Today Gave Me A Headache

P

pspr

I have a system that uses some home made indicators combined with support and and resistance levels. It provides a few great entry points every day and very few signals should turn into losses.

My problem is that the market is looking over my shoulder. It knows when I take a trade and knows where my stop is placed. I'd swear the emini trades thousands of contracts just to go right to my stops then snaps right back and continues to make the move I expected without me. If I put in a tighter entry limit price to enter then the market teases me by trading at my price without a fill before it takes off without me.

If I chase the market at all, it invariably just sucks me in just to turn and go hunting for my stop.

If I widen my stop out the market will break any and all support levels to reach my stop. Regardless of where I put my stop, tight, loose or in between, the market can almost always find it. It wouldn't be so bad if after hitting my stop the market the market would keep on going, but NO. It likes to hit my stop by a tick or two then scream back in my direction.

So, why don't I just put my entry order where I would place my stop, you ask? Tried that. The market knows its an entry order and not a stop and never trades there.

Once in a while the market does what I expect for a while. Then it wants to make sure I didn't move my stop to break-even and will run back to my entry price just to get me out. If it fails to trick me with that maneuver, it will screw around after moving just a little making what appears to be topping action forcing me to grab a quick small profit. Within moments of getting me out, the market continues its move without me. If I fail to grab the small profit offered to me the market will turn against me and turn that small profit into a loss or break even if I'm lucky.

Am I the only one here that the market is gunning for? Do others find the market knows when you have a position and knows where your stops are? Or are you the one who is looking over my shoulder and using me for your personal ATM?
 
It sounds to me like you do not trust your strategy. Unless you are a big player, the market does not care about your stops. It's just you thinking it does.
 
I know the market doesn't care about my little positions or stops but God does. I wonder if he trades.

(only jesting about the causes of my plight. The market action just seems very ironic.)
 
Very common story. It is not difficult to imagine that floor traders know where most of the stops are and they do try to hit that areas.

Also, someone(on INO TV, don't know how reliable) did a study that if you keep wider stops you will take bigger loss, but will be less often. Trade lesser number of contracts with wider stops.
 
Your post had a very tongue and cheek feel to it. Had me laughing out loud because I think a lot of traders have had days like that. In my case it was the order entry, not my system that was at fault.

Assuming you have a large enough sample size, look back at your previous trades and try to estimate what moving your stop away from the trades would have done to your proffit/loss ratio.
 
Quote from pspr:

I have a system that uses some home made indicators combined with support and and resistance levels. It provides a few great entry points every day and very few signals should turn into losses.

My problem is that the market is looking over my shoulder. It knows when I take a trade and knows where my stop is placed. I'd swear the emini trades thousands of contracts just to go right to my stops then snaps right back and continues to make the move I expected without me. If I put in a tighter entry limit price to enter then the market teases me by trading at my price without a fill before it takes off without me.

If I chase the market at all, it invariably just sucks me in just to turn and go hunting for my stop.

If I widen my stop out the market will break any and all support levels to reach my stop. Regardless of where I put my stop, tight, loose or in between, the market can almost always find it. It wouldn't be so bad if after hitting my stop the market the market would keep on going, but NO. It likes to hit my stop by a tick or two then scream back in my direction.

So, why don't I just put my entry order where I would place my stop, you ask? Tried that. The market knows its an entry order and not a stop and never trades there.

Once in a while the market does what I expect for a while. Then it wants to make sure I didn't move my stop to break-even and will run back to my entry price just to get me out. If it fails to trick me with that maneuver, it will screw around after moving just a little making what appears to be topping action forcing me to grab a quick small profit. Within moments of getting me out, the market continues its move without me. If I fail to grab the small profit offered to me the market will turn against me and turn that small profit into a loss or break even if I'm lucky.

Am I the only one here that the market is gunning for? Do others find the market knows when you have a position and knows where your stops are? Or are you the one who is looking over my shoulder and using me for your personal ATM?
More...

If anything, your error is mixing Support & Resistance with those despicable indicators that amateurs use.

By desecrating your S/R levels with bollinger bands, MAs, sto, MACD & other crap you're putting pearls on a pig.

Quite frankly, comparing a pig to oscillators & indicators is an odious comparison & is unfair to the pig.
 
pspr:

You have excellent observation skills. What the market did to you is actually what it should do. I have developed a theoretical proof for what you have observed in reality. Glad that your observed it, but sad that you paid for it.

RFT
 
I don't know if you were looking at the same type of indicators I looked at. But, I had some similar experiences trading the SSO. In any case, my brain seems more compatible with the strategies by Ed Ponsi and the Forex markets.

The big difference there is that you can use 30 min, 45 min, 60 min. charts or longer because the currency markets trade 24 hours a day. So, there are no gaps.

In any case, after my account was approved Friday, I decided it was too late in the day to trade that day. Sunday and Monday I waited for a trade setup to develop before getting in. Finally, I traded 2 days in a row with OK results. Today, I did not even do a single trade. The currency pair I was watching just went wild in the morning so I avoided trading. Then, after patiently waiting for setups to appear, the moves were so quick, I chose not to even dare get in. lol, I guess I'll take a while to see if I want to continue with this or not.
 
Quote from pspr:

I have a system that uses some home made indicators combined with support and and resistance levels. It provides a few great entry points every day and very few signals should turn into losses.

My problem is that the market is looking over my shoulder. It knows when I take a trade and knows where my stop is placed. I'd swear the emini trades thousands of contracts just to go right to my stops then snaps right back and continues to make the move I expected without me. If I put in a tighter entry limit price to enter then the market teases me by trading at my price without a fill before it takes off without me.

If I chase the market at all, it invariably just sucks me in just to turn and go hunting for my stop.

If I widen my stop out the market will break any and all support levels to reach my stop. Regardless of where I put my stop, tight, loose or in between, the market can almost always find it. It wouldn't be so bad if after hitting my stop the market the market would keep on going, but NO. It likes to hit my stop by a tick or two then scream back in my direction.

So, why don't I just put my entry order where I would place my stop, you ask? Tried that. The market knows its an entry order and not a stop and never trades there.

Once in a while the market does what I expect for a while. Then it wants to make sure I didn't move my stop to break-even and will run back to my entry price just to get me out. If it fails to trick me with that maneuver, it will screw around after moving just a little making what appears to be topping action forcing me to grab a quick small profit. Within moments of getting me out, the market continues its move without me. If I fail to grab the small profit offered to me the market will turn against me and turn that small profit into a loss or break even if I'm lucky.

Am I the only one here that the market is gunning for? Do others find the market knows when you have a position and knows where your stops are? Or are you the one who is looking over my shoulder and using me for your personal ATM?
More...

How about getting stopped out at 830.50 on the ES hod just before end of day today!! Yep, that's me lmao. I shorted at 829.00 and I had my platform defaulted to a 6 tick stop when I entered.

I was stopped out a total of 3 times today at the exact reversal prices - - had I placed my stop just one stinking tick higher, I would have profited instead of taken losses on those positions.

Speaking only from my own perspective, today was an extremely nutzo day to day trade. I made a few bucks anyway - HA!

Stops get taken out for a number of reasons, but more often than not, it's because we place our stops improperly because we tend to base our stop locations on our entry - instead of the best stop location.

JMHO.

Steve
 
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