Toyota chief fears GM, Ford demise

[d9d]

Quote from dougcs:

Anyone think GM's woes will lead to some sort of a national insurance program that is in part financed by the govt?
DS

"by the govt"....arggghh!!

I hate it when people unthinkingly repeat that mantra. Ain't propaganda grand? Sooo effective when repeated endlessly...

Here is the factually-accurate version:

"by the TAXPAYERS"

and it ain't gonna happen, because tax receipts are about to fall off a cliff... :eek:

 

[dougcs]

Quote from d9d:

"by the govt"....arggghh!!

I hate it when people unthinkingly repeat that mantra. Ain't propaganda grand? Sooo effective when repeated endlessly...

Here is the factually-accurate version:

"by the TAXPAYERS"

and it ain't gonna happen, because tax receipts are about to fall off a cliff... :eek:

I agree it is a bad idea; but many companies share GMs problems and these companies finance our politicians and money talks is my line of thought.

DS

 

[drsteph]

Quote from NKNY:

And thats the bottom line .....

Build a better product...they will come ...


Even if that product costs 1000 dollars more due to the heath insurance factor.....

Nick

1. IF GM and Ford can no longer produce quality products, then, unavoidably, they are relics and must pass. THAT will provide a good wake-up call to the american public about what is happening to the job situation in the USA.

2. GM and Ford corporate culture have been deficient for years. This is just proof positive.

3. Fuel Cell technology is the way to go & maybe its time for these guys to start rolling out some products using them to save their collective asses. Hybrid technology, until batteries are improved, may turn out to bite Toyota in the rear with high maintenence costs and poor reliability as the cars get 2-4 years old.

4. Executive pay for GM and Ford Execs may come under scrutiny under recent oversight. Let's use the tort lawyers for something useful.

5. Health care costs are a smaller part of the price difference. I really don't care about paying $1000 +/- for a $30,000 vehicle - I want something that's going to be around 5-7 years later and is fuel efficent. Detroit has failed MISERABLY at providing what is necessary and instead has provided what it WANTS to build - gas guzzling behemoths with poor impact protection and poor stability. We hope you enjoyed your profits!

 

[gnome]

The concept of defined benefit pension and paid health care in retirement will fail for the same reason as Social Security.

Should have been recognized and adjusted to defined contribution looonnnng ago when it was obvious the demographic shift would severely hamper growth and perhaps viability.

US car makers now have a high legacy cost in each vehicle. Therefore, they have to cheapen their products to keep the price point competitive with importers.

No way out.

 

[ssternlight]

As many have said,

All they have to do is provide additional value and people will pay up. Fuel efficiency is the most obvious way to go as the benefit is immediate to the end user and doesn't actually shift the demand curve by lengthening the life of the vehicle.

Of course, if they want to be really radical they could invest in mass transit systems in the big cities.

 

[The Kin]

Quote from Casey30:

You make it seems like Liberals point of views are off the mark for some reason. Hmmm...lets think for a second...

Liberals want equal rights for everyone, conservatives want equal rights for white christian men only.

Liberals want a fair legal system, conservatives want to throw everyone except themselves in jail. (The US has a higher prison population than China)

A very ignorant statement considering that the Republicans continue to grow in support of minorities (myself included).

After reading your posts, I'm now under the opinion that Democrats for some reason believe that all non-whites and immigrants will somehow automatically vote for them. It just goes to show how detached from reality the Democratic base has become. Maybe a few more election losses and you liberals will finally figure it out.

Liberals want to take care of people in distress via social programs, conservatives want elimate those programs while providing more welfare to take care of corporations.

Please... It's more like the Liberals have a vested interest in creating a second class citizen -- keeping the poor poor -- so they will be forced to vote for them in order to keep the bloated social programs in which people have begun to rely on. Republicans on the other hand have faith in the individual that he or she has the will to better himself by ways of education and hard work. This is the American Dream: That hard work equals opportunity.

To add further insult to injury, Democrats frown on people who work hard to better themselves, so they tax them at higher marginal tax rates and use this funds to keep and grow the amount of second class citizens.

 

[The Kin]

Quote from d9d:

"by the govt"....arggghh!!

I hate it when people unthinkingly repeat that mantra. Ain't propaganda grand? Sooo effective when repeated endlessly...

Here is the factually-accurate version:

"by the TAXPAYERS"

and it ain't gonna happen, because tax receipts are about to fall off a cliff... :eek:

It's odd. Liberals are under the impression that if the gov pays for it, it then becomes free.

In reality, a similar if not higher health insurance amount will be built into every car do to higher corporate and income taxes.

Thankfully, the U.S. government knows better. Has anyone actually looked at Canada, a country with socialized health care? They pay sky high taxes only to receive thrid-world healthcare with 6 month waits to see a doctor. I know a couple of Canadian snow birds from Toronto who pay U.S. health insurance premiums so they can see the doctor when they're in the states despite having "free" healthcare in Canada. It's because the quaility of service is much lower in Canada. Understantably, in order to control costs the government rations health care: long waits and poor service.

 

[swtrader]

I really dont have much sympathy for GM or Ford.

In the 90s, we had a chance to move toward a sustainable energy policy for our country

Instead, GM makes the worst gas guzzler of 1973 (Chevy Suburban), the flagship of it's fleet.

They had a right do look out for 'number 1' and screw everyone else?

Maybe so, but that's what I think about now that they are crying with their palm up to the taxpayer

 

[wilburbear]

I've rode to work in taxis every work day for 4 years. This morning my ride was in a new 4 door Ford. The ride quality seemed a lot better than the normal jiggles and jounces. As I looked forward, the dashboard layout seemed better, like a more expensive European car. And that's when I saw it. The front dash vents were propped open by pens and pencils that had been stuck in the vent slats to keep them from falling closed. Just like every other Ford I'd smiled about in 4 years of rides. This is a brand new car. Ford must have a ordered a million of these vents for cost purposes and they just keep using them.

My next glance was straight across the rear bench seat. The opposite door revealed a continuous, quarter inch seam of body paint on the inside of the car door, peeking through in the gap between the seat and the door.

In the auto business, people are literally given an award for finding a way to save 5 bucks over a million vehicles. More than a $1000 in excess health care costs per vehicle is just too much to overcome.

 

[wilburbear]

Quote from The Kin:

A very ignorant statement considering that the Republicans continue to grow in support of minorities (myself included).

After reading your posts, I'm now under the opinion that Democrats for some reason believe that all non-whites and immigrants will somehow automatically vote for them. It just goes to show how detached from reality the Democratic base has become. Maybe a few more election losses and you liberals will finally figure it out.



Please... It's more like the Liberals have a vested interest in creating a second class citizen -- keeping the poor poor -- so they will be forced to vote for them in order to keep the bloated social programs in which people have begun to rely on. Republicans on the other hand have faith in the individual that he or she has the will to better himself by ways of education and hard work. This is the American Dream: That hard work equals opportunity.

To add further insult to injury, Democrats frown on people who work hard to better themselves, so they tax them at higher marginal tax rates and use this funds to keep and grow the amount of second class citizens.

You've really hit the nail on the head. Kerry couldn't believe he was losing to "this idiot" (Bush). Don't people know that Kerry would take money from rich people and redistribute it? Yes, people know that. And they know Kerry's career goes higher and higher as people become more dependant and helpless. They know what Kerry's game is. And they probably find it too distasteful to vote for a charlatan.