Weinstein Trading and Fading

Thanks Oraclewizard,

Most of my trading is built on the idea of acting as the market maker but with fading extremes. This of course can have a much higher win rate but the losses tend to be much higher as well. Not unlike a mini-lotto where you collect small amounts and then pay out a relatively large amount.

I have found that one of my biggest challenges is to "switch" gears and trade one idea and stay with it as I sometimes want to put on my "fading" hat. I have found that when not fading its important for me to put in my stops RIGHT AWAY or I have a tendency to want to trade out of a loser which often "works" but appears to have a negative edge so the law of averages catches up. Fading with a positive expectancy though is about as great as it gets in my opinion.

Are you using Ninja to automate your trading and/or are you using ninja to execute your trades? If so do you have any comments or concerns with it? I am looking at automating some of my signals that can not be done fast enough manually. I want to connect Tradestation to ninja to IB and or maybe just ninja to IB but if I can do both I can save a lot of manual entry of data into ninja on some of my trades.

I would like to be able to "push a button" with ninja and have it enter in the order at a limit as well as enter in the stoploss upon execution of the original order. Plus as I found out TWICE today IB stop losses do not always work. once in booktrader and once in integrated order entry which is more than frustrating but perhaps I am doing something wrong...


Thanks again for your very welcomed posts and insights



Robert








Quote from oraclewizard77:

Good job Robert, I knew you could do it! Personally, I have no problem with a larger losing day if I have mostly winning days. I also incorporated a new signal into my trading, but tested it small and it worked out. I then switched to demo for rest of day. Then I spent after market studying my charts and my mentors charts for the last 2 days. I also ran a 2 week report on NinjaTrader and it showed me profitable. I had to use advance on the report and check my real account or else it will combine both demo and real trades.

My understanding is NinjaTrader does work with IB. I am surprised you don't use a more advanced front end that allows much more automation even without knowing programming. For example, you were complaining the software does not do what it is supposed to do.

Maybe you should try it. Also, ignore some of these posters, they don't understand what we do in that we analyze our strategies to improve our performance going forward if something does not work out.
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Hi Robert,

great journal, I read it frequently. Just my observation, it seems your gap up strategy is very consistent (maybe you could share a win % if you keep it in Excel or something?).

Could you go larger share size on these trades? I am no expert strategist but if you have a strategy that's very consistent, I think you should hammer down and go size on it while you work on the consistency of your other strats.

To me, the best part about gapup, 'breakout' plays is that it's easy to know when you're wrong; at the least, a stop on the other side of the opening bar. You don't risk having a runaway loser, i.e. averaging into a fade. Wish you well in your endeavors :)
 
Maybe it wasn't that I finished but rather I was willing to start/continue.

Writing a journal may be alright when your bringing in big gains but its still work. Writing a journal when your getting your head handed to you and your face smashed into the dirt over and over I would like to think does show some character, my true desire to improve and my willingness to be honest in the face of it to be able to reach the next level.

You are right though Mike. I have a gross and net loss for the year. I had huge gains last year and by the end of the year much of it was gone. We all know the odds are against me just like they are for most people. If I do happen to make it I would like to think that days like I have been going through will make it all the better and make me a better person.

I will also wake up tomorrow go to my office and try to use what I have learned to do a better job than I did today like I do everyday. Sometimes I do and sometimes I don't but I will try to finish the race regardless if I find out if I am in the Olympics or the special Olympics.....

Robert



Quote from limitupmike2:

lol.. i just find it funny how everyone congratulates RW .. godd job ol chap! good job.... when in reality the ship is taking on water and not moving anywhere.. i like to think that I am more like the wizard of ET since i have seen more traders trade and traded more myself than almost anyone on here.. no matter what crap they are slinging.

u guys treat robert like he is the retarded child who put food in his mouth once.. and you have a party.. or the kid who finishes a race in lat place and you say.. oh man great job finishing...
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Quote from Robert Weinstein:

Plus as I found out TWICE today IB stop losses do not always work. once in booktrader and once in integrated order entry which is more than frustrating but perhaps I am doing something wrong...
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I need to figure out IB stops, too. In the past couple weeks I had a trade stop out without price so much as moving near it in booktrader; then the next day I think it was, same stock, I had price go right past my stop and keep going. A lot of good that does for risk mgmt! I can understand when there's a wider spread the trigger process may be different, but the 2 trades with this conflicting STP handling had no spread whatsoever.

Nice day, by the way!

Oh and for limitupmike: Were you aware that Robert doubled his trading account in a few months last year before HAR, which was a fraudulent scam, took away nearly that entire gain in a few minutes, resulting in a $118K loss? I'd been shorting HAR the day before as well, so I saw it in premarket the next morning when it literally jumped over $12 a share in a couple minutes on a false rumor.
 
Robert,

You and I pretty much share a similar system. We try to fade monster rallies and catch falling knives. Sometimes, they work like a charm; other times, we get butchered.

Having said that, one thing I notice missing from your system is the general trend of the underlying index. If you're trading CSCO, for example, it's worth noting the current trend for the Nasdaq. I'm sure this isn't a eye-popping discovery but I thought it's worth noting since I tend to overlook this factor quite often.
 
Yes, I currently use Ninja to do this. They have a page in their support section on how to set it up. It is a little complicated but does not require programing. I would test it on demo 1st to make sure that it works exactly how you wanted.


"I would like to be able to "push a button" with ninja and have it enter in the order at a limit as well as enter in the stoploss upon execution of the original order. Plus as I found out TWICE today IB stop losses do not always work. once in booktrader and once in integrated order entry which is more than frustrating but perhaps I am doing something wrong..."


I use Ninja to automate my orders including entering the trade and managing the trade so that I can go down and take a walk or watch tv while I am in a trade. My only concern is certain issues that occur overnight since I trade futures and I need to use GTC orders since normal day orders cancel at end of each trading day, but this is only an issue if I plan to keep the trade overnight. Also, I have special indicators that are programmed into Ninja trader that I can not transfer to another front end. Please note I do watch my charts to see where I want the program to enter in the orders, but I can set it up to enter in when price gets to that point and it will manage the trade including multiple targets with different contracts each with their own target and stop loss strategy.

"Are you using Ninja to automate your trading and/or are you using ninja to execute your trades? If so do you have any comments or concerns with it? I am looking at automating some of my signals that can not be done fast enough manually. I want to connect Tradestation to ninja to IB and or maybe just ninja to IB but if I can do both I can save a lot of manual entry of data into ninja on some of my trades."


Quote from Robert Weinstein:

Thanks Oraclewizard,

Most of my trading is built on the idea of acting as the market maker but with fading extremes. This of course can have a much higher win rate but the losses tend to be much higher as well. Not unlike a mini-lotto where you collect small amounts and then pay out a relatively large amount.

I have found that one of my biggest challenges is to "switch" gears and trade one idea and stay with it as I sometimes want to put on my "fading" hat. I have found that when not fading its important for me to put in my stops RIGHT AWAY or I have a tendency to want to trade out of a loser which often "works" but appears to have a negative edge so the law of averages catches up. Fading with a positive expectancy though is about as great as it gets in my opinion.

Are you using Ninja to automate your trading and/or are you using ninja to execute your trades? If so do you have any comments or concerns with it? I am looking at automating some of my signals that can not be done fast enough manually. I want to connect Tradestation to ninja to IB and or maybe just ninja to IB but if I can do both I can save a lot of manual entry of data into ninja on some of my trades.

I would like to be able to "push a button" with ninja and have it enter in the order at a limit as well as enter in the stoploss upon execution of the original order. Plus as I found out TWICE today IB stop losses do not always work. once in booktrader and once in integrated order entry which is more than frustrating but perhaps I am doing something wrong...


Thanks again for your very welcomed posts and insights



Robert
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Thanks GG,

That link was interesting as well as the links and posts from it

I stand corrected. Mike does have a journal or at least started one.

Best

Robert



Quote from GG1972:

Limitupmike meet Traderzones...Traderzones meet Limitupmike LOL

You guys are the dirt of ET but then again ET wouldnt be ET without guys like you--at least RW is a trader--what are you ? Post some blotters or something then we will see. Easy to feed off leftover pizza from your mom's fridge and then sneak over to your abode in her basement and crawl these posts.

IS that how your trade ?

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2667468#post2667468
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Hi Oraclewizard,

Thanks. I just received an email from Ninja that the latest Beta has come out. I can't wait for NT7 to be released.

In the next few weeks I am going to move forward with NT and see if I can have it do what I want. Seems promising and the staff there seems to be really good.

I opened up a SIM acct with IB with the idea that I can test ideas and test the automation with it to get it right before using real money. Hopefully that will get me where I want to go.

Thanks again

Robert



Quote from oraclewizard77:

Yes, I currently use Ninja to do this. They have a page in their support section on how to set it up. It is a little complicated but does not require programing. I would test it on demo 1st to make sure that it works exactly how you wanted.


"I would like to be able to "push a button" with ninja and have it enter in the order at a limit as well as enter in the stoploss upon execution of the original order. Plus as I found out TWICE today IB stop losses do not always work. once in booktrader and once in integrated order entry which is more than frustrating but perhaps I am doing something wrong..."


I use Ninja to automate my orders including entering the trade and managing the trade so that I can go down and take a walk or watch tv while I am in a trade. My only concern is certain issues that occur overnight since I trade futures and I need to use GTC orders since normal day orders cancel at end of each trading day, but this is only an issue if I plan to keep the trade overnight. Also, I have special indicators that are programmed into Ninja trader that I can not transfer to another front end. Please note I do watch my charts to see where I want the program to enter in the orders, but I can set it up to enter in when price gets to that point and it will manage the trade including multiple targets with different contracts each with their own target and stop loss strategy.

"Are you using Ninja to automate your trading and/or are you using ninja to execute your trades? If so do you have any comments or concerns with it? I am looking at automating some of my signals that can not be done fast enough manually. I want to connect Tradestation to ninja to IB and or maybe just ninja to IB but if I can do both I can save a lot of manual entry of data into ninja on some of my trades."
More...
 
Quote from saliva:

Robert,

You and I pretty much share a similar system. We try to fade monster rallies and catch falling knives. Sometimes, they work like a charm; other times, we get butchered.

Having said that, one thing I notice missing from your system is the general trend of the underlying index. If you're trading CSCO, for example, it's worth noting the current trend for the Nasdaq. I'm sure this isn't a eye-popping discovery but I thought it's worth noting since I tend to overlook this factor quite often.
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One of the best advices so far, Robert. Please take note.

One of the key advantages of trading stocks instead of other instruments is that you can use market breath (index future, ticks, AD,etc) as relative strength filters.
 
Hi Saliva,

Thanks for your post. I guess Mike does/did have a journal of sorts. Someone else here provided the courtesy of posting a link.

I would guess Mike is a good guy and would not say the same things face to face. maybe that is good and maybe its better that we can type away. I am not sure.

I do know that I would not allow my sons to say some of the things I have read here but that I may have said worse when I was younger. Being married to my wonderful wife for the last 12+ years has taught me a lot along with losing my hair and not looking/feeling so young anymore.....LOL

Best to you

Robert


Quote from saliva:

Geez, this looks awfully similar to Neke's thread where parasites are bountiful.

Why don't we level the playing field a bit? Before indulging yourselves to the frenzy of I-know-what-you-don't know attacks, I ask you to eat your own words and post your trades in REALTIME for everyone to see and critique (or criticize, however you look at it). We'll see if you're qualified to judge or not.
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