(: This 2020 US President Candidate wants to give everyone $1,000 / month :)

JSOP said:
The fundamental cause of people not being able to be independent and better themselves is not because they can't; it's because they don't give a crap. No matter how hard they try, they will NEVER have a chance; they will never be able to live. People are not going to be motivated to better themselves if they can't even live. Universal Basic Income solves that problem. Now they HAVE a chance. They are equal to everyone else, not beneath anybody anymore; they, just like everyone else IS able to live. But if they want to live better, they will have to make more efforts. So now being able to at least live a basic life, people would be able to think about bettering themselves. To me Universal Basic Income solves the problem of poverty through the cause, not really treating the symptoms because it actually makes people really want to make changes. Even if they don't, at least they would be independent because they have the means to do so now.

This is WHY Universal Basic Income needs to be implemented on a comprehensive scale, not just with a test sample population, no, it has to be implemented countrywide. EVERYBODY in the entire country having reached the age of majority would get the same amount of money from the government so EVERYBODY is on equal footing and everybody would be motivated.
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So many problems with what you've written ...

First, and get this out of the way, I know INTIMATELY what we're talking about here. I don't know how you grew up, but I grew up around subsidized housing, food stamps, school lunches, so this isn't some esoteric conversation for me, I know exactly what these kinds of "solutions" do to people. I've seen people in my everyday life who accept handouts, get free food, free housing, free health care, etc, and I know exactly how it affects them, the people around them, and the areas that they live in.

So ... that out of the way, you're SO WRONG imho when you say "No matter how hard they try, they will NEVER have a chance; they will never be able to live." .. that is such elitist urban thinking and SO MUCH THE PROBLEM that I don't even know where to start. In that one sentence you've said exactly what you think of poor people everywhere, you believe they can't make it on their own, you believe they are inept, are lazy, and god knows what.

I think if you are objective you will see that the people you are claiming to want to help are the very people who are voting against the ideas you are proposing. Why are they doing that, you think they're too stupid to know what's best for them ? Or could it be that they know exactly what is best for them and they think that handing out free stuff to people only causes their kids to have a poor work ethic, causes them to be dependent, lazy, etc, which are all character traits that their parents know will never help them in the long run ?

How would you feel if people in your family had gone around talking about how you could never make it, that you needed help to get ahead, that you wouldn't be able to do it on your own, that you didn't have the capabilities, and that you weren't smart enough to figure out a way to get ahead ? That you don't see that's exactly what you're telling other people with these solutions is .. astounding.

I was once chastised by a woman because I said "Have a nice weekend, driver" to a bus driver when I was getting off of a bus, she said ... how dare you call him driver and speak down to him in that way. I was like .. lady, I come from a long line of drivers, and that you think calling someone a driver is insulting says everything I need to know about you.

That's how I feel when I see you say "They are equal to everyone else, not beneath anybody anymore". Who in the world said poor folk WERE beneath anybody else ? You brought that to the conversation on your own, and again, that says everything I need to know about you and what you think about people who don't have that much money.
 
HeSaidSheSaid said:
his idea would cost around $2.3 trillion dollars / per year to pay for everyone from 18 to 64.
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US Government spending will be 4.5 trillion in 2020. So he just has to cut government spending by 50% and it can be funded.
(or he could borrow/print the money/get the Fed to buy 4.5 trillion of US government debt every year)
 
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JSOP said:
Universal income is actually a great idea.
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Great idea? STUPID IDEA!

Better idea.... GIVE NOBODY NOTHING... MAKE EVERYONE EARN THEIR OWN WAY*!!

*America was founded on the principle of "live your life as you choose without the government on your back"... and did NOT include "subsizing the lifestyle of the lazy, incompetent, parasitic and ne'er-do-wells at the expense of other citizens."
 
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It makes perfect sense in countries where the benefits system is too complex and corruption prone. People commenting are talking as if trillions aren't already spent on all kinds of shitty benefits and programs. Eliminate that and replace is with something that treats people as equal.
 
1. This will attract immigrants.
2. Democrats are known for their open border policy. More immigrants will flock in to enjoy the UBI.
3. The government has to increase their revenue to support the increasing UBI, most probably by increasing the taxes.
4. The rich and companies will start leaving the US.
5. Debt will skyrocket to a point of no return and it will collapse.
 
This is an idea closely related to the American, Libertarian Milton Friedman's suggestion of a negative income tax. All of these related ideas deserve to be debated and given consideration:

 
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eves_banished_children said:
So many problems with what you've written ...

First, and get this out of the way, I know INTIMATELY what we're talking about here. I don't know how you grew up, but I grew up around subsidized housing, food stamps, school lunches, so this isn't some esoteric conversation for me, I know exactly what these kinds of "solutions" do to people. I've seen people in my everyday life who accept handouts, get free food, free housing, free health care, etc, and I know exactly how it affects them, the people around them, and the areas that they live in.

So ... that out of the way, you're SO WRONG imho when you say "No matter how hard they try, they will NEVER have a chance; they will never be able to live." .. that is such elitist urban thinking and SO MUCH THE PROBLEM that I don't even know where to start. In that one sentence you've said exactly what you think of poor people everywhere, you believe they can't make it on their own, you believe they are inept, are lazy, and god knows what.

I think if you are objective you will see that the people you are claiming to want to help are the very people who are voting against the ideas you are proposing. Why are they doing that, you think they're too stupid to know what's best for them ? Or could it be that they know exactly what is best for them and they think that handing out free stuff to people only causes their kids to have a poor work ethic, causes them to be dependent, lazy, etc, which are all character traits that their parents know will never help them in the long run ?

How would you feel if people in your family had gone around talking about how you could never make it, that you needed help to get ahead, that you wouldn't be able to do it on your own, that you didn't have the capabilities, and that you weren't smart enough to figure out a way to get ahead ? That you don't see that's exactly what you're telling other people with these solutions is .. astounding.

I was once chastised by a woman because I said "Have a nice weekend, driver" to a bus driver when I was getting off of a bus, she said ... how dare you call him driver and speak down to him in that way. I was like .. lady, I come from a long line of drivers, and that you think calling someone a driver is insulting says everything I need to know about you.

That's how I feel when I see you say "They are equal to everyone else, not beneath anybody anymore". Who in the world said poor folk WERE beneath anybody else ? You brought that to the conversation on your own, and again, that says everything I need to know about you and what you think about people who don't have that much money.
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If they never had any FEELING of "beneath" anybody, then that's all the better; they would be even more motivated to go out and better themselves in whatever way under the Universal Basic Income where they are getting money with no strings attached when they were already motivated to better themselves under the current welfare system where they are getting handouts still but being forced to spend on whatever the government dictates. The Universal Basic Income is just the current welfare system, but simpler, more flexible and easier to execute.

The only people who would be displaced of course would be the governmental bureaucrats and changes must be hard for them.
 
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