True meaning of Thanksgiving is the triumph of Capitalism over the failure of Collectivism...

[Scataphagos]

"... Giving Thanks for the Triumph of Freedom...

In the wilderness of the New World, the Plymouth Pilgrims had progressed from the false dream of communism to the sound realism of capitalism. At a time of economic uncertainty and growing political paternalism, it is worthwhile recalling this beginning of the American experiment and experience with freedom.

This is the lesson of the First Thanksgiving. This year, when we, Americans sit around our dining table with family and friends, we should also remember that what we are really celebrating is the birth of free men and free enterprise in that New World of America.

The true meaning of Thanksgiving, in other words, is the triumph of Capitalism over the failure of Collectivism in all its forms..."


http://www.infowars.com/the-true-meaning-of-thanksgiving/

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[gwb-trading]

You do realize that the first Pilgrim settlement at Plymouth was fully based on Collectivism. All food was shared. All housing was shared. All chores were shared. No private enterprise was allowed. The first Thanksgiving was a Collectivism event shared to build trust with their Indian neighbors.

In fact the only "capitalistic" angle was all the settlers were effectively endured servants working for a trading company in England that funded the trip. All profits from the colony were to go to the trading company.

The National Geographic Channel recently had a good two part series on the founding of Plymouth called "Saints & Strangers".

 

[ETcallhome]

You do realize that the first Pilgrim settlement at Plymouth was fully based on Collectivism. All food was shared. All housing was shared. All chores were shared. No private enterprise was allowed. The first Thanksgiving was a Collectivism event shared to build trust with their Indian neighbors.

In fact the only "capitalistic" angle was all the settlers were effectively endured servants working for a trading company in England that funded the trip. All profits from the colony were to go to the trading company.

The National Geographic Channel recently had a good two part series on the founding of Plymouth called "Saints & Strangers".

the way I heard it, the Indians weren't actually invited, they just showed up to get their part of the harvest from their land.

 

[gwb-trading]

the way I heard it, the Indians weren't actually invited, they just showed up to get their part of the harvest from their land.

The Indians who decided to help the Pilgrims were actually responsible for the Pilgrim's survival to the first Thanksgiving. The Pilgrims were poorly prepared for survival in the new world. The shared meal was attempt to further build bridges with friendly natives.

A good number of the Indians actually spoke good English because they had previously been kidnapped and spent time on English fishing & trading ships (before the Pilgrims even showed up). The most well-known example is Squanto. The native Americans had a very good idea about what Europe was all about.

The relationships between the Pilgrims and local Indian tribes were very complex. Similarly the relationships among the tribes was very complex -- at various times at war or peace with each other. The Indians who were friendly with the Pilgrims were in many ways seeking the help & protection of the Pilgrims (and their guns) from war-like neighboring tribes.

BTW - Happy Thanksgiving to everyone on the ET P&R forum!

 

[Scataphagos]

You do realize that the first Pilgrim settlement at Plymouth was fully based on Collectivism. All food was shared. All housing was shared. All chores were shared. No private enterprise was allowed. The first Thanksgiving was a Collectivism event shared to build trust with their Indian neighbors.

In fact the only "capitalistic" angle was all the settlers were effectively endured servants working for a trading company in England that funded the trip. All profits from the colony were to go to the trading company.

The National Geographic Channel recently had a good two part series on the founding of Plymouth called "Saints & Strangers".

I do realize... saw Saint's and Strangers.

The link is a story about how for the 1st 2 years, the Plymouth settlers almost starved due to "the collective". In the 3rd year, they abandoned collectivism and adopted a more "capitalistic" style... all then prospered with excess to share.

And this....

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-26/real-non-pc-reason-we-celebrate-thanksgiving

 

[ipatent]

It took the Europeans a while to figure out that you have to go further south on the North American East Coast to get equivalent temperatures to Europe.

Massachusetts has a pretty harsh climate to be dropped off on the beach with crude 17th Century tools and expect to survive. They did pretty well considering everything.

 

[gwb-trading]

I do realize... saw Saint's and Strangers.

The link is a story about how for the 1st 2 years, the Plymouth settlers almost starved due to "the collective". In the 3rd year, they abandoned collectivism and adopted a more "capitalistic" style... all then prospered with excess to share.

And this....

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-26/real-non-pc-reason-we-celebrate-thanksgiving

This is an interesting re-writing of history. Especially the part about Jamestown. Jamestown starved because the majority of the "settlers" (most did not plan to stay) were "adventurers" who only wanted to hunt for gold to make their fortune and refused to do any work.

In fact in Jamestown the entire colony was founded on the concept of personal capitalism in order to return profit to the Virgina Company. Due to this most of the settlers refused to farm or do anything for the collective good despite Smith regularly demanding they do so. The "adventurers" were too intent on finding gold and exploring to make their fortunes. This attitude led to the demise of the colony.

The ill health of the Jamestown colony was primarily due to its location with poor drinking water and brackish swamps. The policy of the colony was not to grow its own food but take from the local Indians using military force or theft. This did not go over very well and led to long term hostile relations with the Indians in Virginia.

 

[ipatent]

Interesting take on Jamestown. More broadly, though, the main reason the English colonies eventually surpassed the Spanish ones is that the English brought their families along and built for the long term. The Spanish conquered immense areas but plundered the locals in every way possible, with the main aim being gold and silver exploitation.

Knowing what we do now about geography, I wonder where the ideal location would have been for the first settlement on the East Coast.

 

[wildchild]

Interesting take on Jamestown. More broadly, though, the main reason the English colonies eventually surpassed the Spanish ones is that the English brought their families along and built for the long term. The Spanish conquered immense areas but plundered the locals in every way possible, with the main aim being gold and silver exploitation.

Knowing what we do now about geography, I wonder where the ideal location would have been for the first settlement on the East Coast.

They did settle farther south and it didnt work out too well.

 

[Scataphagos]

The policy of the colony was not to grow its own food but take from the local Indians using military force or theft. This did not go over very well and led to long term hostile relations with the Indians in Virginia.

In "Saints and Strangers", there is mention of the Jamestown colony having been wiped out by the indians... no mention as to why... but exercising military force and stealing from them might have left them pissed off.