Trading Methods?

Have you studied your exits in a systematic way?

I have many different exit indicators, but by far the best is
"stops to b/e and take a nap". At least, I usually aim to hold
a portion of my position for a few days, if it is profitable.
 
Quote from Solace:

I have been trading for quite some time now spending countless hours developing system after system based on indicators, chart patterns, etc. and reading every book I can find on the subject of trading. Just when I thought I knew what I was doing... I crashed and burned. My systems proved worthless as did most of what I read. Perhaps I didn't give these things enough time? Is trading ultimately a 50/50 bet assuming you use stops? Are there proven methods that actually produce 70% or greater results? If so, what book? What trading coach should I look up? I have been to Tony Oz seminars who seems to want to promote his realtick Oz scanner (which I have tried). Linda Bradford Raske seminars who uses many methods. Larry Williams, Robert Deel, Tom DeMark seminars. Joined chat groups like the Underground Trader and David Floyds room. Nothing is really giving me better than 50/50. What's next? I want, like most people I feel at this site, to become a full-time trader. I just don't know where to go from here?

This is a little vague. Is "quite some time" three months or three years? You haven't wasted your time. You learned something valuable, namely that noneof the stuff you learned actually works, at least all the time. So now you can go on to other things.

All of us have gone through this stage. For me, it gradually came together after reading an early version of what ultimately became Gary Smith's book , which I believe is called Trading For a Living. I'm not saying the actual setups are the key, but the approach helped me tremendously. Also I loved an older book called West of Wall Street, but that is for futures traders. William O'Neill's book on stock trading is great, and you get it for free if you subscribe to Investors Daily. Finally, Buzzy Schwartz' book Pit Bull rang a bell with me, although again there are not actual setups there for you to copy.

You confuse me a little with your mention of 50-50 and "70% results." Winning percentage is not the key, unless you are a scalper. You don't book win percentages. You book profits and losses. In fact, some very good position trading methods will have sub-50% win percentages.

Perhaps it would be useful for you to explain what you are trying to do and how you do it. Don't get discouraged. This is a tough game and it takes a while to get a handle on it.
 
Quote from inandlong:

You mean I just can't put up 2K, yell "yeeeeeehaaaaawwww I'm a traderman!", and clickety click click to a million bucks in a few weeks?

Maaaan, there is always a catch!

LOL, This should be a book: Clickety click click to a million bucks..

Walter
 
Yes, indeed I have read Gary's book and his recommended book by Darvas. I guess I should clarify that my approach is daytrading and scalping. Gary's approach is based on a longer term which does not really fit my personality. I think it's a good book and very insightful. Although, I wonder how he is reading te VIX lately? I know Gary has written another book which I have not read and he has a site on yahoo-groups. Thanks for the help! I think now that the boys are back in town things will return to a bit more of what I have grown accustomed to???
 
Quote from Solace:

I know Gary has written another book which I have not read and he has a site on yahoo-groups.

Don't confuse Gary Smith with Gary B. Smith. They are two different people, the latter of whom is the street.com commentator.
 
Quote from reid5525:

Recognising high probability setups is the key. Your high prob setup is your reliable fishing hole.


You need more than a high probability strategy to be a successful trader.

That's only 1 piece of the 1000 piece puzzle.



Quote from reid5525:


Throw out the 1000 piece puzzle. Keep it simple.
Did you notice that stocks rally every day? Ever tried to pick those winners. It's great fun. It's like picking the winning horse but much less risky.
Figure out how to tell which stock is likely to go up. When you get good at it you'll make plenty of money. KEEP TIGHT STOPS.

Well, that's just a silly perspective to have. (unless you have a crystal ball)






Please read the article below:

I copied and pasted part of the daily update from www.innerworth.com



Skill Building Produces Consistent Profits

Seasoned traders often describe peak experiences in which they trade "in the zone." Everything seems to "click." They trade in synchrony with the markets, and act almost instinctively with the ebb and flow of market prices.

Although seasoned traders frequently report trading in a peak performance state, novice traders rarely achieve it. That's because trading in the zone comes with experience, and in that sense, trading is much like professional athletics; one must build up a high level of skill so as to perform effortlessly and intuitively, and for traders, that in turn leads to consistent profitability.
Once you discover a winning trading strategy, using it to make consistent profits is a matter of reading the markets accurately, executing the strategy, and exiting the trade flawlessly. The strategy may not work every time, but from historical data, you know it works with "casino odds;" just like a casino, the odds are in your favor. When the overall odds are in your favor, it's just a matter of making trade after trade so that "the numbers work for you." The more trades you make by trading your plan, the more likely you will make an overall profit across the large sample of trades.


(*******he's the point in regards to this thread*******)
However, if you "choke" on some trades because you have not yet developed a high level of trading skill, it doesn't matter that you have a strategy that puts the odds in your favor. It's similar to professional sports. There are strategic plays that are executed during the game, but an athlete must have honed a set of advanced skills to execute the play flawlessly. Otherwise, it doesn't matter how ingenious the play, it will fail without capable players. When the professional athlete sees the ball coming, he or she must take action in an instant. The receiver on the football team needs to get into the right position, catch the pass, and make it to the goal line; he doesn't have time to let his poor catching ability prevent him from spoiling the game plan. The outfielder is better off during a baseball game if he can automatically and almost instinctively catch the ball without having to over-think it. When one doesn't have a high level of skill, an inspired plan is doomed. And it's the same with trading. It doesn't matter how favorable the trading strategy is if one doesn't have the skill to execute it flawlessly.

Both traders and athletes must act on a moment's notice. They must work intuitively to observe and interpret signals quickly, yet accurately. They need to work intuitively to see signals so quickly that it is almost unconscious. Building such skills takes practice. One needs to make trade after trade, so as to perceive subtle changes in market conditions that are hard to read. Across time, one also learns how to set protective stops to manage risk, without getting "stopped out" due to extreme and sporadic volatility. And, eventually, one learns to gauge when it's time to close out the position for a profit, or cut one's losses to protect capital. The markets are continually changing, and only with practice can one learn to execute trades freely, and intuitively react to subtle market conditions. So don't underestimate the importance of practice. Sure, a winning trading strategy is necessary, but you must also have a high level of skill to take advantage of those winning odds. Skill building can help you take advantage of those odds and generate consistent profits.
 
I once tried to mentally create the ideal trader, and here is the profile I came up with:

1. An undergraduate degree in math or engineering.
2. A graduate degree in psychology.
3. A stint in the Marines.

Why?

There is a lot of math in tech. analyses.

Understand yourself and others as human behavior is what moves markets and how you react to trading successes and failures will determine how far you will go.

It takes discipline and IMO a Marine has it far beyond what normal people have.

IMO, if you have these 3, then trading becomes simple.

DS

PS - I have #1 only, an engineering degree. It took me a few years to develop skills in the other 2.
 
Quote from dougcs:

I once tried to mentally create the ideal trader, and here is the profile I came up with:

1. An undergraduate degree in math or engineering.
2. A graduate degree in psychology.
3. A stint in the Marines.

#1 may help;
#2 could as well study astrology;
#3 you should have gotten the "discipline" required in #1.

nononsense
 
gotta trade,
That piece you posted "Skill Building Produces Consistent Profits" did'nt tell you how to find one high prob trade. The guy just rambled on about nothing to do with trading stocks. And you dont need a "crystal ball" to find high prob trades. A good real-time scanner is all the crystal ball that you need. I said in my earlier post "Figure out how to tell which stock is likely to go up". I guess you have'nt been working on it. It brings rewards to work on it. Pick one stock that is likely to go up tomorrow when they get going around 9:35 - 9:45. That's it . Do that every morning that stocks trade until you know the rally stocks the moment that they point upward and you check out their vital stats. Then buy or paper buy. A stock is price, volume, chart pattern, support levels, resistance levels and reaction to news.
When you get good at it this is what you will be able to do:
Buy 10,000 shares. Sell at .20c profit = $2,000. When you hit every day that's $10,000week, $40,000month, $480,000year. SUBTRACT the misses and comm and you can net at around $260,000year.
Days when the buying is heavy you can take two and three positions easy, because stocks are performing strong to the upside.
With no one to tell you the secrets of their strategies and to share their edge with you, it can take a year to aquire the knowledge to pick a couple of winners each trading day.
What is stock trading if you can't tell most of the time, which two stocks will go up. Teach yourself to do it.
 
Quote from Solace:

I have been trading for quite some time now spending countless hours developing system after system based on indicators, chart patterns, etc. and reading every book I can find on the subject of trading. Just when I thought I knew what I was doing... I crashed and burned.

This is your lucky day Solace! I'm in the mood to do quotes...hehe.



My systems proved worthless as did most of what I read.
Perhaps I didn't give these things enough time?

Expect the process to take lots of time and hard work. Expect many dead ends and multiple failures before you find a successful trading approach that is right for you. J.Shwager(New Market Wizards)pg.463


Is trading ultimately a 50/50 bet assuming you use stops?

Anyone who enters the financial markets expecting to be right on most of their trades is in for a rude awakening. It's a lot like hitting a baseball...the best players get
hits 30 to 40% of the time.
Trader Vic(Methods of a Wall Street Master)pg.25


Are there proven methods that actually produce 70% or greater results?

If someone does have a method or system that good, they're not going to tell you about it.
Bill Greenspan...veteran floor trader(video=Trading made simple)



If so, what book?

Read the Market Wizard books...(there's 3 of them)written by
Jack Schwager




What trading coach should I look up? I have been to Tony Oz seminars who seems to want to promote his realtick Oz scanner (which I have tried). Linda Bradford Raske seminars who uses many methods. Larry Williams, Robert Deel, Tom DeMark seminars. Joined chat groups like the Underground Trader and David Floyds room. Nothing is really giving me better than 50/50. What's next?

It is critical to choose a method that is consistent with your own personality and comfort level.J.Schwager(New Market Wizards)pg.462


Trade with a plan and stick to it.
Trader Vic(Methods of a Wall Street Master)pg.177



I want, like most people I feel at this site, to become a full-time trader. I just don't know where to go from here?


This is a good place to start. Plenty of helpful
people here.



Best of Luck!
 
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