We've gone over this ad-nauseum, you and I specifically I think. The energy density in today's EVs is more than enough for 99% of the driving that 99% of drivers do. Seriously, how many times have you driven more than 400 miles in the last year? How many times have you done that simultaneously with all of your cars? How many times has anyone done it in a golf cart (please, comparing a 400 mile range to a golf cart doesn't do your argument any favors). The vast majority of American families have more than one car and could substitute one with an EV with zero negative impact due to energy density.
$TSLA
- Thread starter Phill Twist
- Start date
Yet you can't refute any of my arguments. I am not talking about 40K cars being able to go 300 miles. They can't even sell 3K/week of those.
I am talking about a small, maybe 150 miles or even less range car for 15-20K. That would be the big seller for students and house wives. But who can make that for 13-16K in North America? Nobody.
Let me know when Tesla doesn't lose 10K per car, until that my point stands.
Like the Chevy Spark EV that you can get for $20K?
Regardless, you don't get to set the goalposts such that "electric cars are only viable if they can be sold for under $20K". By that mindset the majority of ICE cars sold in the U.S. are failures! Somehow BMW and Mercedes and Volvo and Audi and Porsche manage to be profitable in NA selling cars exclusively over $20K and most of the other car manufacturers profits come from cars over $20K. Where in the world does that magic number come from, and why should it be the measure of viability?
1. Yes. Are Americans buying it in droves? No. Is Chevy making money on it? Also no. So I guess it actually doesn't fit, and the original answer has to be no too.
2. I don't really care about the price, but the car has to be made PROFITABLY. And there is more demand at lower prices. A truly mass market and everybody wants to buy it car can not be 40K. Maybe for the American market, but not for the world.
About goalposts, only Elon can move them?
Again your shifting your argument. First it didn't exist, now it does but no-one is buying it (what's your source on profitability, btw?).1. Yes. Are Americans buying it in droves? No. Is Chevy making money on it? Also no. So I guess it actually doesn't fit, and the original answer has to be no too.
2. I don't really care about the price, but the car has to be made PROFITABLY. And there is more demand at lower prices. A truly mass market and everybody wants to buy it car can not be 40K. Maybe for the American market, but not for the world.
About goalposts, only Elon can move them?
My response was to a false assertion that "Electric cars CANNOT WORK YET." Nothing you've said proves that false assertion, everything I've said disputes it. And yes, all those car manufacturers I listed who sell all or most of their cars for over $40K are very profitable, you don't get to make up some arbitrary number and claim that unless electric cars are sold for less than that number "Electric cars CANNOT WORK YET." You can certainly claim that they are not yet sold to housewives and students, but since that has nothing to do with what I said it's really apropos of nothing.
I have changed my mind...
This is actually a correct statement, if we put one more word at the end, FINANCIALLY.
There are 2 versions currently:
1. They make a glorified golf cart (short range, small EV, but fairly cheap). 2 problems: People don't want to buy them and/or maker loses money on them. Its effect on market and mass transportation are negligible.
2. They make a luxury long range EV. To sell it at a profit the price is so high (model S) that only rich people can afford it so its effect on the market and mass transportation is irrelevant.
So there you have it, at the current energy density of the electric battery you can not profitably make a mass market vehicle with a huge effect on mass transit (Tesla's ultimate goal).
This is actually a correct statement, if we put one more word at the end, FINANCIALLY.
There are 2 versions currently:
1. They make a glorified golf cart (short range, small EV, but fairly cheap). 2 problems: People don't want to buy them and/or maker loses money on them. Its effect on market and mass transportation are negligible.
2. They make a luxury long range EV. To sell it at a profit the price is so high (model S) that only rich people can afford it so its effect on the market and mass transportation is irrelevant.
So there you have it, at the current energy density of the electric battery you can not profitably make a mass market vehicle with a huge effect on mass transit (Tesla's ultimate goal).
Day low $177.77. Take out the 1, and we get a more acceptable price (albeit still overvalued). So for the record, here is my 7.7-month target inspired by the day low (it will probably dip to $175 later):
$77.77
Elon Musk is shorts' best friend. Keep him as CEO for as long as possible. I'm disappointed that the NTSB hasn't opened an investigation into the risks Tesla's battery packs pose on the public.
$77.77
Elon Musk is shorts' best friend. Keep him as CEO for as long as possible. I'm disappointed that the NTSB hasn't opened an investigation into the risks Tesla's battery packs pose on the public.
https://gizmodo.com/tesla-is-blocking-its-employees-from-accessing-an-anony-1835238737
Verdict reports that Tesla employees were having trouble getting their verification emails to join the service. While Blind does have a public forum, it also allows workers to join an anonymous Blind community specifically for their company. In order to do so, a worker has to be verified by Blind using their work email address. But according to the report, Tesla was seemingly blocking these verification emails to its employees, meaning they wouldn’t be able to successfully join the Tesla community on Blind. What’s more, employees also reported to Verdict that Tesla was blocking Blind on the company WiFi network.
“Tesla is the only company that is blocking its own employees from accessing or signing up on Blind,” a Blind spokesperson told Gizmodo in an email. “We found out about this issue through emails from our users, saying they were unable to receive verification emails from us and from posts on the public channel, where already verified Tesla employees raised the issue. Then we looked into the verification rates and we could confirm that Tesla is preventing employees from accessing Blind.”
Verdict reports that Tesla employees were having trouble getting their verification emails to join the service. While Blind does have a public forum, it also allows workers to join an anonymous Blind community specifically for their company. In order to do so, a worker has to be verified by Blind using their work email address. But according to the report, Tesla was seemingly blocking these verification emails to its employees, meaning they wouldn’t be able to successfully join the Tesla community on Blind. What’s more, employees also reported to Verdict that Tesla was blocking Blind on the company WiFi network.
“Tesla is the only company that is blocking its own employees from accessing or signing up on Blind,” a Blind spokesperson told Gizmodo in an email. “We found out about this issue through emails from our users, saying they were unable to receive verification emails from us and from posts on the public channel, where already verified Tesla employees raised the issue. Then we looked into the verification rates and we could confirm that Tesla is preventing employees from accessing Blind.”