Van Tharp and Mark Douglas
- Thread starter WDGann
- Start date
One thing I'd like to add is that the two come to the same conclusion. But the two have different approaches.
Van concentrates on knowing yourself first, then working through it one step at a time to change yourself.
Rather than saying vague, I think Mark's book is straight to the point more. It's a matter of, if you are it or you are not. Eventually, both have the same ideal model of what a trader is. Mark mentions profitability and Van does too but he uses expectancy. In that sense, Van is a step ahead with this, he took the concept of edge and made it clear and easy for all or at least most traders. Though, as a partial-statician, it's too elementary but it's still a start.
The sense that Mark mentions about trading profitable pattern is in a sense vague. But an edge for a discretionary trader is slightly different from mechanically driven edge.
Anyways, my point is that the eventual goal of both is the same but the approach is different. Van concentrate from you, Mark concentrate on it.
Van concentrates on knowing yourself first, then working through it one step at a time to change yourself.
Rather than saying vague, I think Mark's book is straight to the point more. It's a matter of, if you are it or you are not. Eventually, both have the same ideal model of what a trader is. Mark mentions profitability and Van does too but he uses expectancy. In that sense, Van is a step ahead with this, he took the concept of edge and made it clear and easy for all or at least most traders. Though, as a partial-statician, it's too elementary but it's still a start.
The sense that Mark mentions about trading profitable pattern is in a sense vague. But an edge for a discretionary trader is slightly different from mechanically driven edge.
Anyways, my point is that the eventual goal of both is the same but the approach is different. Van concentrate from you, Mark concentrate on it.
Quote from nitro:
ROFL,
Yeeeeeep
You know what else? No one can TEACH you to get up on a tight rope 50 feet off the ground, they can only teach you to get on the one six inches off the ground. But then they did not account for wind...Ooooooooooooops!
nitro
Yeah. - The long process of getting there... - just make sure that safety net is properly secured
(What about that guy who walked across Niagara - yikes!!!! )
Best
Natalie:eek:
Nitro, I agree... you gotta trade and so size to really get some feedback on what you're dealing with.
How much a paper trader or a small lot trader thinks, imagines, and reads... they will not understand and utilize what is real... and what trading is.
People tend to seek to be TAUGHT... maybe from how society works with school and parents... that's BS... No one can teach you jack shit since you were born. People help you understand and realize something, not teach... If the student doesn't have an ear to listen, they will not hear it.
As for me, trading and reading these books are just part of my humbling process and also a helper for a new strategy to implement. I personally think that's what books are for. It doesn't change you or make you but it helps you realize, reassure, inspire what you had in you that you couldn't consciously and logically understand.
Yes, it's the trader, books and ideas are just helping hands and not the answer, answer comes from within.
....
....
But Van and Mark's books have helped me, so I don't deny and still claim that books or other traders... whatever... is not worthless.
How much a paper trader or a small lot trader thinks, imagines, and reads... they will not understand and utilize what is real... and what trading is.
People tend to seek to be TAUGHT... maybe from how society works with school and parents... that's BS... No one can teach you jack shit since you were born. People help you understand and realize something, not teach... If the student doesn't have an ear to listen, they will not hear it.
As for me, trading and reading these books are just part of my humbling process and also a helper for a new strategy to implement. I personally think that's what books are for. It doesn't change you or make you but it helps you realize, reassure, inspire what you had in you that you couldn't consciously and logically understand.
Yes, it's the trader, books and ideas are just helping hands and not the answer, answer comes from within.
....
....
But Van and Mark's books have helped me, so I don't deny and still claim that books or other traders... whatever... is not worthless.
for perspective, I have an advanced degree from MIT and have been trading for over 30 years, yet when I look at my trading library I only have 10 books in it, all the rest were given away to fellow traders who wanted that 'hot' book to read. One of the books still on my shelf is Mindtraps, which on rereading seems naive in this age of data streams and pc's. However, that book was written when none of that existed and was for the position or swing trading mentality. Also, there were few Psychology books out then; as such I was fascinated with it. Although I love science and its rigorous nature, all the books on my shelf are devoid of formulae, and so is my trading. I have found that my best trades are ones I put on and let run with me out and about experiencing life and letting the intraday noise do its thing. I came to realize that there wasn't a profit I couldn't take while at the monitor (to my detriment). Hence, I have come full circle and trade only off the daily charts, looking for those minor swings of 3-5 days. Perspective and low anxiety are wonderful things. I treat trading as an art with colors and flexibility, as opposed to a science, and mechanical and 'black and white'. And I feel that is the difference between Tharp and Douglas, Tharp wants one to be rigorous in their approach, treating trading like a science whereas Douglas says its ok to be intuitive and in tune with oneself as you approach trading. Two approaches, similar result if disciplined. I guess if you look at your trading library you will know quickly enough how you approach trading.
He also points out, however, that one should not jump into subjective trading or intuitive trading until he has laid the foundation of discipline, objectivity, and self-control through a nearly mechanical approach. For a trader who hasn't mastered the basics to believe that he can "feel" his way through the market is most likely an invitation to losses.