to be productive. It is a very dangerous thing for an atheist to suppose that these people (and society as a whole) would be better served without that driving force regardless of whether specific religious traditions are demonstrably true or false.
I was working on a large project awhile back, and while instructing some of my employees, I just couldn't understand why the simplest tasks were so difficult for them. In my mind any intelligent person should just be able to view the task in a reasonable manner and develop some basic understanding of what needed to be done. They kept calling me over for a demonstration on technical aspects of accomplishing the goal.
Unfortunately there were numerous times when I made some comment to the effect of, "Come on guys, this is not difficult to figure out. Just use your brain for a second and it will be obvious." After a while they weren't asking for demonstrations and I assumed that they were taking the initiative and getting it done. When I finally checked back in, their progress was painfully slow and half of what they had done was incorrect. In my view it seemed that they had deliberately chosen the most difficult path forward.
I was flustered and reprimanded them, while they were discouraged and offended. I learned that it is very dangerous to assume that just because I don't need direction, others shouldn't need it either. Since then I have taken the approach of providing whatever support is necessary and allowing the employee to determine the timeline under which the proper course becomes logical and habitual.
So it is with religion. It is not for anyone to decide that any other person doesn't need instruction in life. There are many people who simply won't reach their potential without it.
It is very well documented that the deterioration of the strong family unit has a devastating effect on society. It stretches all the way through society from crime to household income.
The viability of a Romney presidency has nothing to do with whether Joe Smith found a gold book. It doesn't even have anything to do with whether Romney believes that he did. It has to do with his ability to govern more effectively than his opponent and to recognize the proper role of government in the lives of individuals.
The point at issue is surely WHY a religious believer believes, not that they are stupid. Reasons given, are rational or not but stupid reasons are what they are. If people need those to give them personal strength, then it is a matter that attracts and deserves critical questioning.
I disagree with your premise. It is a 'higher thing' in common consciousness to do right and good for the sake of it, to improve for real and practical reasons, to achieve and do better for yourself, your family and community.
Only doing so because you believe in a religion, because you're trying to please a deity is selfish and demeans greater things.
Quote from jem:
that is a great point..
I can't tell you how many Catholic guys I know who married the girl they got pregnant in high school or college. I know 3 sons from the same family.
My wife's good good friend got pregnant in college and got married for the same reasons.
Its funny cause there son is in college their daughter is getting married soon and by comparison getting out of diapers.
A buddy of mine who was deeply religious (parents basically ran the church) now plays in the NHL, and the first thing he did when he got signed to a multi million dollar contract was get married to a home town girl, and there is no way this guy would cheat on her.
We always razz him about it when he comes home, and we golf with him again, cause the whole thing about playing pro sports is to get hot chicks..... He is unwavering in his beliefs and i respect him for it.
Quote from Max E. Pad:
This is b.s. I met alot of bible thumpers growing up cause i was in a catholic school, until grade 8, and of all the guys (who were friends of mine)that i remember being deeply religious, there isnt a single one who has kids out of wedlock. Im not saying that 100% of religious people dont have kids out of wedlock, im just saying that they are much more inclinced to have kids in a 2 person household, that in and of itself is a monster benefit in terms of creating a kid who will not be a burden to society.
Bible thumping catholics out of wedlock not withstanding!
It's a ridiculous argument to assume because you know some stable religious households, religious households are more likely to be stable.
An association fallacy.
No doubt you'll know dogs have four legs 'cause you've met a lot. So do you then presume cats must be dogs? They're not, but generally are more stable!
Quote from stu:
Catholic bible thumping catholics out of wedlock not withstanding!
It's a ridiculous argument to assume because you know some stable religious households, religious households are more likely to be stable.
No doubt you'll know dogs have four legs 'cause you've met a lot. So do you then presume cats must be dogs? They're not, but generally more stable!
Thats bullshit though, because the percentages are so much higher,
I admit the amount of people i know is not statistically significant, However If you take someone who truly believes in the bible, who eats it up hook line and sinker, they are far less likely to get divorced, or end in divorce. This is a fact.
Quote from Max E. Pad:
A buddy of mine who was deeply religious (parents basically ran the church) now plays in the NHL, and the first thing he did when he got signed to a multi million dollar contract was get married to a home town girl, and there is no way this guy would cheat on her.
We always razz him about it when he comes home, and we golf with him again, cause the whole thing about playing pro sports is to get hot chicks..... He is unwavering in his beliefs and i respect him for it.
People are that way who don't get religious. That's assuredly deserving more respect.
Surely you first respect someone for their deeds not because they need an opiate in the form of religion to fix them that way.
Quote from stu:
People are that way who don't get religious. That's assuredly deserving more respect.
Surely you first respect someone for their deeds not because they need an opiate in the form of religion to fix them that way.
Sure there are people who are genuinely like that, but generally they are not like that in as high of numbers as those who thoroughly believe in their religion.