Trading with a Stop Loss in the Futures Market is for Losers

[bone]

Quote from the1:

You are taking a bigger risk than I am.

No I am not. I pay $1800 every month for a TT Pro License because I am faster than you are. There is nothing faster. You get what you pay for. Again, since 1997 I have covered every doomsday scenario you mentioned... more, actually. In fact, the biggest day I ever had was using the AutoSpreader to get a three point mistake made by a UK bank in the Euribor on the US unemployment number - I was injecting orders just under the Liffe trade bust limit based upon the last Eurex Schatz price print. Really big day.

Nothing is faster than the TT Gateway. Look what is on every bank and hedge fund desk.

 

[eudaemon]

What an ignoramus!. TT-XT is free and I passed on it because it was too expensive!.

I'll let you figure that one out PRO-FESSER...LOL.

Next you'll be writing a book: " StopIimit your way to financial freedom" ROFL.

 

[bone]

Every client I have is using either TT or CTS or CQG IC or Apama or Portware or Fidessa. I would guess 60 % TT, 30 % CTS, and the balance are using esoteric really big ticket platforms.

Three clients using CQG IC - one in Newport Beach, one in Australia, and one in the UK.

Clearing Man Financial, New Edge, Advantage, RCG, Crossland.

Really good ECN infrastructure.

 

[bone]

Quote from eudaemon:

What an ignoramus!. TT-XT is free and I passed on it because it was too expensive!.

Bingo - paying retail clearing rates for one license key at TransAct or Velocity. Over a DSL line because that is what Globex2 is for. Phone lines and hand-helds in the pits. With that $5K account you must feel terrified.

Try your own dedicated line and a co-located server jackass.

 

[eudaemon]

Quote from bone:

Bingo - paying retail clearing rates for one license key at TransAct or Velocity. Over a DSL line because that is what Globex2 is for. Phone lines and hand-helds in the pits. With that $5K account you must feel terrified.

Try your own dedicated line and a co-located server jackass.

The only thing that needs co-locating is a suppository straight up your ass,
you foul mouthed ignorant jerkoff with a 1 lot long position and an offer and bid
For hundreds at least 5 tics out of the market.

Try the suppository. It's good for constipated 1 lot jagoffs like you.

Have a good relaxing weekend on the toilet, PRO-FESSER.

 

[Tradethoven]

Came across this reading 'Markets in Profile' by Dalton last night, was good for a laugh, reminded me of some people on this forum.. especially 'emg'

Of course, you can also choose to be a spectator, someone who knows a lot of interesting facts, able to recite all kinds of impressive statistics. But the fact remains: spectators can’t play the game.

 

[bone]

Quote from the1:

I suppose your range is that wide then?

You are missing the OCO feature which you can tier to work in conjunction with and simulaneously for your primary SL.

For example, if I miss the Dax SL on a 5 tic payup range, I can go to the CAC-40 via resting OCO, if I get a partial fill on the CAC-40 I can OCO the balance to the DJ EuroStoxx 50, OCO the FTSE, the ES, the NQ, and on and on. It's a millisecond waterfall effect. Think about it as an 'if and or' logic rules equation.

You end up picking other people off in other products and exchanges, which partially explains why Mr. Bonghit got so annoyed.

The automated spreading and market-making is a logical extension of this conversation.

 

[logic_man]

Quote from emg:

Those (SMALL TRADERS) that trade with stop in the futures/commodity market are doomed to fail. I am 99.99% sure, u will lose indefinitely.

Think about it small traders, what is the main reason for the loss or blowing your account? Your stop orders.

Of course, small traders need to place stop due to small RISK capital in the account ($5K. $20K, $50K). Small Traders are taught by 3rd party educational and system vendors to place stop to manage risk and yet they represent more than 90% of small trader lose!! They just lose!!

Force trading, overleverage (trading with more cars) with less capital in the account would make sense to place stop and are doomed. 99.99% u will get stopped out.

Adding to average down is risky if one knows how to do it. Most SMALL TRADERS add to average down/up by every tick or point are doomed to fail and will blow their tiny account ($5K, $10K, $20K, 50K) in no time. THEY WILL FAIL!


Solution:

with $100K minimum in the account and begin to trade 1 car and average down/up 15-50pts against u will minimize risk. For example:


short 1325.00 emini sp 500 on 1 car.

es went against you 20pts. your drawdown is $1000 on $100K account. Is that a lot of heat? U are down only 1% of your account. Is that a lot of heat?

U will go ahead and add and your average price will be 3pts away from the market price. From there u take small profit or loss.

$100K account is equal to $5000 minimum standard to open a futures account and begin trading with 1 car


those that do not have that kind of money should either join the house or should not be trading futures market at all

According to the CFTC:

Commodity Futures Trading Commission Futures and Options trading has large potential rewards, but also large potential risk. You must be aware of the risks and be willing to accept them in order to invest in the futures and options markets.

The risk of loss in trading commodities can be substantial. You should therefore carefully consider whether such trading is suitable for you in light of your financial condition.


Remember SMALL TRADERS:

More than 90% of small traders lose. They just lose!!!!


I am looking for the best answers Bring them up!

The only way to prove this empirically is to look at the results of traders who use stops and traders who don't use stops and compare their returns for statistical significance. This kind of blanket statement is useless. In simple terms, the only way what you are saying is true is if 85% of small traders who don't use stops lose and 95% of traders who do use them lose, making for the overall 90% losing population. That 10% difference in loss rates would show that not using stops adds value to the trader.

A trader who says he doesn't use stops reminds me of a guy jumping off a building who says he'll figure out his plan for landing on the way down. No, your plan for landing is already built in to the fact that you've jumped, whether you realize it or not.

Knowing where you are going to exit is part of sound planning. There is, for every trading entry type, a completely logical price at which the trade should be exited for a loss, if the trade doesn't become profitable, which can be deduced from the entry logic. If there isn't, your methodology is based on arbitrary subjective factors, not logic. And, yes, for some trading methodologies, that exit price can be 0, but 0 is still a stop. In many ways, 0 is a great stop, precisely because of its finality.

Tell me your entry and position-sizing logic and I'll tell you where your stop should be. Whether you actually enter the stop as an order beforehand is a tactical decision, not a strategic one.

 

[the1]

$1800 per month to spread your limits is a waste. You couldn't possibly have navigated all those events with that type of exit. You'd have to be a fortune teller to know how far to spread your limits.

If you spread them too tight the market can gap past you. If they are too wide you're using a stop market. You might as well spend 50 bucks per month for strategy runner and use markets, unless there's other gems on that platform that are worth the $1800. It's rhetorical. I don't want to know

Quote from bone:

No I am not. I pay $1800 every month for a TT Pro License because I am faster than you are. There is nothing faster. You get what you pay for. Again, since 1997 I have covered every doomsday scenario you mentioned... more, actually. In fact, the biggest day I ever had was using the AutoSpreader to get a three point mistake made by a UK bank in the Euribor on the US unemployment number - I was injecting orders just under the Liffe trade bust limit based upon the last Eurex Schatz price print. Really big day.

Nothing is faster than the TT Gateway. Look what is on every bank and hedge fund desk.

 

[bone]

Quote from the1:

It's rhetorical. I don't want to know

I think you posted too soon before reading my OCO comment regarding SLs.

If you feel the same way after reading about the OCO features, then you are missing a very important feature.