I am not qualified to comment one way or another on the effectiveness of the tactic. I was merely hoping that we could all agree on what it is -- torture. "High-minded ideology" aside, I thought it might be useful to at least be on the same page on the matter and then go on from there. At least you are clear on where you stand and are willing to acknowledge it for what is. Hapaboy seems to lack the courage of his convictions by failing to acknowledge the tactic as torture. His is not a very principled stance. And although I may disagree with you, Captain, I am inclined to give you more credit for honesty and candor.Quote from CaptainObvious:
So, it's the old divide and conquer tactic.I don't know what Hap is willing to concede to or not. I would only guess that he and I are on the same page when it comes to interrogating terrorists... water boarding has proven effective in some cases and has resulted in the saving of thousands of lives. Knowing that, all the high minded ideology becomes irrelevant.
Top Dems Well Aware Of CIA Interrogations
- Thread starter AAAintheBeltway
- Start date
No. My principal issue with you is your slippery attempt to escape calling waterboarding torture in the face of historical precedent. This is your failure to concede reality.
You just can't help yourself, can you?
What would you do in that situation?
This is the problem with Obama. He lives in a dream world with no tradeoffs. We can engage in moral preening about not abusing terrorist detainees, yet at the same time we can pretend we are safer. They actually argue that we are safer because we are not annoying terrorists any more.
Now leftwing democrats are pushing for an "independent" commisssion to examine this episode and determine if prosecutions are warranted. They know it could be political poison, yet they are desperate for a way to have show trials to mollify their netroots base of crazies.
Torture is having to read the steady stream of bullshit that graces this forum day in and out...
The previous Administration said waterboarding was a legal technique that should be available under certain circumstances if authorized by the nation's legal and political leaders. It was performed years ago on only a couple of captured terrorists whom had either killed Americans or had been involved in the planning, i.e. KMS, and was done because we had to know if another 9/11-type plot was in the works. As a result, valuable information was gained that saved American lives.
Waterboarding is performed on American airmen to prepare them for capture and interrogation. Are you not horrified with this fact? Shouldn't you be raising hell about the US military performing "torture" on its own service members? Ater all, far more Americans have been waterboarded than captured terrorists....IMO it is worthless training anyway with respect to being captured by Al Qaeda or the plethora of jihadists and insurgents we're fighting in Iraq, because to them waterboarding is a joke. No, they far prefer the rusty blade to castrate, gouge out eyes, cut off ears and tongues, and other creative means of inflicting TRUE pain and suffering before the piece de resistance: slow decapitation.
So how about it, Tdog - what methods of interrogation are acceptable for someone like KMS? To what length would you go to extract information from a sick motherfucker who planned the operation that murdered 3000 innocents and in all likelihood has knowledge of further attacks that would again kill on a massive scale? Would you do anything at all?
What is the "reality" of what you would or would not do?
Are you going to answer the question or will you simply dodge it and continue doing what you do best - bitch and moan about the previous President who, by the way, just happened to prevent this country from being attacked again.
The question is beyond the scope of this thread. You have difficulty staying on point, either intentionally or otherwise. Unlike you, as a layman I won't pretend to know the best course of action based on my exposure to action movies and TV. Therefore, I try to limit my comments to that which I can reasonably comment on. Very much unlike you.
Stay on "point"? Give me a break. You are unable to do so yourself. This post of yours is a perfect example as you've only responded to half of what I wrote. What about the fact that American airmen, SEALs, etc. are waterboarded? Where is your indignation at the US government for "torturing" their own military servicemen and women?
And you are unable to answer the question as to what you think would be acceptable interrogation techniques on someone like KSM "based on (your) exposure to action movies and TV"??? LOL! What a cop out. If you are opposed to waterboarding him, surely you must have an alternative in mind, be it nothing at all (most likely) or another option. Remember, this is the guy who planned 9/11. Hardly a movie or TV, but real-world stuff. But if you prefer to go in and out of your fantasy world when it is most convenient for you to do so, you will be in company with most of the Left.
The thread you started about P & R being a waste of time is certainly applicable when trying to conduct a discussion with you.
Why am I not surprised that you did not even comprehend my point, let alone respond to it intelligently?