Trading with a Stop Loss in the Futures Market is for Losers

[Sergio77]

If you don't use an appropriate stop you can't control your risk. If you do not control your risk you will eventually fail.

 

[syswizard]

Quote from Tradethoven:

Rookies who think they know everything dont use stops, and usually get blown out within the first month of trading.

I witnessed this several times at a day-trading shop years ago.
By the same token, I witnessed "death by a thousand cuts" in my own account after trading small cap futures with tight stops.
So, what is the answer ? Answer: Experience and intuition as to where exactly to place the stop.

 

[bwolinsky]

Quote from Sergio77:

If you don't use an appropriate stop you can't control your risk. If you do not control your risk you will eventually fail.

I guess as luck would have it, no flash crashes have happened since running without 24/7 automation, but if you have to have stops waiting for bar closes works just as well but will require the automation if you're worried about after hours moves.

I don't use stop losses and instead use a type of conditional alert on other securities before exiting. If they hit, the market orders are better than alerting the price level itself as what was triggering them.

 

[tangentShot]

I have a disdain for reading long messages because time is precious.

If someone has to write page long messages to make his point, he doesn't know what he is talking about.

Quote from emg:

Those (SMALL TRADERS) that trade with stop in the futures/commodity market are doomed to fail. I am 99.99% sure, u will lose indefinitely.

Think about it small traders, what is the main reason for the loss or blowing your account? Your stop orders.

Of course, small traders need to place stop due to small RISK capital in the account ($5K. $20K, $50K). Small Traders are taught by 3rd party educational and system vendors to place stop to manage risk and yet they represent more than 90% of small trader lose!! They just lose!!

Force trading, overleverage (trading with more cars) with less capital in the account would make sense to place stop and are doomed. 99.99% u will get stopped out.

Adding to average down is risky if one knows how to do it. Most SMALL TRADERS add to average down/up by every tick or point are doomed to fail and will blow their tiny account ($5K, $10K, $20K, 50K) in no time. THEY WILL FAIL!


Solution:

with $100K minimum in the account and begin to trade 1 car and average down/up 15-50pts against u will minimize risk. For example:


short 1325.00 emini sp 500 on 1 car.

es went against you 20pts. your drawdown is $1000 on $100K account. Is that a lot of heat? U are down only 1% of your account. Is that a lot of heat?

U will go ahead and add and your average price will be 3pts away from the market price. From there u take small profit or loss.

$100K account is equal to $5000 minimum standard to open a futures account and begin trading with 1 car


those that do not have that kind of money should either join the house or should not be trading futures market at all

According to the CFTC:

Commodity Futures Trading Commission Futures and Options trading has large potential rewards, but also large potential risk. You must be aware of the risks and be willing to accept them in order to invest in the futures and options markets.

The risk of loss in trading commodities can be substantial. You should therefore carefully consider whether such trading is suitable for you in light of your financial condition.


Remember SMALL TRADERS:

More than 90% of small traders lose. They just lose!!!!


I am looking for the best answers Bring them up!

 

[blah12345678]

Quote from tangentShot:

I have a disdain for reading long messages because time is precious.

If someone has to write page long messages to make his point, he doesn't know what he is talking about.

And here you are, wasting your precious time trolling internet forums with your insightful comments...

1 sentence. Was that succinct enough?

 

[tangentShot]

Your handle sure sounds like how you're talking. I'm new to this forum, how do I block you?

Quote from blah12345678:

And here you are, wasting your precious time trolling internet forums with your insightful comments...

1 sentence. Was that succinct enough?

 

[vcir]

Maybe it works for you.
Trading wthout stops would never work for me (I daytrade exclusively stocks)

Call it psychological, call it whatever you want. But I need the reassurance that I have a net under my feet while trading..

Just my 5c.

Best,

Happy holidays!

 

[OldGoat]

I've just read this entire thread (over several days) and I must say it has been entertaining.

My observation is that most people don't read the posts to which they respond. And many posters don't have a clue about what they are doing as traders.

To the many who have made me laugh -- thanks, it was fun.

To the few who imparted some nuggets of wisdom won over decades -- thanks, it was insightful.

Best of trading to you all, may you live long and prosper.

p.s. IMHO everyone uses some sort of stop loss. The issue is more a matter of which one works best for you and how do you employ it. That has to do with instrument, time frame, volatility, experience, psychology, account size, etc., etc.

 

[NoDoji]

Over at Volente's, the OP has demonstrated this fall how to trade futures without a stop loss:

Quote from emg:

Hola! Swing and Mojitos time. No need to add

Average price at 1755.50

Quote from emg:

plan on exit at 1776.25 december

Quote from emg:

Hola! shorted es march at 1771.25.

Breakeven at 1750.50

Swing and mojitos time. No need to add

Just "exit" and "roll"

 

[ZaytsevVasya]

He was likely liquidated and his account closed by his broker. His demo account too.