Trade a big account

I suggest you use a portion of your 190k
and enroll into a formal trading school.
I'm not referring to Youtube, or
any online nonsense.

There are many qualified trading instructors.
Find one with a proven tract record, and
pay his or her fee.

IF, you are trading an account of 190K,
you are already way ahead of the curve,
as the #1 problem with new traders is being
under capitalized. #2 is over leveraged.

You have more than enough money to
focus on TREND trading, so look to
get educated.
 
hurricane_sh said:
...

In the meantime, I also day trade MES, I can hold 500 SPY but I can only handle a few MES contracts mentally...
More...

That speaks volumes about your mental agility. Think about that line you just typed. How the hell did you ever survive before May 2019, when the micro equity contracts were introduced at the CME?
 
hurricane_sh said:
A little background: I've been trading S&P 500 related products for 7 years, SPY, spy options, ES, ES options, MES. In the first few years, I traded big accounts (usually started with $25K) and lost a lot, two years ago I started to trade very small accounts (1~2K), I only trade one or two MES contracts. I'm still a struggling trader but I think I know enough to become profitable, sometimes my emotions made me lose big, with the small accounts the room for errors is very small.

Two months ago, my family gave me a big account (140K) to trade, told me to trade safe, big loss is unacceptable. they believe that I can grow the account however slowly.

At first I was very confident, I mainly trade the wheel strategy (sell cash-secured puts, and covered calls if assigned), shouldn't be hard to make small profits. The market in the past two months is not very friendly to option sellers, my account got a big hit in the first week, at May 20 net liquidity dropped to 120K, fortunately I recovered all losses and became profitable in June, then 500 points decline, my account dropped to almost 120K again. With the recent rally I'm now 3K in red, I almost liquidated everything on Friday, it's been very stressful for 3 weeks.

Anyway, I definitely don't want to be in the same situation ever again, 20K loss for two times, this is my worst trading ever. If I lose $1k per day, 20K would take me a month to lose that much.

In the meantime, I also day trade MES, I can hold 500 SPY but I can only handle a few MES contracts mentally. My P/L is usually less than $200, but most days are green.

So, I mainly trade options (only selling), also day trade MES as complement. After this two months experience, I want to switch my trading - mainly day trade MES, and only trade options when a big chance presents, e.g. after a few days decline. But it seems to be a waste of fund, if I only trade a few MES contracts, a 10K or 20K account at most should be enough. I will deposit another 50K, so it's a 190K account, how do you trade this account? Safely, and maybe fund-efficiently.

I want to hear all kinds of opinions to open my mind. Thanks!
More...
YOLO BABY!
 
hurricane_sh said:
A little background: I've been trading S&P 500 related products for 7 years, SPY, spy options, ES, ES options, MES. In the first few years, I traded big accounts (usually started with $25K) and lost a lot, two years ago I started to trade very small accounts (1~2K), I only trade one or two MES contracts. I'm still a struggling trader but I think I know enough to become profitable, sometimes my emotions made me lose big, with the small accounts the room for errors is very small.

Two months ago, my family gave me a big account (140K) to trade, told me to trade safe, big loss is unacceptable. they believe that I can grow the account however slowly.

At first I was very confident, I mainly trade the wheel strategy (sell cash-secured puts, and covered calls if assigned), shouldn't be hard to make small profits. The market in the past two months is not very friendly to option sellers, my account got a big hit in the first week, at May 20 net liquidity dropped to 120K, fortunately I recovered all losses and became profitable in June, then 500 points decline, my account dropped to almost 120K again. With the recent rally I'm now 3K in red, I almost liquidated everything on Friday, it's been very stressful for 3 weeks.

Anyway, I definitely don't want to be in the same situation ever again, 20K loss for two times, this is my worst trading ever. If I lose $1k per day, 20K would take me a month to lose that much.

In the meantime, I also day trade MES, I can hold 500 SPY but I can only handle a few MES contracts mentally. My P/L is usually less than $200, but most days are green.

So, I mainly trade options (only selling), also day trade MES as complement. After this two months experience, I want to switch my trading - mainly day trade MES, and only trade options when a big chance presents, e.g. after a few days decline. But it seems to be a waste of fund, if I only trade a few MES contracts, a 10K or 20K account at most should be enough. I will deposit another 50K, so it's a 190K account, how do you trade this account? Safely, and maybe fund-efficiently.

I want to hear all kinds of opinions to open my mind. Thanks!
More...

My advice to you: Return all the money back to your family, go back to your day job and try to come up with a profitable trading system first. It's clear that you don't have a profitable strategy or trading system and you never have been even when you were trading small account sizes. There is no point in continuing to trade as continuing to do so would only deplete the account albeit slowly but not growing it.

Once you have designed a profitable trading system/strategy, test it out with a demo account first and then with a very small account. Once both of them are consistently profitable with no drawdowns that wipe out all profits, then you can start to increase your live account size gradually.
 
hurricane_sh said:
...Two months ago, my family gave me a big account (140K) to trade, told me to trade safe, big loss is unacceptable. they believe that I can grow the account however slowly...
More...

Give the money back and never accept it again.

Trade small with MES with a small trading account...be profitable for many months with that small trading account. Just keep slowly growing it. It may take a few years but you'll get there.

Thus, MES is appropriate for a 1- 2K.

hurricane_sh said:
I'm still a struggling trader but I think I know enough to become profitable, sometimes my emotions made me lose big, with the small accounts the room for errors is very small...
More...

You know this and you still accepted that money from your family...wow.

Start all over again but this time with your own money and without the additional financial stress that comes with trading money from someone else.

These market conditions, the volatility, most veteran traders can not manage and big losses are very likely for those that can publicly admit they're still a struggling trader.

Without knowing you and the type of losses you've described in those very short time span...you're not suitable for trading a large account even though this time you've manage to grow it back into just a 3k loss.

Trade small in these market conditions and only trade big if it's your money...money you can afford to lose.

wrbtrader
 
Thanks for all your suggestions! This is not a hypothetical question, I don't understand why anyone would ask fake questions.

My family is actually my wife, she doesn't trade but she earns very well. I earned well in my day jobs in my previous life, I treated her very well, now she takes care of me, well mostly. I burned her account once ($17K), she never got to see her account changes. With this new account she demanded to install the trading App on her phone, she checks the account on a daily basis.

She is upset with the 20K loss, but she understands that the market condition is extreme. When I recover my first 20K loss, I got cocky and sold options of individual stocks such as GS, MSFT, AMZN and MMM. I cut the losses of GS and AMZN, I have no confidence to hold them. Despite that the market has only rallied 50% of the 500 points decline, I'm almost break even. I wasn't doing too bad. If I only traded SPY options, I would be in green now. But I couldn't help asking myself: what if it dropped 500 points more? With the account fully loaded, it would be more than 40K loss. She will deposit 50K more and insisted it although I told her I can't handle big account.

BTW, MMM is really a disappointment, it performed much worse than all other stocks I traded. I plan to hold these 200 shares indefinitely.

I won't stop trading. My current plan is day trading a few MES contracts, very small P/L, which won't affect my account much. Sell spy options when good chances come, also trade small, don't use margin. I also like tesla options.

My secret trading goal was $1.5K weekly profit by selling SPY options. :)
 

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hurricane_sh said:
Thanks for all your suggestions! This is not a hypothetical question, I don't understand why anyone would ask fake questions.

My family is actually my wife, she doesn't trade but she earns very well. I earned well in my day jobs in my previous life, I treated her very well, now she takes care of me, well mostly. I burned her account once ($17K), she never got to see her account changes. With this new account she demanded to install the trading App on her phone, she checks the account on a daily basis.

She is upset with the 20K loss, but she understands that the market condition is extreme. When I recover my first 20K loss, I got cocky and sold options of individual stocks such as GS, MSFT, AMZN and MMM. I cut the losses of GS and AMZN, I have no confidence to hold them. Despite that the market has only rallied 50% of the 500 points decline, I'm almost break even. I wasn't doing too bad. If I only traded SPY options, I would be in green now. But I couldn't help asking myself: what if it dropped 500 points more? With the account fully loaded, it would be more than 40K loss. She will deposit 50K more and insisted it although I told her I can't handle big account.

BTW, MMM is really a disappointment, it performed much worse than all other stocks I traded. I plan to hold these 200 shares indefinitely.

I won't stop trading. My current plan is day trading a few MES contracts, very small P/L, which won't affect my account much. Sell spy options when good chances come, also trade small, don't use margin. I also like tesla options.

My secret trading goal was $1.5K weekly profit by selling SPY options. :)
More...
Show your wife your risk control plan. If nothing else that will force you do stick to it.
 
hurricane_sh said:
Thanks for all your suggestions! This is not a hypothetical question, I don't understand why anyone would ask fake questions.

My family is actually my wife, she doesn't trade but she earns very well. I earned well in my day jobs in my previous life, I treated her very well, now she takes care of me, well mostly. I burned her account once ($17K), she never got to see her account changes. With this new account she demanded to install the trading App on her phone, she checks the account on a daily basis.

She is upset with the 20K loss, but she understands that the market condition is extreme. When I recover my first 20K loss, I got cocky and sold options of individual stocks such as GS, MSFT, AMZN and MMM. I cut the losses of GS and AMZN, I have no confidence to hold them. Despite that the market has only rallied 50% of the 500 points decline, I'm almost break even. I wasn't doing too bad. If I only traded SPY options, I would be in green now. But I couldn't help asking myself: what if it dropped 500 points more? With the account fully loaded, it would be more than 40K loss. She will deposit 50K more and insisted it although I told her I can't handle big account.

BTW, MMM is really a disappointment, it performed much worse than all other stocks I traded. I plan to hold these 200 shares indefinitely.

I won't stop trading. My current plan is day trading a few MES contracts, very small P/L, which won't affect my account much. Sell spy options when good chances come, also trade small, don't use margin. I also like tesla options.

My secret trading goal was $1.5K weekly profit by selling SPY options. :)
More...

Give the money back and trade a small account until you have proven yourself and your wife you can be consistently profitable.

If you continue i can almost guarantee you will mess up again.
 
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