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Welfare question
- Thread starter riddler
- Start date
Quote from oldtime:
ok, you completely cut out, unemloyment, medicaid, obamacare, SSID, farm subsidies, SCHIP, public employee pensions and benefits and see where that gets you
I get sudden solvency of places like california, New York, and Chicago, I get rid of about $5T unfunded liability, lower taxes, and in the federal budget we immediately take out about $518 Billion
Of the $64B a month paid out in SSI, about $10B of that is disability. $120B a year
Farm subsidies + food stamps = 150B
SCHIP $7B
federal employee pensions about $70B + their health care
medicaid $81B
Unemployment about $90B
maybe so, but you can't really get rid of medicaid without amending the hypocratic oath
one way or the other you are going to pay for it, either through taxes or higher premiums
at 2% growth there is probably no hope
but after we make all your cuts, we will still be in trouble until we find a cheaper way to stay healthy and be defended
one way or the other you are going to pay for it, either through taxes or higher premiums
at 2% growth there is probably no hope
but after we make all your cuts, we will still be in trouble until we find a cheaper way to stay healthy and be defended
show up at the hospital broke and see if they turn you awayQuote from zdreg:
"maybe so, but you can't really get rid of medicaid without amending the hypocratic oath"
the oath is 26centuries old
" The oath is written in Ionic Greek (late 5th century BC"
medicaid is less than 50 years old.
what are you smoking?
somebody pays for that
Quote from oldtime:
maybe so, but you can't really get rid of medicaid without amending the hypocratic oath
one way or the other you are going to pay for it, either through taxes or higher premiums
at 2% growth there is probably no hope
but after we make all your cuts, we will still be in trouble until we find a cheaper way to stay healthy and be defended
the hippocratic oath is for doctors, not me, it says nothing about me owing you health care
you leeches have no honor, you claim it is your right to take at the expense of others and the rest of us get nothing in return but a bill to pay
society cannot functon that way, social contract cannot be an open ended right to other people's money
old people are selfish, many consume hundreds of thousands just to live an extra year of a crappy bed ridden life with no thought that it might cost the rest of us a lot of sacrifice
old people can solve this problem really easy, stop with selfish and desperate end of life crap. I don't expect them to though, they have been remarkably selfish to this point
http://ajrccm.atsjournals.org/content/165/6/750.full
if people older than 68 simply said they would not accept IC for longer than a few days, we could take a huge step. What's the point? they won't live much longer anyway and the quality of life is low.
http://ajrccm.atsjournals.org/content/165/6/750.full
Total health care costs in the United States (U.S.) reached $989 billion in 1995 and now exceed $1 trillion, 14% of the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) (1). Of this total, a disproportionate share is attributable to the care of elderly patients shortly before their deaths. According to Lubitz and Prihoda (2) and Lubitz and Riley (3), 6% of Medicare recipients 65 yr of age and older who died in 1978 and 1988 accounted for 28% of all costs of the Medicare program. In the same two years, 77% of the Medicare decedents' expenditures occurred in the last year of life, 52% of them in the last 2 mo, and 40% in the last month. Inpatient expenses accounted for over 70% of the decedents' total costs. ....
The major reason that cost reduction should be possible in the ICU is that critical care is extremely expensive. Of the $989 billion spent on health care in the U.S. in 1995, expenditures for hospital care amounted to approximately $350 billion and constituted the largest portion (1). Assuming that ICU costs were 20% of all hospital costs, which they were estimated to be in 1986 (7), these costs were around $70 billion in 1995 or 1% of the GDP. The costs of ICU care probably are higher today, not only because total hospital costs are higher but also because ICU costs may represent a larger fraction of hospital costs, inasmuch as a greater percentage of hospitalized patients are cared for in the ICU.
The high cost of intensive care is reflected in daily ICU costs, which range from $2,000 to $3,000 in many U.S. hospitals (8). As Chaix and colleagues (9) have demonstrated, the ICU costs of individual patients may be equated with the amount of time the patients are cared for in the ICU, their length of stay (LOS). As a result, clinicians and administrators alike may assume that health care, hospital, and ICU costs can be reduced by thousands of dollars simply by decreasing ICU LOS. Such a decrease might involve not only the few patients with a long LOS, who are most expensive on a per-patient basis, but also the larger number of patients who stay in the ICU only a few days
if people older than 68 simply said they would not accept IC for longer than a few days, we could take a huge step. What's the point? they won't live much longer anyway and the quality of life is low.
the doctor can only treat so many poor people out of his own pocket before he finally has to start raising your rates.Quote from Mav88:
the hippocratic oath is for doctors, not me, it says nothing about me owing you health care
you leeches have no honor, you claim it is your right to take at the expense of others and the rest of us get nothing in return but a bill to pay
society cannot functon that way, social contract cannot be an open ended right to other people's money
old people are selfish, many consume hundreds of thousands just to live an extra year of a crappy bed ridden life with no thought that it might cost the rest of us a lot of sacrifice
you don't get the bill, the poor person gets the bill
then it goes to collections
and if there is enough of them he can declare medical bankruptcy
in some cases the poor patient may be unconscious, so he is really not given the choice if he wants to be a leech or wait until he has saved up enough money to get his heart going again