Wall Street Art...
- Thread starter Sequoia
- Start date
Quote from Sequoia:
Ahah, I guess I am not as greedy as I could be and yeah there is most likely "socialist" roots in my work even if I don't consider myself socialist or politically engaged. I think my motivation is more about ego and a need of recognition more than about money actually
I can't stand socialism but if I had to share a desert island with one other person I'd probably choose a Socialist to share it with!
Hello
New cheesy art released ;-)
"The Grapes of Wrath" Wine Series.
Got inspired by the parrallel which can be made nowadays between the 1930s crisis and our current debt crisis. An obvious reference to John Steinbeck's novel being famous for depicting that dark period of the 20th century, I made 6 labels of countries (which are wine producers) with a big debt problem : Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy, France and USA. Each label has the S&P notation mentioned, along with the Debt / GDP ratio.
Cheers !
New cheesy art released ;-)
"The Grapes of Wrath" Wine Series.
Got inspired by the parrallel which can be made nowadays between the 1930s crisis and our current debt crisis. An obvious reference to John Steinbeck's novel being famous for depicting that dark period of the 20th century, I made 6 labels of countries (which are wine producers) with a big debt problem : Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy, France and USA. Each label has the S&P notation mentioned, along with the Debt / GDP ratio.
Cheers !
Hi Friend - so I went to look at this because I really actually think the idea is intriguing (and that I've been looking for something interesting for a blank wall).
Love the idea - but don't think the composition works: you have a dust bowl picture on the Californian, telling me this is "Grapes of Wrath", and you got the GDP/Rating (which i think is the most clever part of the piece); So the message can't be missed. Yet, it doesn't look right - because what is it doing on a wine label? All these things have nothing to do with wine (except the pun on the grapes of wrath)... so the concept sort of isn't working...
Anyway, I'm telling you this because I've enjoyed discussing your work with you in the past despite being critical of your style.
On the other hand, if you can some how translate the Board of Trade work to canvas, I'd be a buyer.
Love the idea - but don't think the composition works: you have a dust bowl picture on the Californian, telling me this is "Grapes of Wrath", and you got the GDP/Rating (which i think is the most clever part of the piece); So the message can't be missed. Yet, it doesn't look right - because what is it doing on a wine label? All these things have nothing to do with wine (except the pun on the grapes of wrath)... so the concept sort of isn't working...
Anyway, I'm telling you this because I've enjoyed discussing your work with you in the past despite being critical of your style.
On the other hand, if you can some how translate the Board of Trade work to canvas, I'd be a buyer.
Hello, thanks for your feedback again. As you mention, there is indeed no specific reason for choosing wine, which is of course not related to the crisis in any way.
That series came to my mind because the ideas of Wrath and Economic recession were mixed in the news. Steinbeck's novel naturally came to my mind for some reason. The wine was of course a consequence of the mention of "Grapes" in the title. The fact that most countries are wine producers made the link and also the fact that wine in people's mind is an agrarian production made with hard work (true, you could mention Ireland is an indebted country and is not famous for its wine, hence I ignored it
I think that in many people's mind (I may be wrong but this is my european's perception), the Dorothea Lange pics are more associated to the Great Depression than to the Dust of Bowl. Steinbeck's novel is during that Great Depression era anyway.
The dust of bowl was a climatic event, but the depression context certainly did not help. The people taken in pics by Dorothea Lange were people looking for jobs, food and shelter. Whether it is due to climatic or economic crisis is secondary to me (from my humble point of view, the result is the same : social difficulties and poverty).
By the way, Steinbeck's book is not related either to wine, as you probably know it. The title coming from a quote :
From Wikipedia :
Title
While writing the novel at his home, 16250 Greenwood Lane, in what is now Monte Sereno, California, Steinbeck had unusual difficulty devising a title. "The Grapes of Wrath", suggested by his wife, Carol Steinbeck, was deemed more suitable than anything the author could come up with. The title is a reference to lyrics from "The Battle Hymn of the Republic", by Julia Ward Howe:
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord:
He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;
He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword:
His truth is marching on.
These lyrics refer, in turn, to the biblical passage Revelation 14:19â20, an apocalyptic appeal to divine justice and deliverance from oppression in the final judgment.
And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.
The phrase also appears at the end of chapter 25 in The Grapes of Wrath which describes the purposeful destruction of food to keep the price high:
...and in the eyes of the hungry there is a growing wrath. In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage.
As might be expected, the image invoked by the title serves as a crucial symbol in the development of both the plot and the novel's greater thematic concerns: from the terrible winepress of Dust Bowl oppression will come terrible wrath but also the deliverance of workers through their cooperation, which is hinted at but does not materialize within the novel."
The idea of Justice and Deliverance seems to be what people are looking for (Indignados / OccupyWallStreet movements). My parallel between that quote and wine, is as much relevant as Steinbeck's, no ?
The other country labels are other references, unrelated to the USA (which seems to be the only one you noticed). I chose Diogene for the greek wine as he is one of the fathers of Cynism (with Antisthenes, depicted on the label in the lower right corner) and because he had the capability to be a strong critic of his contemporaries and especially politics.
For the Italian and French wines, I chose references to Sarkozy and Berlusconi (so yes, this is getting political here, as you mentioned in an earlier post ;-) as they led these countries directly into crisis through a dramatic increase of debt these 5 last years. The fact that they are extremely unpopular in Europe strengthens the "Wrath" feeling.
The Portuguese shows a rioter (yes, you will be right if you say there were no riots in Portugal, ok) but the label is directly inspired by the SANDEMAN Porto (which may not be familiar to US citizens but is very famous in Europe).
For the Spanish wine, I mention the plaza where the "indignados" movement started, and I chose the spanish figure of Don Quichote, a mad knight fighting evil and defending the oppressed...
So maybe not everything is relevant, but this series is strongly related to the current crisis with, whenever I could, a political or socio-economical graphic reference to each of the chosen countries. And why not wine ? At least, this is a piece of art which can be drank later, bringing memories and taste of troubled times....
Now, as usual, not trying to convince you of anything, just trying to explain the works and its genesis. Its relevance is subject to your personal advice and interpretation of course.
If you don't think it's relevant, then I missed my goal. Next time, next try then
PS : Regarding the Maslow Board of Trade, we could discuss this, but I'm not feeling like painting a screen table of figures... I could propose a large format photoprint of a screenshot, but I don't think you would be very interested...
That series came to my mind because the ideas of Wrath and Economic recession were mixed in the news. Steinbeck's novel naturally came to my mind for some reason. The wine was of course a consequence of the mention of "Grapes" in the title. The fact that most countries are wine producers made the link and also the fact that wine in people's mind is an agrarian production made with hard work (true, you could mention Ireland is an indebted country and is not famous for its wine, hence I ignored it
I think that in many people's mind (I may be wrong but this is my european's perception), the Dorothea Lange pics are more associated to the Great Depression than to the Dust of Bowl. Steinbeck's novel is during that Great Depression era anyway.
The dust of bowl was a climatic event, but the depression context certainly did not help. The people taken in pics by Dorothea Lange were people looking for jobs, food and shelter. Whether it is due to climatic or economic crisis is secondary to me (from my humble point of view, the result is the same : social difficulties and poverty).
By the way, Steinbeck's book is not related either to wine, as you probably know it. The title coming from a quote :
From Wikipedia :
Title
While writing the novel at his home, 16250 Greenwood Lane, in what is now Monte Sereno, California, Steinbeck had unusual difficulty devising a title. "The Grapes of Wrath", suggested by his wife, Carol Steinbeck, was deemed more suitable than anything the author could come up with. The title is a reference to lyrics from "The Battle Hymn of the Republic", by Julia Ward Howe:
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord:
He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;
He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword:
His truth is marching on.
These lyrics refer, in turn, to the biblical passage Revelation 14:19â20, an apocalyptic appeal to divine justice and deliverance from oppression in the final judgment.
And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.
The phrase also appears at the end of chapter 25 in The Grapes of Wrath which describes the purposeful destruction of food to keep the price high:
...and in the eyes of the hungry there is a growing wrath. In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage.
As might be expected, the image invoked by the title serves as a crucial symbol in the development of both the plot and the novel's greater thematic concerns: from the terrible winepress of Dust Bowl oppression will come terrible wrath but also the deliverance of workers through their cooperation, which is hinted at but does not materialize within the novel."
The idea of Justice and Deliverance seems to be what people are looking for (Indignados / OccupyWallStreet movements). My parallel between that quote and wine, is as much relevant as Steinbeck's, no ?
The other country labels are other references, unrelated to the USA (which seems to be the only one you noticed). I chose Diogene for the greek wine as he is one of the fathers of Cynism (with Antisthenes, depicted on the label in the lower right corner) and because he had the capability to be a strong critic of his contemporaries and especially politics.
For the Italian and French wines, I chose references to Sarkozy and Berlusconi (so yes, this is getting political here, as you mentioned in an earlier post ;-) as they led these countries directly into crisis through a dramatic increase of debt these 5 last years. The fact that they are extremely unpopular in Europe strengthens the "Wrath" feeling.
The Portuguese shows a rioter (yes, you will be right if you say there were no riots in Portugal, ok) but the label is directly inspired by the SANDEMAN Porto (which may not be familiar to US citizens but is very famous in Europe).
For the Spanish wine, I mention the plaza where the "indignados" movement started, and I chose the spanish figure of Don Quichote, a mad knight fighting evil and defending the oppressed...
So maybe not everything is relevant, but this series is strongly related to the current crisis with, whenever I could, a political or socio-economical graphic reference to each of the chosen countries. And why not wine ? At least, this is a piece of art which can be drank later, bringing memories and taste of troubled times....
Now, as usual, not trying to convince you of anything, just trying to explain the works and its genesis. Its relevance is subject to your personal advice and interpretation of course.
If you don't think it's relevant, then I missed my goal. Next time, next try then
PS : Regarding the Maslow Board of Trade, we could discuss this, but I'm not feeling like painting a screen table of figures...
I could propose a large format photoprint of a screenshot, but I don't think you would be very interested...Quote from Sequoia:
PS : Regarding the Maslow Board of Trade, we could discuss this, but I'm not feeling like painting a screen table of figures...
No... I don't think a painting would work either - or a photoprint of it. I can't think of how to translate that work to a static media either - but then, I'm not an artist.
I see where you are coming from (even though I absolutely hate Steinbeck, but that's another matter for another time - and I assure you I don't think that's the basis for my latest criticism). You put a large amount of thoughts in your symbology. That's good. But I think why it isn't working (in my opinion) is what we talked about last time: it's too unsubtle. All the interesting symbolism (again, I really like the GDP/Rating angle) are completely drown out by the loud, glaring, unavoidable political overtone.
When I look at this, I am reminded of an image of a moaist political self-criticism meeting - except I'm the subject at which slogans are hurled. Decidedly not fun.
Again, I believe where the Board of Trade succeeded and this failed is that the observer is active in the first, and wholly passive the latter.
Quote from Sequoia:
Hello, thanks for your feedback again. As you mention, there is indeed no specific reason for choosing wine, which is of course not related to the crisis in any way.
That series came to my mind because the ideas of Wrath and Economic recession were mixed in the news. Steinbeck's novel naturally came to my mind for some reason. The wine was of course a consequence of the mention of "Grapes" in the title. The fact that most countries are wine producers made the link and also the fact that wine in people's mind is an agrarian production made with hard work (true, you could mention Ireland is an indebted country and is not famous for its wine, hence I ignored it
I think that in many people's mind (I may be wrong but this is my european's perception), the Dorothea Lange pics are more associated to the Great Depression than to the Dust of Bowl. Steinbeck's novel is during that Great Depression era anyway.
The dust of bowl was a climatic event, but the depression context certainly did not help. The people taken in pics by Dorothea Lange were people looking for jobs, food and shelter. Whether it is due to climatic or economic crisis is secondary to me (from my humble point of view, the result is the same : social difficulties and poverty).
By the way, Steinbeck's book is not related either to wine, as you probably know it. The title coming from a quote :
From Wikipedia :
Title
While writing the novel at his home, 16250 Greenwood Lane, in what is now Monte Sereno, California, Steinbeck had unusual difficulty devising a title. "The Grapes of Wrath", suggested by his wife, Carol Steinbeck, was deemed more suitable than anything the author could come up with. The title is a reference to lyrics from "The Battle Hymn of the Republic", by Julia Ward Howe:
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord:
He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;
He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword:
His truth is marching on.
These lyrics refer, in turn, to the biblical passage Revelation 14:19â20, an apocalyptic appeal to divine justice and deliverance from oppression in the final judgment.
And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.
The phrase also appears at the end of chapter 25 in The Grapes of Wrath which describes the purposeful destruction of food to keep the price high:
...and in the eyes of the hungry there is a growing wrath. In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage.
As might be expected, the image invoked by the title serves as a crucial symbol in the development of both the plot and the novel's greater thematic concerns: from the terrible winepress of Dust Bowl oppression will come terrible wrath but also the deliverance of workers through their cooperation, which is hinted at but does not materialize within the novel."
The idea of Justice and Deliverance seems to be what people are looking for (Indignados / OccupyWallStreet movements). My parallel between that quote and wine, is as much relevant as Steinbeck's, no ?
The other country labels are other references, unrelated to the USA (which seems to be the only one you noticed). I chose Diogene for the greek wine as he is one of the fathers of Cynism (with Antisthenes, depicted on the label in the lower right corner) and because he had the capability to be a strong critic of his contemporaries and especially politics.
For the Italian and French wines, I chose references to Sarkozy and Berlusconi (so yes, this is getting political here, as you mentioned in an earlier post ;-) as they led these countries directly into crisis through a dramatic increase of debt these 5 last years. The fact that they are extremely unpopular in Europe strengthens the "Wrath" feeling.
The Portuguese shows a rioter (yes, you will be right if you say there were no riots in Portugal, ok) but the label is directly inspired by the SANDEMAN Porto (which may not be familiar to US citizens but is very famous in Europe).
For the Spanish wine, I mention the plaza where the "indignados" movement started, and I chose the spanish figure of Don Quichote, a mad knight fighting evil and defending the oppressed...
So maybe not everything is relevant, but this series is strongly related to the current crisis with, whenever I could, a political or socio-economical graphic reference to each of the chosen countries. And why not wine ? At least, this is a piece of art which can be drank later, bringing memories and taste of troubled times....
Now, as usual, not trying to convince you of anything, just trying to explain the works and its genesis. Its relevance is subject to your personal advice and interpretation of course.
If you don't think it's relevant, then I missed my goal. Next time, next try then
PS : Regarding the Maslow Board of Trade, we could discuss this, but I'm not feeling like painting a screen table of figures...
Well, it is difficult to avoid a political tone when your subject is related to the sovereign debt crisis I think. Finance and Politics are quite interwoven.
Now I can hear, and I hope, understand what you mean. Anyway, always a pleasure to discuss my stuff with you (if you are on facebook, friend me over there, maybe easier to discuss pieces rather than here where interest for my stuff is very limited after all.)
Off to bed here, good afternoon in the US !
Now I can hear, and I hope, understand what you mean. Anyway, always a pleasure to discuss my stuff with you (if you are on facebook, friend me over there, maybe easier to discuss pieces rather than here where interest for my stuff is very limited after all.)
Off to bed here, good afternoon in the US !
Hello
Keeping you informed about latest piece of Art related to Finance...
Tradart's Anatomy
Light box - Aluminum & glass framed box - 40 x 40 x 4cm limited edition of 7 + 2 AP.
This is a collaborative work I made with fellow french artist Jerome BTESH with whom I curated last year's group exhibit in Paris "Greedy Bastarts!".
Have a nice trading week.
http://www.cedricmnich.com
Keeping you informed about latest piece of Art related to Finance...
Tradart's Anatomy
Light box - Aluminum & glass framed box - 40 x 40 x 4cm limited edition of 7 + 2 AP.
This is a collaborative work I made with fellow french artist Jerome BTESH with whom I curated last year's group exhibit in Paris "Greedy Bastarts!".
Have a nice trading week.
http://www.cedricmnich.com