Trump Ordered Mueller Fired, but Backed Off When White House Counsel Threatened to Quit

jem said:
Let me tell you one of the my anti rhetorical devices I learned when I was younger.

When your opposing arguer is smart person and argues nothing but amorphous things about potentials and what could be. You know they have no facts or no law on their side. Smart people don't leave out the facts. Smart people apply the elements of the law or the situation to the facts... if they have them. Its a basic understanding of persuasion. Here are the facts here are the rules you can see for yourself... the conclusion is obvious to everyone... etc.

the fact you just wrote a few amorphous paragraphs is just about proof there is nothing on Trump out there.

In the past I told you your speculation about the fact he probably broke the law in his real estate dealings could be correct. But, nothing has come up. A bunch of weak hints about "money laundering" but that is not going to stick on a real estate seller unless the seller was in on it. Plus, if he did break the law his acts may be barred from prosecution by the the statute of limitations.

So I learned when your opponent argues nothing elegantly...
You look over at the table you compliment them on their intelligence and organization and their argument and you explain why if they had anything they would have brought it up. When the other side argues nothing and you point out why... You win every time.



In the words of the old lady in the old wendy's commercials.

Where is the beef?



More...
The Beef is on the way. We can expect delivery by late Summer 2018. Because the delivery truck is still on the highway, Your Honor, we are requesting a continuation until September 1.
 
motion granted.
(mueller might have some filet on the way and not leaked it. )

piezoe said:
The Beef is on the way. We can expect delivery by late Summer 2018. Because the delivery truck is still on the highway, Your Honor, we are requesting a continuation until September 1.
More...
 
piezoe said:
Nice spin, but it's mostly an illusion. Trump is an embarrassment abroad. The market, which could care less whether Merkel or Theresa May think Donald is a jerk, is a continuation of the recovery started in June, 2009. The impetus is multivariate. The most important factor, as always in bull markets, is a rising market itself. This brings in more sidelines money for fear of missing out and causes acceleration of the trend. Premature , inexperienced shorts with weak hands add to the impetus as they cover, and finally, but critically important, dollar weakness is adding to the momentum. (Never view the market in isolation from the dollar futures! If the dollar futures and equities market begin to move in lock-step opposition that tells you that the dollar has become a dominant factor. Under that circumstance, a change in the dollar futures trend on a longer time scale becomes a harbinger of a correction to follow.) Later on, accelerated deficit spending, which Republican leadership was so anxious to get going before November, will continue the good times. There is also, riding on top of these other factors, the wealth effect which tends to goose consumption demand and earnings, and then dissipate as the market corrects, which it eventually will. I have described for you the usual market cycle and the sub-cycles contained within, and what to keep an eye on. (There will be no charge for this free lesson.)

The recent tax cut rushed through Congress, was an extraordinary event, having been pushed through in a panic to get it implemented, days later, and leaving tax accountants flummoxed. But it was in time, nevertheless, to influence the critical November election. This tax bill will produce greatly accelerated deficits, as the cuts will be out of balance with spending reductions. Since the deficits are coming at a time of near full employment, rather than in recession, we should see a rather dramatic boost in the economy accompanied by an up-tic in inflation -- both these phenomena will boost the equities market. Trump, though he has not a clue what he's doing, can take credit for helping to achieve a sense of plenty in a dire emergency -- at least from the Republican leadership point of view. He can also take credit for causing a lot of folks to jump into the equities market for fear of missing out. They'll also jump back out near the bottom when the correction comes.

Logically, market measures should be discounted for inflation, productivity and population growth, but the public, including seasoned stock investors and the media, think in nominal terms, and that's what dictates emotion. There is still more money on the sidelines. Check back after July 4th, or either when Mueller issues his report or when Melania pulls a gun on the Donald, which ever comes first .
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How about some measures of performance that account increases in our national debt as a measure of executive economic competence?

GDP % growth less national debt growth % equals effective (underlying or organic) economic growth.

And national debt as a % of GNP, where increases in this measure imply ineffective executive economic performance. Exceptions might be made in case of extreme disasters or wars.

I have the sense that businesses are feeling more confortable in investing in new ventures and expanding their business due to a perceived friendly administration. This administration is headed by an experienced and sucessful businessman who knows that challenges that many new regulations have created. Trump’s promises to reduce regulations and taxes reduce the risk and cost of doing business.

It is natural for businesses with extra cash and or borrowing capacity to want to expand in this business-friendly environment. This can create a positive feedback loop that creates a rising stock market, increased capital formation, business expansion, and more profits.

As you mentioned earlier, this is part of the business cycle and will inevitably lead to inflation, Fed tightening, yield curve inversion, recession, and an collapsing stock market.

The question is, where will the United States be financially, as measured by the previously mentioned performance indicators when this happens?

If national debt as a % of GDP is lower than a comparable period in the economic cycle, an atta boy may be in order. If not, we may find ourselfs with limited stimulative capacity through borrowing at a time of unfavorable demographics.

We only need to look at Japan as a possible “canary in the coal mine.”. Their peak real estate and Nikkei peak was in 1999 to 2001?

I am for giving Trump a chance to see if we can get ahead of this looming debt monster chasing down our newer generations.
 
so once we remove all your caveats, you believe the market could go up or down from here but it will correct in the future. Thanks, maybe I should buy some 2020 puts.

The fact that the market was perhaps pricing in Trump tax cuts never really entered your your mind. Do you think massive corporate tax cuts might influence profits, dividends and therefore forward looking P/E ratios?

Did it occur to you that one of the reasons the companies wanted to dish out a lot of profits in bonuses to employees was to manage their projected earnings growth?

Its been years since the markets seemed to care about govt deficits and even if they did as long as the FED controls the bond market, and keeps interest rates low isn't the market is being supported?

Its seems to me the market anticipated the cuts. Now the rest of the money is piling because it has to and because they are seeing profits increasing for the forseeable future.

Exogenous shocks could change things.
The FED could change things.
Things could change which changes things.

If you think the market would react to Trump being shot by Melania... then you are tacitly acknowledging Trump matters to the market and Pence might not be a better choice.




piezoe said:
Nice spin, but it's mostly an illusion. Trump is an embarrassment abroad. The market, which could care less whether Merkel or Theresa May think Donald is a jerk, is a continuation of the recovery started in June, 2009. The impetus is multivariate. The most important factor, as always in bull markets, is a rising market itself. This brings in more sidelines money for fear of missing out and causes acceleration of the trend. Premature , inexperienced shorts with weak hands add to the impetus as they cover, and finally, but critically important, dollar weakness is adding to the momentum. (Never view the market in isolation from the dollar futures! If the dollar futures and equities market begin to move in lock-step opposition that tells you that the dollar has become a dominant factor. Under that circumstance, a change in the dollar futures trend on a longer time scale becomes a harbinger of a correction to follow.) Later on, accelerated deficit spending, which Republican leadership was so anxious to get going before November, will continue the good times. There is also, riding on top of these other factors, the wealth effect which tends to goose consumption demand and earnings, and then dissipate as the market corrects, which it eventually will. I have described for you the usual market cycle and the sub-cycles contained within, and what to keep an eye on. (There will be no charge for this free lesson.)

The recent tax cut rushed through Congress, was an extraordinary event, having been pushed through in a panic to get it implemented, days later, and leaving tax accountants flummoxed. But it was in time, nevertheless, to influence the critical November election. This tax bill will produce greatly accelerated deficits, as the cuts will be out of balance with spending reductions. Since the deficits are coming at a time of near full employment, rather than in recession, we should see a rather dramatic boost in the economy accompanied by an up-tic in inflation -- both these phenomena will boost the equities market. Trump, though he has not a clue what he's doing, can take credit for helping to achieve a sense of plenty in a dire emergency -- at least from the Republican leadership point of view. He can also take credit for causing a lot of folks to jump into the equities market for fear of missing out. They'll also jump back out near the bottom when the correction comes.

Logically, market measures should be discounted for inflation, productivity and population growth, but the public, including seasoned stock investors and the media, think in nominal terms, and that's what dictates emotion. There is still more money on the sidelines. Check back after July 4th, or either when Mueller issues his report or when Melania pulls a gun on the Donald, which ever comes first .
More...
 
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piezoe said:
The Beef is on the way. We can expect delivery by late Summer 2018. Because the delivery truck is still on the highway, Your Honor, we are requesting a continuation until September 1.
More...
piezoe said:
I'd like to offer a heartfelt word of encouragement to those idiots here who are hoping for a Trump victory. It is too soon to abandon all hope. There could be an October Surprise via Wikileaks, i.e. "the Russians," and Hillary's server.
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Despite your confidence, your predictions are not credible.

"Confidence, it's the food of the wise man, and the liquor of the fool."
Vikram, The Office


https://www.elitetrader.com/et/thre...fit-for-presidency.301670/page-9#post-4313573
 
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He thought about firing him and then didn't Only a leftist could ramble on endlessly about a non event. Desperation has a death grip on the left. They have nothing.
 
CaptainObvious said:
If Trump ordered Mueller fired, he would have been fired, case closed. Now I can see a pissed off Trump having a conversation saying why do I have to put up with this bullshit when there's zero evidence, I should just fire the guy. Then someone in the room says, yeah, it's bullshit, but that's politics and if you fire the guy the media will just say you're trying to cover up. We just have to play the game Mr. President. To which Trump says, fuck it, I like games, let the games begin. All that isn't ordering someone to be fired, it's just conversation.
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All of this is some truly orwellian bullshit, for months the propagandists in the far left media have been telling us about how Trump supposedly colluded with russia, now that has all went away since they cant find a single piece of evidence to backup the claim, so now the story turns into, well Trump is still a criminal, because he debated firing someone who was investigating him for a crime he didnt commit.

The fact of the matter is he could have pardoned anyone below him like Manafort, or Flynn, and none of their crimes relate to collusion, but supposedly its a crime for him to ask his advisors if he could fire someone who is investigating him when the previous FBI director assured him multiple times he wasnt even under investigation. If he wanted to end the investigation into flynn and manafort for unrelated crimes he could have pardoned them at will, but its obstruction of justice for him to contemplate firing a person who has been unable to find a single crime he committed....... :D Unless they can thread the needle where he was trying to end an investigation into himself for a crime he committed then they cant win. You cant say, yeah well he was totally innocent but he talked to lawyers about ways to end the investigation, Mueller wants to get him under oath cause he might have a case if Trump lies under oath, but unless they can put that together they have nothing. 3 more years dems have fun, i know i have been having for the last year in the stock market. Its been like the frigging tech bubble under Trump. :D
 
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