Victor Niederhoffer in Vogue Magazine??
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Quote from Pekelo:
Surf, really, at your age you should be able to construct a valid argument...And hating? I am probably the most objective and unbiased poster in this thread...
...you have no idea of how good a trader he was before '82. Again, why don't you ask him?
Well, since I agree with you about using first hand sources, let's see what Soros said about Vic. From Soros on Soros:
great find - interesting quote....
summary -
soros - trends exist - thats why I make billions trading. I form a thesis and when the market confirms boom.
When its choppy I don't trade well, so I place money with people who say trends do not exist.
Then when the trends kick in I take my money back because I do not want my money blown by a guy who says trends do not exist.
before or after they had to give the money back when the trades were busted?
Quote from Landis82:
As a Cal alum, I take serious offense to your
inability to spell BERKELEY correctly.
http://www.calbears.com/
Go BEARS!!!
my sincerest apologies.
have a great weekend!
surf
ps. first weekend of free beach parking in south hampton, gonna be fun!
Last evening I started to reread Vic's The Education...It is actually more interesting, than I remembered. It adds an interesting tidbit to that gold trade:
Page 52:
Now here Vic is actually wrong. At the end of 79 silver already was way above $10, so if he shorted it at 5.50 he must have done it at the end of 1978.
Why is it interesting/important? Because it looks like that the gold trade wasn't a ballsy directional bet, but a hedge for his short silver position, and it looks like the silver short was put on first, end exited with a huge loss.
Here is the gold chart of the same period, he started pyramiding up from $290 which was around '79 July-August. By that time silver was already above $8...
Bottomline: His runup in long gold from 40K to 22 million also included a silver short hedge (not clear which came first) with a loss. Also the 22 million was as showed earlier unrealized gains and he got out of that position eventually with a 50% loss probably in mid January of '80, thanks to his future Wife, Susan.
See Surf? Journalism isn't that hard. You just report FACTS, unbiased.
Of course, friends of Vic could ask him to clear things up, and they are encouraged to do so...
Page 52:
Now here Vic is actually wrong. At the end of 79 silver already was way above $10, so if he shorted it at 5.50 he must have done it at the end of 1978.
Why is it interesting/important? Because it looks like that the gold trade wasn't a ballsy directional bet, but a hedge for his short silver position, and it looks like the silver short was put on first, end exited with a huge loss.
Here is the gold chart of the same period, he started pyramiding up from $290 which was around '79 July-August. By that time silver was already above $8...
Bottomline: His runup in long gold from 40K to 22 million also included a silver short hedge (not clear which came first) with a loss. Also the 22 million was as showed earlier unrealized gains and he got out of that position eventually with a 50% loss probably in mid January of '80, thanks to his future Wife, Susan.
See Surf? Journalism isn't that hard. You just report FACTS, unbiased.
Of course, friends of Vic could ask him to clear things up, and they are encouraged to do so...
Good work Pekelo....
No discussion of VN should be complete without looking at his 'double standard' of behavior he selectely applies to himself and others. In a comment by Cutten
I wonder if VN appreciates the attention he receives from Marketsurfer every time surf has a string of big losses to redirect the site's attention from his own trading...
No discussion of VN should be complete without looking at his 'double standard' of behavior he selectely applies to himself and others. In a comment by Cutten
Also of note is the completely misleading statements posted on this site by Marketsurfer, and by VN via Baron, after his last blowup until the facts reached the daylight.... Approach anything you read by these two with a great deal of skepticism.
I wonder if VN appreciates the attention he receives from Marketsurfer every time surf has a string of big losses to redirect the site's attention from his own trading...
Speaking of double standard, I didn't like this part of the book, talking about my hero, Livermore.
p.19:
What Vic forgot to mention about Jesse:
1. He always paid his creditors back, once he came back from a blow out.
2. He not just survived but hugely profited from all big crashes.
3. His family still had 5 million in trusts by the time of his death.
4. He most likely had deep depression (could have been manic-depression) and was married to a freak woman whose previous 4 (!!) husbands all comitted suicede.
5. Once he became a trader he lived his life in luxury until his death for 4+ decades.
So unlike Vic's grandfather Martin (they were friends and trading partners), Livermore did survive for decades under all kind of marketconditions and never had to live in poverty....
Martin ran up a wealth of 1 million dollar until '29, when it was all whiped out and the family had to live in hand-to-mouth existence...(p.47)
p.19:
What Vic forgot to mention about Jesse:
1. He always paid his creditors back, once he came back from a blow out.
2. He not just survived but hugely profited from all big crashes.
3. His family still had 5 million in trusts by the time of his death.
4. He most likely had deep depression (could have been manic-depression) and was married to a freak woman whose previous 4 (!!) husbands all comitted suicede.
5. Once he became a trader he lived his life in luxury until his death for 4+ decades.
So unlike Vic's grandfather Martin (they were friends and trading partners), Livermore did survive for decades under all kind of marketconditions and never had to live in poverty....
Martin ran up a wealth of 1 million dollar until '29, when it was all whiped out and the family had to live in hand-to-mouth existence...(p.47)
Quote from Pekelo:
Speaking of double standard, I didn't like this part of the book, talking about my hero, Livermore.
p.19:
What Vic forgot to mention about Jesse:
1. He always paid his creditors back, once he came back from a blow out.
2. He not just survived but hugely profited from all big crashes.
3. His family still had 5 million in trusts by the time of his death.
4. He most likely had deep depression (could have been manic-depression) and was married to a freak woman whose previous 4 (!!) husbands all comitted suicede.
5. Once he became a trader he lived his life in luxury until his death for 4+ decades.
So unlike Vic's grandfather Martin (they were friends and trading partners), Livermore did survive for decades under all kind of marketconditions and never had to live in poverty....
Martin ran up a wealth of 1 million dollar until '29, when it was all whiped out and the family had to live in hand-to-mouth existence...(p.47)
I read VN's 'Education' but I disliked it so much I threw it out. I don't remember reading the particular passage you posted here, but my o my, what irony. Especially in this thread where criticism of VN is dismissed as petty jealousy.
Livermore lived by his wits his entire adult life and did very well for himself and his family. He repaid his creditors when he got back on his feet, even though he was not legally obligated to do so. Has VN repaid any of the investors that lost money with him?
No wonder that the 2 threads in which Larry Williams was exposed were closed....
Instead of posting his(L.W.) statements for all to see, to prove his was not 1 lot piker , moderator Vikana had to take a look and report back. Talk about transparency ...LOL
Marketsurfer likes guys like VN and LW that have blow up several times
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