Trading sucks, dont waste your time

the entire premise is flawed.

it's a false binary to say the least.

one can (i certainly do) invest for the longterm, swingtrade for the medium term, and daytrade (i do futures) - the latter to make a living

they COMPLEMENT each other.

today is a perfect example. today was a DREAM for a futures trader. days like this are incredible. huge profitable swings, with minimal risk (clear support and resistance levels).

few investors made money today, although they may have found some strategic companies to pick up long.

for me, it's about making income (in the short term) and building wealth in the longterm.

most TRADERS will lose. trading is MUCH more difficult than dollar cost average investing into strong good companies and decent mutual funds. investing is a different paradigm, and has different goals than trading

if you are not good at trading (which is why i suspect you are so bitter), either do what you have to do to GET better at it - hire a mentor, study the market, etc. - or stop trading

but don't malign that which you are bad at.
 
Quote from scriabinop23:

looks like a good place to vent...


so far the last 2 weeks I've been

long natural gas and scaling in big...
long CME, ICE, NMX (thru a lot of near month options)
short AMZN
long GOOG via aug options (short july calls though at least)
attempting to short crude
attempting to buy BIDU puts all the way from 150-210. bailed on july puts at a loss last tuesday or so before it dumped..
missed out entirely on shorting the crack spread (spent time a few months ago doing it with utter disappointment and failure)
long GS 210 calls august from the 208 level.

-and automated system i designed is flat... sitting things out.

so tired of this as well...

thats my ticket to losing $$$.
More...



good luck with your positions. You'll need it.

Once trading is mastered and the initial hurdles cleared, the payout/time spent curve increases exponentially. It's not difficult to make a couple of grand every day trading only the first hour. I prefer the last hour myself.
 
Quote from arealpissedgoy:

good luck with your positions. You'll need it.

Once trading is mastered and the initial hurdles cleared, the payout/time spent curve increases exponentially. It's not difficult to make a couple of grand every day trading only the first hour. I prefer the last hour myself.
More...

how do you approach the last hour?...is it the ES?
 
Quote from whitster:

the entire premise is flawed.

it's a false binary to say the least.

one can (i certainly do) invest for the longterm, swingtrade for the medium term, and daytrade (i do futures) - the latter to make a living

they COMPLEMENT each other.

today is a perfect example. today was a DREAM for a futures trader. days like this are incredible. huge profitable swings, with minimal risk (clear support and resistance levels).

few investors made money today, although they may have found some strategic companies to pick up long.

for me, it's about making income (in the short term) and building wealth in the longterm.

most TRADERS will lose. trading is MUCH more difficult than dollar cost average investing into strong good companies and decent mutual funds. investing is a different paradigm, and has different goals than trading

if you are not good at trading (which is why i suspect you are so bitter), either do what you have to do to GET better at it - hire a mentor, study the market, etc. - or stop trading

but don't malign that which you are bad at.
More...


Well said.

st
 
Quote from whitster:

the entire premise is flawed.

it's a false binary to say the least.

one can (i certainly do) invest for the longterm, swingtrade for the medium term, and daytrade (i do futures) - the latter to make a living

they COMPLEMENT each other.

today is a perfect example. today was a DREAM for a futures trader. days like this are incredible. huge profitable swings, with minimal risk (clear support and resistance levels).

few investors made money today, although they may have found some strategic companies to pick up long.

for me, it's about making income (in the short term) and building wealth in the longterm.

most TRADERS will lose. trading is MUCH more difficult than dollar cost average investing into strong good companies and decent mutual funds. investing is a different paradigm, and has different goals than trading

if you are not good at trading (which is why i suspect you are so bitter), either do what you have to do to GET better at it - hire a mentor, study the market, etc. - or stop trading

but don't malign that which you are bad at.
More...

I think that post is very reasonable, and the comments before about DCA'ing are reasonable. It took me a while (& frankly, some losses) to get over my "I'm a trader - I don't do weak stuff like that" mindset and approach my financial plan in that manner. While I still feel 'weak' DCA'ing into something like a (god forbid) index instrument, I do it and lo and behold, make money. Using profits above and beyond the growth of your trading capital in a real diversified portfolio (and I mean everything under the sun on that one) is a pretty good idea. Eventually, we're all going to get smacked down (seen it happen up close and personal - not to myself, by the way) and start over - it would be nice to start over with HALF instead of ZERO.

I invest for the long term with various instruments, some professionally (whatever that means) managed, some self managed; position trade equities, CEF's, bonds and FX intermediate term, and take spec plays in options or OTCBB's short term. The risk capital spent about halves at each step.

The biggest disappointment for myself is my inability at times to follow the market more closely - probably the best reason why I can't be a successful intraday trader and really prefer the broader structural position plays (long energies/commodities, puts on those related to the subprime world) with OCO orders. But its not the same as being able to follow it with a mental trailing stop where you can adjust your takeprofit to the market conditions. Nothing worse than missing your takeprofit by a nickel to head back down to flat & decide to get out with nothing to show for your efforts. You watch, that doesn't happen (as often). And forget futures if you ain't there to watch the screen. That's suicide, unless you have a better way to do it or trade one lot at a time. And miss a day like today (like I did), and you've missed a tremendous profit opportunity. Oh well.

Ultimately, what matters is your profitability. Nothing else. I will swallow my pride and continue to do what makes profit regardless of wether I like it or not. Even if I think it is boring as stink.
 
good point.


even intraday trading should be BORING

to paraphrase another trader - if you want excitement, forget your anniversary. but don't SEEK excitement in trading.

my best trading is when i am coldly dispassionate.

i would love to achieve the ultimate trading state (tm) wherein i felt no difference between a winning and losing trade.

i firmly believe a big part of what makes futures trading SO profitable (if done right) is capitalizing on other's pain and euphoria.

one of my rules is to take a day off whenever i get too emotional. euphoria is MUCH more dangerous than any other emotion imo. when you have several big winning days in a row, it is almost IMPOSSIBLE to trade dispassionately.

i like to think of each trade as a business decision. because it is. but do i get excited when i make a great trade? of course. i am human.

i love having one account that is a PURE DCA account. it is boring, i agree. but it's great to see profits accumulate. i will, to some extent, tinker with the balances, but the basic themes are this...

commodities: DBA DBO MIDSX (great gold fund i opened an account about 10 yrs ago during the height of tech euphoria. everybody hated gold... buy what other's hate. sell what they love :) )

Index funds: a wilshire type fund, a SPEWI (s&P equal weighted index. i far prefer this to the cap weighted index), and a world stock fund

Actively managed mutual funds: contrafund type stuff.

Cash: money market and govt. debt

Individual investment grade stocks: stuff like MO JNJ etc.

Spec portion: never more than 10% of my portfolio (in my DCA account). spread among some nice spec issues that offer some spice.

Hedge stuff: this works in with commodities (gold, etc.) but also includes a position in FXE
 
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