Were any of the great scientists/inventors also religious?

Quote from LongShot:

http://www.atheists.org/flash.line/atheism1.htm


"A leading scientific journal concludes that increasingly, scientists have doubts about the existence of a deity or similar supernatural and religious claims. This finding questions the pop-culture view that science and religion are moving toward a consensus, and a shared view about the humanity and the universe. The study also touches on the changing character of the scientific enterprise in modern society..."

Sorry, but the contrarian approach to science (as in the markets), is often a reliable indicator. Thomas Kuhn, Harvard historian and physics instructor, destroyed the icon that you are placing before us in the early 60's.

He described how institutional science worked. Establishment science, which he called "normal science", operated on the most and agreeable theory of a given era. But as anomalies in the theory appeared in increasing numbers, the establishment became defensive and insecure.

And, always, the new theory is not accepted until the Old Guard can be slowly vanquished. Imo this is exactly what is happening currently in science with the great number of alternative physicists and cosmologists that are rising to prominence. The diehard materialist movement that was crowned the new King of All Science at the Darwin Centennial in 1959 is now experiencing anomalies and does not want to share its throne....

To quote Hoyle: "Explosions do not usually lead to well-ordered situations" and "a commonsense interpretation of the facts suggest that a superintellect has monkeyed with physics, as well as chemistry and biology."

Again, Hoyle was far from a traditional theist, but he was also far from a traditional materialist.
 
Quote from LongShot:


If god created the universe what created god?

Maybe only God himself could answer your this question, therefore you'd better seek him first and then ask him directly! :)
 
Quote from ArchAngel:


To the same degree, there isn't any evidence to suggest there isn't. Either way, it's nothing more than a personal opinion formed without specific evidence to support it either way.



You draw exactly the wrong conclusion from your example. You appear to be confusing an actual "lack of evidence" with "an existence of evidence to the contrary". They are NOT the same.

It is absolutely correct that if you claim a herd of elephants stampeded your living room but a check of your living room shows no disturbance consistent with a herd of elephants passing, then you CAN logically conclude there were no elephants.

The reason's simple - it is NOT about a lack of evidence that there were elephants. Instead, while there is no evidence showing elephants, there is a clear PRESCENCE of evidence to contrary. The evidence being that none of the damage that must follow a herd of elephants stampeding through your living room.

On the other hand, so far no one has presented any evidence that is inconsistent with the belief in a universal creative intelligence. There have been a lot of equally unsupportable opinions/beliefs that no such entity exists, but no actual evidence to the contrary. In this case, this really IS a lack of evidence and therefore does not prove non-existance.

The difference should be axiomatic - however perhaps personal bias or belief in your own opionion's "rightness" is preventing you from seeing the otherwise clear distinction.

Conclusion - with a lack of outright evidence to support or evidence to the contrary, it is perfectly reasonable for people to have opposing views on the subject based on their own way of looking at the universe, beliefs, views, etc.

And while it is true that in the final analysis, given that the views are diametric opposites, only one can ultimately be "right" - we may never know which it is.



Indeed - an excellent question for which it is doubtful any of us will ever know (or understand) the answer.

"lack of evidence" or "evidence to the contrary" , or both.. whatever semantical games you wish to play ..the burden of proof remains on the claimant. you wish to rationally assert that god exists then you'd better back it up otherwise you're just another crank. our mere existence does not presuppose a god creator, you will have to do a lot better than that. if i claim the existence of fornons without adequate substantiation my position is irrational, and the rational position for you is disbelief, and you are under no requirement to produce "evidence to the contrary".

"One might be asked "How can you prove that a god does not exist?" One can only reply that it is scarcely necessary to disprove what has never been proved." --- David A. Spitz
 
Quote from OddTrader:



Maybe only God himself could answer your this question, therefore you'd better seek him first and then ask him directly! :)

"Suppose we've chosen the wrong god. Every time we go to church we're just making him madder and madder." --- Homer Simpson

:p
 
Quote from dgabriel:



If you meant, "If the Universe IS, why does it follow that God must exist?", I would answer:

"It does not follow at all!"

I am beginning to be reminded of those discussions that occurred after a few joints with freinds in high school.

still smoking it up i see :p
 
Quote from marketsurfer:




your simplistic logic and inability to reach beyond the basics is glaringly obvious. i'll try to explain this the best that i can in this format---- the world is divided into two basic frameworks, causality and participation. causality is the pragmatic rationality of science--- ( you, axeman, gg, et al ) you detach yourself and explain the world by objective, explanatory schemes based on neutrality and instrumentation.

i, on the other hand, enter into the "participation" framework of the world. this framework places the individual into a collective sea that erodes the barrier between human agency and the surrounding environment--- in the participation framework-- a creator is an obvious given regardless of the inability of language to describe same.

i also view the market and trade from this framework, by choice , adding a tinge of causality to fine tune the macro picture.

try it, you just might like it.

:)


"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." --- Carl Sagan

:)
 
Quote from LongShot:



"Suppose we've chosen the wrong god. Every time we go to church we're just making him madder and madder." --- Homer Simpson

:p

My own perception is there is only one universal God (disregarding any labels) for all human beings (personally I do not hold an opinion for there is any difference between whatever believers, believers-to-be, and unbelievers of God).

I go to church is simply to reinforce me the spirit of Jesus.

Probably, Simpson's observation is now a little bit outdated, I'm afraid (no offense!)! :D
 
Quote from OddTrader:



My own perception is there is only one universal God...

I go to church is simply to reinforce me the spirit of Jesus.
what a bunch of crap.

not only can you not prove any god exists, now you're claiming there is 1 and not more.

you are in no position what-so-ever to claim you know a god does or does not exist, what it is, or how many there are if they exist.

can we please stop the bullshit.
 
Quote from Gordon Gekko:


you are in no position what-so-ever to claim you know a god does or does not exist, what it is, or how many there are if they exist.

can we please stop the bullshit.

So you are in a position to command anyone whether:

"you are in no position what-so-ever to claim you know a god does or does not exist, what it is, or how many there are if they exist."!? :confused: :D
 
Quote from OddTrader:



So you are in a position to command anyone whether:

"you are in no position what-so-ever to claim you know a god does or does not exist, what it is, or how many there are if they exist."!? :confused: :D
duh!

it's freaking obvious we don't have anywhere near all the answers. admit this is reality and stop making ridiculous claims--this goes to all religious people.
 
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