There's something wrong with human nature.

[Free Thinker]

Quote from Rearden Metal:

[
Is there really any question that the imprisonment of harmless men and women by the hundreds of thousands for the 'criminal offense' of choosing to put prohibited substances in their own bodies (or helping others who wish to do so) will end up on the same history book page as all the other senseless persecutions listed above? [/B]

harmless? huffing is big with teenagers in my area. there have been two cases of impared teenagers killing innocent people while driving this year alone.
i dont want you out on my roads stoned. i dont want to happen to my neighborhood what happens when druggies take over. i want you locked up. just in case you think i am picking on your drug of choice i am not. i want drinkers locked up too. i support random traffic stops and never complain when i have to go through one.

if destroying yourself through drug use is your only goal in life why not move where its not illegal. arent there places where you are free to use?

 

[Walrus1322]

Quote from nitro:

Walrus1322,


I think I may have mis-represented myself. My line of reasoning above is aimed at a person who does not want to be cured from his addiction, and sees heroin use as ok. You may say, well, no such thing exists, and I agree, but my assumption is that it does exist in that post for the sake of that argument.


I cannot even imagine the horrible situation, the pain of just trying to exist. Thank God for people like you that help for those that want it.

Under no circumstance should my post be taken as endorsing or in any way saying that _I_ think it is ok to destroy yourself this way. I believe that if you are able to change your brain chemistry back so that you are not in need of drugs to be able to function, that should be your goal, imo.

I dont know RM very well, but I do know that Heroin addiction is difficult to escape. After awhile, u have to use so many bags to not get sick that the high becomes secondary.

Worse, addiction is often familial. I have entire families in treatment. The life of an addict is totally centered around their addiction, it took me quite some time to understand that.

777

I specifically mentioned Oxy because that is the pain meds that ultimately sends them my way. You are right in that not every pain med causes addiction in the same way, those with chronic back pain are the ones I see the most.

 

[OPTIONAL777]

Learning to live with chronic physical pain is most difficult.

There is a fine line between proper clinical medical treatment and self medicating to escape reality.

RM self medicates...

Quote from Walrus1322:

I dont know RM very well, but I do know that Heroin addiction is difficult to escape. After awhile, u have to use so many bags to not get sick that the high becomes secondary.

Worse, addiction is often familial. I have entire families in treatment. The life of an addict is totally centered around their addiction, it took me quite some time to understand that.

777

I specifically mentioned Oxy because that is the pain meds that ultimately sends them my way. You are right in that not every pain med causes addiction in the same way, those with chronic back pain are the ones I see the most.

 

[FeenixRizin]

The drug laws are fairly insane,...

Now, the big question is should we allow the taxman to get addicted to drug revenues?

The same group of people who push "The Lotto"?

I've done most drugs, (pre-1995), but then again, I don't blame anyone else or expect anyone else to pay for any problems I might encounter.

 

[peilthetraveler]

Ok...drug users can never see past themselves so let me explain why its illegal. Most people are not well off. Most live paycheck to paycheck. If they are using expensive drugs and they run out of money...you think they are just going to "wait until their next paycheck" when they need a fix? No...they are going to steal something from an upstanding citizen to pay for their fix. Yes, some people have means and can afford it and some people are poor and wont go out and rob people and will just wait till they get paid for their next fix, but you cant honestly expect the government to say something is legal for those types and not the others. Also why should upstanding citizens suffer because of someone elses drug habits?

Also, when you use drugs, you support violet drug cartels, terrorists, ect. So many people in colombia suffer because America has a cocaine problem. Upstanding people that are poor and can never get ahead in life because the drug cartels are there ruining their lives.

This is the point where the drug addicts say "well if it was legal it would put them out of business" Wrong! Look at medical marijuana. At first it was cheaper, but now its not. There was a side black market to the medical marijuana which made prices have to go up. Now its like 45 dollars per GRAM for it or over 1200 per oz.(in Oaksterdam) A poll was taken and 56% of people that buy pot illegally pay 250$ or less per oz for the good quality stuff. In columbia, it costs 30 dollars for half a pound so the chances that the blackmarket will ever go away is very little. No way can the government tax marijuana and undercut the dealers.

So high prices make addicts poorer and if they dont get their high, they get violent or they go out and steal.


This is why you "dont have a right to put whatever you want in your body" Because it affects too many other people to let you do it.

 

[Rearden Metal]

Quote from vhehn:

harmless? huffing is big with teenagers in my area. there have been two cases of impared teenagers killing innocent people while driving this year alone.
i dont want you out on my roads stoned. i dont want to happen to my neighborhood what happens when druggies take over. i want you locked up. just in case you think i am picking on your drug of choice i am not. i want drinkers locked up too. i support random traffic stops and never complain when i have to go through one.

if destroying yourself through drug use is your only goal in life why not move where its not illegal. arent there places where you are free to use?

...and this post encapsulates exactly what I mean when I say there's something seriously wrong with human nature.

Genuinely evil misanthropes like Offal777 are thankfully pretty rare, so their opinons are of no consequence.... but closed-minded (yet half decent) Myers-Briggs '<b>J</b>' types like Vhehn are all around us, are they're the ones writing all the rules and creating all the societal oppression.

Vhehn, do you even get the difference between us? If not, I'll just lay it out for you: I'm an atheist too, but I hardly ever go around missionizing for atheism the way you do. Reason being, I'm a 'P' (not a 'J'), so I'm therefore capable of seeing some inherent value in things that have absolutely no value to me personally.

Worshiping an imaginary friend in the sky would do absolutely nothing for me... <b>but just because something is worthless to <i>me</i>, doesn't make it completely worthless in general!</b> Religious superstition and ritualism provides many people with a sense of purpose, along with a nice warm blanket of belonging and comfort out of thin air. So who are we to go around shitting on their parade (or 'locking them up')?

You don't and can't understand why I feel the constant need to use opiates, but if all you 'J' people could just learn to live and let live for a change, this world could be a MUCH better place.

 

[Rearden Metal]

Quote from peilthetraveler:

Give the Invisible Hand a little time, and I guarantee you that pot prices in CA will absolutely plummet within the next couple years.

Up until last month, CA weed providers had to constantly worry about federal prohibition enforcement raids. Now that the legal risk of selling pot in some parts of the U.S. has significantly dropped, it won't be long at all before pot prices quickly follow suit. You don't see people robbing and stealing to afford their nicotine or alcohol fix, do you?

 

[Free Thinker]

Quote from Rearden Metal:

...and this post encapsulates exactly what I mean when I say there's something seriously wrong with human nature.

Genuinely evil misanthropes like Offal777 are thankfully pretty rare, so their opinons are of no consequence.... but closed-minded (yet half decent) Myers-Briggs '<b>J</b>' types like Vhehn are all around us, are they're the ones writing all the rules and creating all the societal oppression.

Vhehn, do you even get the difference between us? If not, I'll just lay it out for you: I'm an atheist too, but I hardly ever go around missionizing for atheism the way you do. Reason being, I'm a 'P' (not a 'J'), so I'm therefore capable of seeing some inherent value in things that have absolutely no value to me personally.

Worshiping an imaginary friend in the sky would do absolutely nothing for me... <b>but just because something is worthless to <i>me</i>, doesn't make it completely worthless in general!</b> Religious superstition and ritualism provides many people with a sense of purpose, along with a nice warm blanket of comfort out of thin air. So who are we to go around shitting on their parade (or 'locking them up')?

You don't and can't understand why I feel the constant need to use opiates, but if all you 'J' people could just learn to live and let live for a change, this world could be a MUCH better place.

rm. nice jump from you being a druggie to religion. let me make it clear to you.
I dont care why you feel the constant need to use opiates. you are welcome to live as you please. or die for that matter since that seems to be your what your end result will be, as long as you dont take innocents with you. its not that simple though because you cant go around stoned without hurting others.
i dont want you on my roads stoned. i dont want to have to pick up the pieces of your family, if you have one, after you destroy them with your habit. i dont want the crime that follows the drug trade around me. if there is a chance that your habit will hurt me or mine i want you locked up or cured. since you have shown no desire to be cured that only leaves incarceration as something that will get through to you. if that is what it takes so be it. can i make it any clearer for you?

 

[BernardRichards]

Quote from Rearden Metal:

...and this post encapsulates exactly what I mean when I say there's something seriously wrong with human nature.

Genuinely evil misanthropes like Offal777 are thankfully pretty rare, so their opinons are of no consequence.... but closed-minded (yet half decent) Myers-Briggs '<b>J</b>' types like Vhehn are all around us, are they're the ones writing all the rules and creating all the societal oppression.

Vhehn, do you even get the difference between us? If not, I'll just lay it out for you: I'm an atheist too, but I hardly ever go around missionizing for atheism the way you do. Reason being, I'm a 'P' (not a 'J'), so I'm therefore capable of seeing some inherent value in things that have absolutely no value to me personally.

Worshiping an imaginary friend in the sky would do absolutely nothing for me... <b>but just because something is worthless to <i>me</i>, doesn't make it completely worthless in general!</b> Religious superstition and ritualism provides many people with a sense of purpose, along with a nice warm blanket of belonging and comfort out of thin air. So who are we to go around shitting on their parade (or 'locking them up')?

You don't and can't understand why I feel the constant need to use opiates, but if all you 'J' people could just learn to live and let live for a change, this world could be a MUCH better place.

I am one of the 'C' people = Confused people Rearden Metal. What are P and J people?

I took Vicodin and Percoset on an ongoing basis for severe pain, and I can't understand either why you feel the constant need to use opiates.

The key thing here pointed out by my Pain Management Specialist was to take them for pain only and not for that nice oozy feeling of relaxation.

 

[BernardRichards]

Quote from Vhehn through Rearden Metal:



harmless? huffing is big with teenagers in my area. there have been two cases of impared teenagers killing innocent people while driving this year alone.
i dont want you out on my roads stoned. i dont want to happen to my neighborhood what happens when druggies take over. i want you locked up. just in case you think i am picking on your drug of choice i am not. i want drinkers locked up too. i support random traffic stops and never complain when i have to go through one.

And I want Deities of Atheism like Vhehn locked up and raped over and over again. Deities of Atheism like Hitler, Stalin, and Mao Tse-Tung are dangerous to humanity!