TopstepTrader and Patak Trading Partners- Any and all questions answered here
- Thread starter MichaelPatak
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That's a monthly membership fee and optional. It gives you a practice account with daily trade logs. Then when you want to take the combine you get a lower entrance fee.
If you just want to pay for a combine, then you don't need the membership. So it's a matter of how you approach it, with or without a practice account.
Yes, all scouts did the $500 loss limit (tightest risk) Combine when we started the firm. Also I go my start with a prop house the same way with $300 loss limit in 2002 after I blew out three times the 3 years prior with my own money.
As a quick final note. We are scouts and we have an equity partner. It is no longer about us having to prove our trading when we are looking to discover traders. We know that discipline is the core foundation of trading. We are looking for those that have this.
mp
optionBull- We have memberships where you get a coach once a month to talk to giving you feedback or whatever your looking for, plus deep discounted Combines OR you can choose to enter the Combine as a stand alone. Two options.
mp
Thanks for pointing that out...
1. How does the firm handle the fluctuation between available funds and traders? Most of the time I assume there are more funds than funded traders, (so what happens with the extra money?) but there could be a sudden surge in talent and there might be not enough funds ready?
mp- We are well funded. This situation is not a concern nor do we discuss the fluctuation of funds publicly.
2. It seems odd to me that you guys would give up 10% profit share in the future for $300 now. I know that fee goes for the psychological training, but if that is so important, why don't you provide that for free, after all, if it helps the trader, it also gives you more profit?
As I see it, your firm would get 5K extra profit from a 50K funded trader who doubles his account in a year (similar to the combine's performance). But you rather have his $300 now (as the fee for the extra training) and give up 5K. That seems shortsighted, unless you know (by experience) that the trader won't make an extra 3K on the account by the end of the year...
mp- It does help the trader and we believe very strongly in it but it is the trader who is trading and some fall back to their old ways or old thought process. This is why we have the incentive to complete this early in your career. We want this in the traders mind. As an update, we have dropped this profit split to 65/35 instead of the 70/30 percentage split recently.
3. How do we know, you guys are not backing the trader with MORE money than you state? This would/could be actually very beneficial for your firm and would explain why you are giving up on the 10% profit share so easily. Let's say a trader is comfortable with trading 30K, but not much more. But you could still back him with 300K (without his knowledge) and get 10 times more profits. (assuming the trading instrument is liquid)
I actually find this type of backing psychologically a valid approach, but without disclosure morally/financially questionable. I hope I haven't just given you an excellent idea. _
mp- I do not understand the reasoning here. All funded traders sign trader agreements and understand what they receive and what they are responsible for and what is expected.
4. What if a live trader after 2 months decides to stop trading for you. My understanding is that he is not allowed to trade for anyone else for the next 10 months. Is that correct and does it include himself??
mp- the trader agreement has a non-compete clause. This clause is triggered after a trader profits $100k in a year. If you do not profit that you would be ok to trade for someone else. We are ok if you trade for yourself as some of our funded traders have personal accounts or trade family money.
5. What is the profit split between the backer and your company? I know, it is not really my business, but I was thinking let's say 50-50%. But that is slicing the already split profit in half. So if the trader gets 70% and you still split the 30% with the backer, then the guy who is actually founding the account only gets 15% of the profits, and that sounds a little low, considering that he is putting up the money and taking the risk....
mp- I am sorry but we do not release this information. The traders receives 100% of their profit split percentage.
6. Are the teachers also live traders, and if not, why not? Wouldn't the best teaching tool be showing a live account and how to do it in the real world??
mp- I believe I answered this question in a post prior.
I hope that clears things up. Sorry about the delay.
mp
The person asking that question, (3), believes that you might be "piggy backing" a funded trader's account, with another account, unknown to the funded trader. For example, where a funded trader has a $50,000 account, that other person believes TopStep could conceivably have a $1,000,000 account that is "copying" the trades of the $50,000 account. The funded trader isn't compensated off of the $1,000,000 account, only his $50,000 account.
Thanks Michael for your candid approach. If you don't mind, I will have 2 more follow ups on those questions:
1. As the poster Nazzdack clarified above, there is nothing to stop your company to piggyback trades. Specially traders who swing trade liquid trading instruments. Let's say I am only comfortable trading up to 5 ES contracts, and I only trade 1-2 times a day, going for several points, holding for hours.
This is a perfect situation for a piggybacker, because you don't have to enter exactly at the same time as the trader, because of the relative long holding period, and a little slippage is OK, not to mention you can program the whole thing. And you can easily swing 20-30 or more contracts, without the trader knowing about it.
As I mentioned before, this could be psychologically a valid approach, but not morally.
2. I understand why you offer the $300 trading and I agree with it. What I don't get:
a/ If it is so good for the trader, why don't you offer it for free, after all your company also profits from it?
b/ Why would you give up 10% of your possible profits so eagerly. And since this also effects the profit of the backer, you are giving up 5% of his profit.
If I were the backer, I would fight for the split agreement, and I would rather pay for the psychological training of the traders than give up an extra 5% profit....
1. As the poster Nazzdack clarified above, there is nothing to stop your company to piggyback trades. Specially traders who swing trade liquid trading instruments. Let's say I am only comfortable trading up to 5 ES contracts, and I only trade 1-2 times a day, going for several points, holding for hours.
This is a perfect situation for a piggybacker, because you don't have to enter exactly at the same time as the trader, because of the relative long holding period, and a little slippage is OK, not to mention you can program the whole thing. And you can easily swing 20-30 or more contracts, without the trader knowing about it.
As I mentioned before, this could be psychologically a valid approach, but not morally.
2. I understand why you offer the $300 trading and I agree with it. What I don't get:
a/ If it is so good for the trader, why don't you offer it for free, after all your company also profits from it?
b/ Why would you give up 10% of your possible profits so eagerly. And since this also effects the profit of the backer, you are giving up 5% of his profit.
If I were the backer, I would fight for the split agreement, and I would rather pay for the psychological training of the traders than give up an extra 5% profit....
:eek: 
The Pekelo bizarre line of non nonsensical questions continue. Hopefully, the mods here will have the wisdom to delete the nonsense, and others to ignore it. Otherwise, its not going to stop.. surf
The Pekelo bizarre line of non nonsensical questions continue. Hopefully, the mods here will have the wisdom to delete the nonsense, and others to ignore it. Otherwise, its not going to stop.. surf
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