Trading while trying to lose weight on Atkins

LS

What I and now DB are trying to show you is

1) the 'heart disease' they you are quoting is not exactly a disease in the purest sense...

ex: somebody who is 400lbs has developed adult on set diabetes and cannot produce enough insulin....if they drop their weight down to 250lbs they no longer need to take the inulin pill or avoid any and all sugar...( this happened to someone in my family)
NOW...if they used the JENNY CRAIG system.....could jenny Craig claim they can 'reverse adult onset diabetes" or is it more of a case that their lifestyle caused problems that the diet alleviated 'temporarily"...that is the big distinction, because if they start eating and smoking again....will the problem return? of course, so i don;t consider it a 'reversal of a disease' , because they are not cured.

2) The study you provided had toomany variables....they should do the same study using ONLY the diet......then another study using ONLY exercise...then a separate one ONLY banning smoking...and then finally use a study using 2 of the variables and then finally a study using ALL of the variables in concert....The you would have a definitive impact on all variables separately and together..

.....on a side note, i have decided never to debate Axe on any issue unless I have a thesaurus and encyclopedia handy:D
 
Quote from TM_Direct:

LS

What I and now DB are trying to show you is

1) the 'heart disease' they you are quoting is not exactly a disease in the purest sense...

ex: somebody who is 400lbs has developed adult on set diabetes and cannot produce enough insulin....if they drop their weight down to 250lbs they no longer need to take the inulin pill or avoid any and all sugar...( this happened to someone in my family)
NOW...if they used the JENNY CRAIG system.....could jenny Craig claim they can 'reverse adult onset diabetes" or is it more of a case that their lifestyle caused problems that the diet alleviated 'temporarily"...that is the big distinction, because if they start eating and smoking again....will the problem return? of course, so i don;t consider it a 'reversal of a disease' , because they are not cured.

2) The study you provided had toomany variables....they should do the same study using ONLY the diet......then another study using ONLY exercise...then a separate one ONLY banning smoking...and then finally use a study using 2 of the variables and then finally a study using ALL of the variables in concert....The you would have a definitive impact on all variables separately and together..

.....on a side note, i have decided never to debate Axe on any issue unless I have a thesaurus and encyclopedia handy:D
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Axe is highly overrated. He's too easy. Debating him is like something from a Saturday Night Live skit :p

1)Stop with the semantics -see the big picture - measureable improvements in the severity of heart disease. PROVEN.

2)The Fleming protein/dat diet only study backs up the Ornish results. Quit letting your gut dictate to your brain. You can eat your hamburgers, that's your choice, but not without guilt.

The proof is right there in front of you. Try to see the big picture.
 
Quote from TM_Direct:

The study you provided had toomany variables....they should do the same study using ONLY the diet......then another study using ONLY exercise...then a separate one ONLY banning smoking...and then finally use a study using 2 of the variables and then finally a study using ALL of the variables in concert....The you would have a definitive impact on all variables separately and together..
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It is also necessary to have more than one "study". Otherwise, all you've got is clues and suggestions and indications.

Decades ago, the establishment decided that if people were too fat, the problem must be fat. Made sense. However, even those on low-fat diets just got fatter and fatter (after all, the low-fat diets encouraged cereal, pasta, rice, angel food cake, popcorn . . . ). Now, finally, they're looking at other potential causes, but those who BELIEVE aren't going to change those beliefs easily, no more so than scientists have done for centuries.

The Atkins diet isn't a solution any more than any diet is a solution since food in and of itself isn't the problem. It does, however, suggest alternative avenues of inquiry which many in the establishment won't even consider, largely because doing so would entail admitting that they might have been wrong all these years, and that can prompt something close to fury in some people.
 
Quote from LongShot:



Axe is highly overrated. He's too easy. Debating him is like something from a Saturday Night Live skit :p

1)Stop with the semantics -see the big picture - measurable improvements in the severity of heart disease. PROVEN.

2)The Fleming protein/dat diet only study backs up the Ornish results. Quit letting your gut dictate to your brain. You can eat your hamburgers, that's your choice, but not without guilt.

The proof is right there in front of you. Try to see the big picture.
More...


If you cannot see the flaws in this 'study' then it is pointless to continue to debate...as we keep trying to show you, WHAT is proven by that study????...LIFESTYLE change....NO SMOKING, NO STRESS, exercise, PSYCHO COUNSELING......I believe that by just quitting smoking and exercising yoy will achieve dramatic results...what do you think?....there is nothing wrong with my gut....i can bench press a house and run forever...that is not the point.....One additional comment though...I like how dean is publishing his results and doing the tests with flemming on his page......are you aware of the fact that Akins not only challenges science to prove it is harmful or not true......but he will pay for it!!!!
he sponsors and pays for most of the clinical studies done both for and against....you could go to Atkins clinic right now and get $$ from them to do a study....even if you tell him like some have, that you disagree with the diet and want to prove its harmful defects...i saw that on 20-20 a couple years back and was shocked to hear it.
 
Quote from dbphoenix:



It is also necessary to have more than one "study". Otherwise, all you've got is clues and suggestions and indications.

Decades ago, the establishment decided that if people were too fat, the problem must be fat. Made sense. However, even those on low-fat diets just got fatter and fatter (after all, the low-fat diets encouraged cereal, pasta, rice, angel food cake, popcorn . . . ). Now, finally, they're looking at other potential causes, but those who BELIEVE aren't going to change those beliefs easily, no more so than scientists have done for centuries.



Great Point....years ago in college i remember how for YEARS it was assumed that if you INCREASED lighting in the work place productivity would increase...why? because in the late 50's they took around 10 work places and came in and installed brighter lights and on avg. productivity increase about 30%....for over 20 years that became the accepted norm until some college students ran another test...they installed brighter lights in like 10 businesses, DIMMER lights in 10 businesses and PRETENDED to install a change of light in 10 businesses but actually left it the same...the results: Brighter lit businesses increased approximately 25% in productivity, the DIMMER businesses increased around the same rate and the business that had NO CHANGE but pretended to....increased productivity by 15%....????? the conclusion? they still didn't know but their theory suggested that ANY change in which employees see management trying to help them is a positive which in turn leads to, what they noted as well, temporary increases in productivity...unlike the first accepted test, they tracked productivity for several weeks and months and found that it was back to normal levels in a short period of time.
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Quote from dbphoenix:



It is also necessary to have more than one "study". Otherwise, all you've got is clues and suggestions and indications.
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Oh really? I've given peer reviewed research, what do you have to offer besides casual chit-chat?

My guess is you're battling your own food demons db. Just how overweight are you? Just can't get a grip on those food urges can you :p
 
Quote from TM_Direct:




If you cannot see the flaws in this 'study' then it is pointless to continue to debate...as we keep trying to show you, WHAT is proven by that study????...LIFESTYLE change....NO SMOKING, NO STRESS, exercise, PSYCHO COUNSELING......I believe that by just quitting smoking and exercising yoy will achieve dramatic results...what do you think?....there is nothing wrong with my gut....i can bench press a house and run forever...that is not the point.....One additional comment though...I like how dean is publishing his results and doing the tests with flemming on his page......are you aware of the fact that Akins not only challenges science to prove it is harmful or not true......but he will pay for it!!!!
he sponsors and pays for most of the clinical studies done both for and against....you could go to Atkins clinic right now and get $$ from them to do a study....even if you tell him like some have, that you disagree with the diet and want to prove its harmful defects...i saw that on 20-20 a couple years back and was shocked to hear it.
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Did you read the Fleming Study? Do you have problems with comprehension?
 
Quote from LongShot:



Oh really? I've given peer reviewed research, what do you have to offer besides casual chit-chat?

My guess is you're battling your own food demons db. Just how overweight are you :p
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Just remember there is a BIG difference between RESEARCH and FACT.....a lot of 'research' has tunred out to be bogus because of bad variable sand control and other flaws..

research once shoted that OATMEAL did this or that...so everyone loaded up on it....but it turns out it wasn;lt all it was cracked up to be....RESEARCH warned that Sacarine caused cance in rats...but many now beleive it was untrue because they put the equivalent of 6lbs per human into these rats
 
Quote from LongShot:



Oh really? I've given peer reviewed research, what do you have to offer besides casual chit-chat?

My guess is you're battling your own food demons db. Just how overweight are you? Just can't get a grip on those food urges can you :p
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You've given poorly-constructed research, nothing more.

As for me, whatever weight problems I may have had are long in the past, due to a low-carb diet. And my cholesterol is lower than it was with the "low-fat" diet my doctor prescribed.

Rant all you like, LS. You're arguing like a child.
 
Quote from dbphoenix:



You've given poorly-constructed research, nothing more.

As for me, whatever weight problems I may have had are long in the past, due to a low-carb diet. And my cholesterol is lower than it was with the "low-fat" diet my doctor prescribed.

Rant all you like, LS. You're arguing like a child.
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and you've given us .. well .. nothing. haha

a child, maybe? but a child prodigy:p

 
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