US occupation plans for Iraq?

How can you be so sure...

Many westeners convert themselves to Islam becaue they think this religion is much more rational than christianity...

Of course it is an endless debate.. But I just gave my points..

We were talking about Islam not terrorism. Now, there are christian and jews extremist.. Look at the Jew colon in palestine, they hate all what is not jew and consider that the life of one jew is worth more than that of a million christian or muslim.. They cultivate hate at its extreme and worse they are in the governement of Sharon....

What I want to say is that there is no black and white and everybody should act according to its own beliefs. the main point is to respect one another..

You were christian once and then you were not that convinced and then turned to atheism. This is your choice and I repect it.

I was atheist and after lot of rea
 
Originally posted by traderfut2000
don't forget that in the US slavery was abolished in the sixties and 2 great black leaders were killed for that malcolm X and Martin Luther King... This is not long time ago...
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The 60's? How about mentioning which CENTURY's "60's"? And Malcome X and King were killed because of this? My friend, stick with subjects you are knowledgeable about.

Shalom,
rs7
 
How can you be so sure...

Many westeners convert themselves to Islam becaue they think this religion is much more rational than christianity...

Of course it is an endless debate.. But I just gave my points..

We were talking about Islam not terrorism. Now, there are christian and jews extremist.. Look at the Jew colon in palestine, they hate all what is not jew and consider that the life of one jew is worth more than that of a million christian or muslim.. They cultivate hate at its extreme and worse they are in the governement of Sharon....

What I want to say is that there is no black and white and everybody should act according to its own beliefs. the main point is to respect one another..

You were christian once and then you were not that convinced and then turned to atheism. This is your choice and I repect it.

I was atheist and after lot of reading I turned back to Islam. This is my choice and it should also be respected. But you cannot say bomb a whole population because they are muslim...

You forgot that there are also christian in Iraq... So what you said is pointless...

People like Bush try to convince people with that kind of arguments... But this is simply stupid

Peace
 

At the time of Islam, Christianity was the first monotheist religion but Islam came with something new and incredible.

incredible? well, if you use my dictionary's definition: So implausible as to elicit disbelief then yeah, i too am stumped as to how the ludicrous claims of the lunatic muhammed came to be accepted..

Abolition of slavery,
Women before Islam even in christianity were considered as inferior specie and many arab or westeners killed their daughters because it was a curse for them... With Islam this was forbidden and woman had the right to inherit to educate herself even to fight.... and this was in the 7th century...

you make it VERY difficult (not to mention frustrating) for people to take you seriously when you post such COMPLETE LIES...

i know of NO other religion that makes such an effort as islam to point out (and enforce) the inferiority of women. none even comes close.

Now of course you will take examples from afghanistan and say look how a woman in Islam looks like.0 But as I said it has nothing to do with Islam but more with stupidity of men...

they are just following the dictates of islam to the letter, "stupid" yes, but i guess they don't know any better, and just want to be the best muslims they can be... well, they're are doing damn fine job of it.


I sincerely hope that the situation of women improves in arab countries but for me may be it is not because of Islam but more because those guys are real stupid...

it is PRECISELY because of islam. get rid of islam and watch the lot of women there is IMMEDIATELY improved (beyond recognition)..

i don't know why you keep comparing islam to christianity. i can't think of ONE western nation that lets the church make decisions for its government intsitutions. it's not a question of which religions is "right' (they're both so far wrong it's off the radar), it's the fact that Islam is inherently connected to the governance of arab nations. and i am saying that is one big fat PROBLEM.
 
Originally posted by traderfut2000
Nothing is perfect in the muslim world today and I would even say that it is today the darkest period of its history...

I sincerely hope that the situation of women improves in arab countries but for me may be it is not because of Islam but more because those guys are real stupid...
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Then are we to accept their stupidity if it spills over into other regions of the world? When do they look within and say this practice is not right. Times have changed, shouldn't we say this to them? You continue to evidence where they are supposedly more correct in their stances, yet you show no examples of where they are saying that this practice MUST stop.

As a person of color, nothing pisses me off more than to be told that this change for the better must take time, maybe tens of years, as the status quo has rights too. Oh, and understand that it might not be able to change in your lifetime. Maybe not even in your children's lifetime. No matter how wrong, we need time to adjust is not an acceptable battle cry! :)
 
I agree with you we need to keep on working and working… But let’s be honest…

Saudis and Kuwaitis are hated in all the Arab world they are a shame for all of us since they behave like puppet and behave badly with their own people. Meaning women and men… Now if you go to other Arab countries I can assure you that you will be amazed by the freedom women enjoy.. Of course for that you need to go in the country and stop watching CNN…

You know where those bastards invest their money. Switzerland the USA and the UK instead of investing them in education of the other poorest Arab countries…

Who is backing Saudia, Kuwait… The USA and many western countries. But everybody in the Arab world have a disgust for those people and the way they manage their country and money….

When Iraq invaded Kuwait many people from poor Arab countries were happy!!! Why??? Because Kuwait was just a puppet regime and its money is spent in las vegas casinos instead of serving the education and development of other Arab countries… .. but for the Usa, their interests were at stake.. If Iraq invaded Kuwait, then it could even invade Saudi and then for many western countries all the rules and negotiation regarding oil resources could be ruined… this is why the biggest coalition ever in history of mankind was achieved to defeat Saddam…

I think that in Arab/Muslim countries you have huge brains… and a huge potential and if Saudi and Kuwaiti money was better invested the situation would improve greatly…

And of course democracy is a must..
 
What do you mean???

Till the late "1960's" you had a discrimination of black people in the south and Malcolm X and Luther were killed by the CIA because they were asking for civil rights for black people in the US...

IS that right????

Salam

TF2000
 
i dont think so, notice how much the war rhetoric has toned down now that bush has war powers in his pocket. i think the saddam knew the UN wouldnt be as supportive this time, or at the very least he played politics with the UN and dodged and snuck around, so bottom line, he knows he can beat the UN at the game.
So, for bush to have any credibility on dealing w/ iraq he needed to have a congressional approval that we will go unilaterally if need be, thereby circumventing saddam's ability to stalemate us or win if it went throught the UN.
put another way, speak soflty and carry a big stick, now we have our stick.
 
Originally posted by traderfut2000
Stop being One sided...

Haiti (hahahahaha) what about pakistan 3 years ago. Musharaf made a coup. Today he is encouraged by the USA..

What about zaire. they killed Lumumba and put Moboutou...

What about ...
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Are you ok? I mean what is wrong with you? You asked for an example and I provided you with one.

Yet instead of being man enough to admit it, you laugh and point to other scenarios. How can you dismiss Haiti? The US alone stood up against a military coup that deposed the democratically elected president and reinstated him.

That is a fact.

You can not erase it by pointing wildly at other countries (Pakistan -- which by the way are holding elections as we speak--, Zaire, etc.) and attempting your usual distraction strategies. Even though you may be correct in your allegations to conspiracy theories involving the US, it still does nothing to devalue or erase what the US did in Haiti in 1991. How is stating a fact being one sided?

You already mentioned those countries and then asked for an example of the US helping a country (democratic) after the WW II. Wouldn't waving away a fact be considered one sided?

I find it tiresome to engage in a dialogue with you because you do not enter it in good faith. Your only state of mind is that everyone who agrees with you is right and those that don't are wrong. Any evidence they present that goes contrary to your position is conveniently waved away by you and called propaganda.

Or you do not address it at all and instead bring up another totally different and unrelated issue in the hopes of distracting the person from the facts under discussion (this is what you did on the side discussion of the role of women in Islam -- you brought up women in Christianity). And you are doing it again with my example by pointing to Zaire, Venezuela, etc.

You think this is the manner in which an intelligent person carries on a conversation? (rhetorical question)
 
Originally posted by traderfut2000
.. If Iraq invaded Kuwait, then it could even invade Saudi and then for many western countries all the rules and negotiation regarding oil resources could be ruined… this is why the biggest coalition ever in history of mankind was achieved to defeat Saddam…

I think that in Arab/Muslim countries you have huge brains… and a huge potential and if Saudi and Kuwaiti money was better invested the situation would improve greatly…

And of course democracy is a must.. [/B]
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i agree with you that the middle east and their people need to be invested in and lifted from poverty. i have always said that the biggest prblem has been the leadership of the middle east.
i assume you must be capitalist so wouldnt you agree the arab worls would benefit from capitalist reforms as a means to lift arab people out of poverty, and relesa the potential you know is there.

as aside to that, what is wrong with one of the objectives of gulf war 1 (not saying it was only reason, but one of them) being to ensure the free flow of oil at market prices by its rightful owners kuwait. in many ways we were, and still are, defending capitalism in the middle east which you know will help th earab world. i think the middle east shuns capitalism and may view it as imperialism, exploitation.
 
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