Reminds me of a story I heard several years ago. A guy was going through a divorce and his wife's lawyer was going after his trading account. The trader figured he would rather lose his last 20k then give it to his no good wife. Everyday he would buy out of the money premium on stuff that looked like garbage, and inside a couple of months made a quarter mil, signed an agreement with his wife and as far as I know, to this day is profitable.
Trading to LOSE ... to WIN
- Thread starter Brutus
- Start date
That is a good story Pabst. I'm reminded of the story in the book Ender's Game where a group of boys are taught war games. They learn on simulators, only at one point the simulators are transmitting live signals to a fleet that is actually engaging enemy forces even though the boys think it is all a simulation. The boys are able to win to a great extent because they don't feel the same degree of pressure as they would under live conditions and thus are able to make better decisions.
"Why not just get some newbies to post their trades and we can all fade them.
AAAintheBeltway this is really lovely idea
Did you read Machiavelli's The Prince??
Seriously it comes down to this: less you care about money more you will be able to make. Yoga has a lot to say on this subject.
AAAintheBeltway this is really lovely idea
Did you read Machiavelli's The Prince??
Seriously it comes down to this: less you care about money more you will be able to make. Yoga has a lot to say on this subject.
March 14, 2002 11:24 am EST
LONDON (Reuters) - A five-year old girl has beaten a financial analyst and an astrologer in an experiment to find the most accurate stock market predictions over a year, organizers said on Thursday.
Tia Lavern Roberts not only outperformed her fellow participants in the National Science Week challenge but defied a 16 percent drop in Britain's FTSE 100 index of leading shares with her selection of issues.
Her fantasy $7,000 portfolio rose 5.8 percent, while the one selected by analyst Mark Goodson lost 46.2 percent over the year. Astrologer Christeen Skinner's portfolio dropped 6.2 percent.
Goodson used his years of expertise and computer analysis, and Skinner based her selection on planetary movements.
"During an unstable year for the stock market...Tia's random selection has still managed to outperformed the others," Richard Wiseman, a psychologist from the University of Hertfordshire who devised the experiment, said in statement.
Tia thought it was "wicked" that she'd beaten the market, the statement said.
Her tips for this year's investors were Cadbury Schweppes, Northern Rock, Prudential, Pearson and Shell Transport.
WoW...Wish I had a couple of Kids
Lobster
LONDON (Reuters) - A five-year old girl has beaten a financial analyst and an astrologer in an experiment to find the most accurate stock market predictions over a year, organizers said on Thursday.
Tia Lavern Roberts not only outperformed her fellow participants in the National Science Week challenge but defied a 16 percent drop in Britain's FTSE 100 index of leading shares with her selection of issues.
Her fantasy $7,000 portfolio rose 5.8 percent, while the one selected by analyst Mark Goodson lost 46.2 percent over the year. Astrologer Christeen Skinner's portfolio dropped 6.2 percent.
Goodson used his years of expertise and computer analysis, and Skinner based her selection on planetary movements.
"During an unstable year for the stock market...Tia's random selection has still managed to outperformed the others," Richard Wiseman, a psychologist from the University of Hertfordshire who devised the experiment, said in statement.
Tia thought it was "wicked" that she'd beaten the market, the statement said.
Her tips for this year's investors were Cadbury Schweppes, Northern Rock, Prudential, Pearson and Shell Transport.
WoW...Wish I had a couple of Kids
Lobster
You are right. That's actually the point. To demonstrate the trader is the problem in trading, not the market, not the swings, not the slippage, not the commissions, not the broker, etc..
If you always lose, it is very difficult to reverse your way (I wrote in several threads on the topic). It's a pity, because if you would truely reverse your way, you'd make money.
Trading to lose is a very good way to find what in your trading is wrong (the same things wrong you do when you try to lose and try to win, should be easier to detect with this game).
When you know how to win (the regular trading) it is easier to reverse and succeed in the losing game.
if someone does OK in the losing game and not the regular trading though, it's a sign of self sabotage in regular trading : too much fear or greed probably. fear is obvious. greed I mean, not following proper money and size management as well as over trading.
if you don't get the point of the losing game AND you are not profitable in the regular trading, you really should not be trading.. not real money at least.
There was a really sad truth in another thread about edge. Beside knowledge, experience, discipline etc.. a real big edge is all the non professional traders losing. They pay the very small minority of pro traders.
And here, let me be very clear about what I call pro. It's not necessarly a trader working for a pro firm at all. I am not and I do OK. Others do too.
I mean any trader doing this really as a business. It does not matter if he works at home, in an office, for himself or a company. Doing it as business is key. It is a very different mindset than most who call themselves 'traders' and are only investors trying to trade.
it is a bit the same difference between anybody going to vegas and a pro gambler. Saying than both are gamblers is ridiculous. One is there to lose, the other one is running a business. It does not make sure the business will be a success by the way. But if you do it as a hobby there is no way you will succeed.
that's part of the edge too then : trading as a business.
I am trying to be positive here, not mean to those who are trying very hard to succeed. I once was in the same ride, with most trades giving money away. You HAVE to be a loser before you win. But the transition is not automatic, and it is not by time. It takes a lot of work and a lot of throwing away stupid ideas about what you think trading is. I will never on this board just tell you what I do, or let you in in my ways. After all I did not discover anything, did not invent anything.
Market dynamics, ways to make money, it's all over the place in books and this very forum.
It is difficult to see or apply because of your beliefs and mind. And that I like to give people pointers. If they listen well and do the homework, a small portion will finally get it and be long term profitable. It will always be a small portion anyway. This game is not my idea, but it is a very good pointer. It is in the line of a pointer I gave some time ago about trading against yourself. Most who replied did not get it though (well, succesful traders did, but that's no surprise. it was meant for struggling traders). maybe this way is clearer.
tntneo
Your post was too lengthy and redundant. The point is, we all struggle with our trading. I once went long 1000 shares of LTXX, 5 minutes later I sold the 1000 for a profit and went short 1000 for another profit 10 minutes later. Made some cheese on the deal. That's what it's all about. Cut to the chase dude...
Originally posted by thunderbolt
Your post was too lengthy and redundant. The point is, we all struggle with our trading. I once went long 1000 shares of LTXX, 5 minutes later I sold the 1000 for a profit and went short 1000 for another profit 10 minutes later. Made some cheese on the deal. That's what it's all about. Cut to the chase dude...
thunderbolt, your post was too lengthy and redundant.
Should have just said BLASH (buy low and sell high).
Cut to the chase dude...