True. But wouldn't it be even more cost effective to just do sim for free on your own rather than paying a "combine" to do sim? If the person can meet the "combine's" criteria doing sim consistently on his own (and for free), then it makes sense to give this "combine" thing a go in search of funding. Until then, it's money down the drain/combine.
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Topsteptrader
- Thread starter deaddog
- Start date
No shit sherlock! you have certainly pulped that issue good. I think we all get your point Joe. What it boils down to is don't take a combine until you are ready (you are not ready until you can consistently pass it on demo). Once you get to days 1-10 of funded you need to put in a similar performance to the combine to build your cushion. This underlines the point further that you need to be ready to do the combine. The TST rule set is such that if you cannot continue to trade in a similar way to your passed combine you will very likely fail. Of course on day 11+ of funded time constraints are removed which will ease the pressure.
No, you STILL don't get it! You cannot "put in a similar performance" because you have to adhere to the additional weekly risk targets AND the scale up plan, which are NOT in the combine. This means when you review your stats in the combine and had days where you scaled up in any way, shape or form that differs from the live account parameters, or if you took a daily draw that was in excess of the average daily draw allowed on days 1-10 of the live account, then you cannot rely on those stats to measure your performance!
I know we're in disagreement here. You have an issue with my repeated references to the live account, however I'm emphasizing that it's not how you pass the combine that matters, it's how you trade on those critical first 10 days.
Let's just take the combine you passed, for example. Just review your stats and see how you met the performance metrics, and then see if that was allowable on days 1-10 in the live account.
Then, make whatever modifications necessary (such as your prior example of trading with half-risk), as that will determine your EVC (expected value cushion) of the live account on days 1-10.
Yes, we're in agreement on the fact of day 11+ there are no further constraints to work up the account size. And of course one should trade in practice to see if they can meet the performance objectives before taking the combine, makes perfect sense.
In any case, best of luck with the LTP.
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True. But wouldn't it be even more cost effective to just do sim for free on your own rather than paying a "combine" to do sim? If the person can meet the "combine's" criteria doing sim consistently on his own (and for free), then it makes sense to give this "combine" thing a go in search of funding. Until then, it's money down the drain/combine.
Just for clarification, what I meant was to trade the combine when you're ready and feel you have a high probability of passing, as opposed to opening your own retail account.
Also keep in mind that when you trade sim on your own, nobody is holding you accountable for any performance metrics, so the feeling is much different when you're in a combine where you are monitored for performance AND you have spent money to enter the combine.
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No, you STILL don't get it! You cannot "put in a similar performance" because you have to adhere to the additional weekly risk targets AND the scale up plan, which are NOT in the combine. This means when you review your stats in the combine and had days where you scaled up in any way, shape or form that differs from the live account parameters, or if you took a daily draw that was in excess of the average daily draw allowed on days 1-10 of the live account, then you cannot rely on those stats to measure your performance!
I know we're in disagreement here. You have an issue with my repeated references to the live account, however I'm emphasizing that it's not how you pass the combine that matters, it's how you trade on those critical first 10 days.
Let's just take the combine you passed, for example. Just review your stats and see how you met the performance metrics, and then see if that was allowable on days 1-10 in the live account.
Then, make whatever modifications necessary (such as your prior example of trading with half-risk), as that will determine your EVC (expected value cushion) of the live account on days 1-10.
Yes, we're in agreement on the fact of day 11+ there are no further constraints to work up the account size. And of course one should trade in practice to see if they can meet the performance objectives before taking the combine, makes perfect sense.
In any case, best of luck with the LTP.
Dude you are on the wind up. By similar performance I didnt mean use the same position sizing. Are you honestly going to tell me 'I dont get it' when I passed the combine 1st time and you fail multiple combines and are clearly 5hit. Some of your earlier posts in this thread are a disgrace.
In the combine there is 2% daily stop 3% max draw. Clearly with a 3% max draw you dont want to be going anywhere near a 2% daily loss otherwise you could do your ring on day 2. I risked 0.5% on 1st trade of day. My own daily loss limit was 1% for the combine and I sized accordingly. I didnt scale up at all.
Now when you are in days 1-10 of funded the additional 2% weekly loss limit is added. I cut my per trade risk in half to 0.25% with my own daily loss set to 0.5%. Again if you dont do this you could do your ring on day 2. Your ref to scaling plan is bs because 3 contracts will easily give you enough to get 0.25% risk on.
So by cutting my size in half and putting in a similar performance I can achieve $4500 ready for day 11.
As a successful trader you need to strive for consistency in everything you do. You dont want to be approaching your trading any differently on days 1 to 10 than your combine, just cut your position size.
You should spend YOUR time on edge and discipline. This cushion crap is a mental block for you. Decent traders dont have much drawdown, I know you will find that hard to believe.
To qualify for a refund on a 10 day combine all you have to do is be net positive and have 5 up days out of 10. The other rules are in the bag if you are not mentally deficient. If you cant make $1 of profit and have 45% up days over a 10 day period then basically you suck badly. There is no way to sugar coat this.
Absolutely. When the naysayers claim "it's simulator, anyone can make money trading sim" they don't understand that the combine will FORCE you to identify your weaknesses and improve upon them. Hence the combine is a great way to control risk under pressure.
It's better (and more cost effective) to spend the money on a combine vs. a "blow up" on a live account.
Regarding the number of "funded traders" remember those are just the ones who passed the combine, which may or may not reflect the actual number of traders currently trading a live account. It's already been discussed extensively.
These days pretty much everyone goes through funded trader prep. So funded traders will have passed that as well as the combine. Its funded trader rules on sim pretty much, with half profit target. Pressure steps up a notch here as well, and when you transition to live pressure steps up again. All about acclimatizing to the pressure imo. I understand your point though.
My own daily loss limit was 1% for the combine and I sized accordingly. I didnt scale up at all.
Now when you are in days 1-10 of funded the additional 2% weekly loss limit is added. I cut my per trade risk in half to 0.25% with my own daily loss set to 0.5%. Again if you dont do this you could do your ring on day 2. Your ref to scaling plan is bs because 3 contracts will easily give you enough to get 0.25% risk on.
So by cutting my size in half and putting in a similar performance I can achieve $4500 ready for day 11.
The combine of course doesn't require that you scale up. From the stats you posted it seemed you were trading more than 3 lots to start.
I had to modify my normal style to take more trades than i normally do, this was simply because I didn't want any variance to take me out. ]
The combine will of course allow you to trade more size in order to meet the performance metrics, since you don't have to follow the scale up plan.
Yes, if you traded, say, 6 lots per trade and met the performance objective, then you can scale down to 3 lots and make half the profit to get the $4,500 figure, as long as the risk on the stop is equally reduced.
0.25% risk on 3 lots of crude is 13 ticks, not a lot during periods of heightened volatility. However I'm not sure about the Euro or Pound.
The scale plan is "not b.s." since the live account requires a trader to follow it.
Decent traders dont have much drawdown, I know you will find that hard to believe.
Dude, you can't be serious with that comment?
Do some research on T3's traders, Scott Reddler is one of them. Apparently you haven't seen any P&L swings of the "decent traders" in this business.
Read this article from Great Point Capital.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/book-takes-a-look-inside-professional-day-traders-1339513989350
Read Cramer's first book "Confessions Of A Street Addict" and the chapter referencing the "Trading Goddess" (his wife).
Research the guys who run IU (Investors Underground), who show their actual P&L swings.
Many "decent traders" have HUGE P&L draws, but they can trade out of virtually any jam. It's all relative to equity and experience.
I know you will find THAT hard to believe.
These days pretty much everyone goes through funded trader prep. So funded traders will have passed that as well as the combine. Its funded trader rules on sim pretty much, with half profit target. Pressure steps up a notch here as well, and when you transition to live pressure steps up again. All about acclimatizing to the pressure imo. I understand your point though.
Good point, and I agree, the pressure steps up at each level. That's why one shouldn't be gloating over theirs or anyone's performance in the combine.
I've stated in the past that it's a necessary step in the program, but irrelevant since it doesn't have any relation of whether or not the guy took a check.
Dude, you can't be serious with that comment?
Yes and quoting Cramer as a decent trader is hilarious. lol.